Biodiesel Prices and Expected Retail Markups - Page 3 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

BioBens · #31 12-30-2006, 04:11 PM

I make my own for $0.72/gal.

aklim · #32 12-30-2006, 08:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BioBens

I make my own for $0.72/gal.

Question is, what will you sell it for?

retx · #33 12-30-2006, 09:24 PM

Justin, I know of the store you talk to, and will keep them nameless as well. When I was there in August, I wondered the same question you are asking. So I asked the owner (the father) and he put it quite plainly, "sometimes its a pain to deal with and theres people who will pay". Thats basically his exact words. I kinda left there pretty down on it, wanting to think such a store would not do that. And then it hit me, the books they are selling can be found on amazon or barnes and noble for up to 5 bucks less. The eco-paint hes making is marked up more than anywhere i have seen. I think in this one stores case, the owner knows people in Austin will pay for it. Well maybe not you, but most people arent asking why. Tomorrow im driving leaving West Virginia heading to North Carolina, where there is a very nice bio community. I will check with them just to give you a "store to store" comparison.

aklim · #34 12-30-2006, 10:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by retx

So I asked the owner (the father) and he put it quite plainly, "sometimes its a pain to deal with and theres people who will pay". Thats basically his exact words. I kinda left there pretty down on it, wanting to think such a store would not do that. And then it hit me, the books they are selling can be found on amazon or barnes and noble for up to 5 bucks less. The eco-paint hes making is marked up more than anywhere i have seen. I think in this one stores case, the owner knows people in Austin will pay for it.

Of course it is a pain to deal with. Every item that they have is an additional pain to deal with. Why should they bother with dealing with a PITA for nothing? Just because some people want to push the biofuels doesn't mean that they should endure a PITA for nothing.

And yes, if people will pay more for them enduring a PITA, why not? We are capitalistic anyways. We charge what the market will bear. Don't you? If you are stupid enough to just dump your money, they will gladly take it. Like I said, I'll use biofuels IF they are competitively priced and not just pay out off my ass because they are biofuels. That is just like single item voters. They will vote for a candidate because of one issue and damn the rest. You know the old adage. A fool and his money are soon parted. You want me to use biofuels? Make it competitive and I will. If not, keep it. If I lose 30% of my mileage with E85, I must get at least a 35-40% break since I will have to fuel up more than if I use regular gas and my time is money. If they are the same mileage then the price must be the same.

JWJ · #35 12-31-2006, 12:40 AM

The North Carolina biodiesel co-op around the Triangle area has always sold their B100 for the same price - $3.50/gal. Regular diesel is around $2.60/gal today.

Ouch! It promotes people learning to make thier own fuel. The justification behind the price is the co-ops continued expansion of openning fueling stations. Plus they incorporated and openned thier own local industrial processing plant. They do a lot of biodiesel promotions like build your own processor classes, etc. You can hear about them encouraging local corporate use of biofuels/asking tough energy questions to the "energy companies" in the local media. They want people to realize where their energy/fuel comes from, its real cost, and how it effects the local economy. At $3.50/gal people ask, "Why?" It seems this is what they want people to do.

aklim · #36 12-31-2006, 12:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JWJ

At $3.50/gal people ask, "Why?" It seems this is what they want people to do.

I ask "What will it do (for my wallet) for $X more that the current stuff won't"

JWJ · #37 12-31-2006, 12:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aklim

I ask "What will it do (for my wallet) for $X more that the current stuff won't"

Of course this question should be asked. Their customers also ask other questions like, "Does it pollute?", "How does it effect national security?", "Who/where does the money paid go?", etc.

The co-op members ask more questions. Questions that are important to them.

patbob · #38 12-31-2006, 02:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Shorebilly

But since the Oil Companies own the Congress.....I doubt that there will be any requirements forthcoming...

Not from congress, but according to the auto QA section in today's (12/30/06) local paper, "In August 2006, Portland City Council established a citywide renewable fuels standard that requires all diesel sold within the city limits contain at least 5 percent biodiesel as of Aug. 15, 2007 .."

Apparently Congress can't do anything, but Portland, Oregon can figure out how.

Shorebilly · #39 12-31-2006, 07:15 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by patbob

Not from congress, but according to the auto QA section in today's (12/30/06) local paper, "In August 2006, Portland City Council established a citywide renewable fuels standard that requires all diesel sold within the city limits contain at least 5 percent biodiesel as of Aug. 15, 2007 .."

Apparently Congress can't do anything, but Portland, Oregon can figure out how.

If you can send me an e-mail address for the person who proposed this......I'll send them a thank you from WV......

In the meantime, I will pursue getting my personal bio-Diesel plant together and operation.....just for me, not for retail sale.....

Those of you who will not support the bio-Diesel "unless it's cheaper"......just wait.....we will eventually have fuel shortages like in the early '70's......and I just wish that those who are supporters and users today will be allowed to jump ahead of you in bio-Diesel line when petro-Diesel is scarce.....and expensive......

Just read the news, OPEC wants to cut oil production now....but is willing to wait until the spring after our winter is over......

Years ago, I moved out to Califunya......there was a proposition on the Ballot regarding Nuclear Power......the folks who opposed the Nuclear powerplants (for whatever reason) are the same folks who require electric toothbrushes to brush with......the attitude.....it's my right to use as much power as I want, and it's my right to insist that it be made elsewhere (Arizona, New Mexico, Nevada, etc) because any power plant will do something to my back yard that I don't like......so it serves y'all out there well, that today you pay thru the nose for electricity from Texas......and y'all have the gall to claim that you're being gouged in the wallet.....

Sorry, this topic has begun to grate upon my soapbox.....

Living sustainably, and getting better at it daily....

SB

aklim · #40 12-31-2006, 07:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JWJ

Of course this question should be asked. Their customers also ask other questions like, "Does it pollute?", "How does it effect national security?", "Who/where does the money paid go?", etc.

The co-op members ask more questions. Questions that are important to them.

And the co-op places take advantage of it and gouge them. Not sure if sheep like it but I sure don't like being fleeced.

JWJ · #41 12-31-2006, 07:45 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aklim

And the co-op places take advantage of it and gouge them. Not sure if sheep like it but I sure don't like being fleeced.

You are right.

But are you suggesting the organization you buy your fuel from isn't fleecing you?

Unless you're making your own fuel *you're getting fleeced*.

aklim · #42 12-31-2006, 07:54 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by JWJ

But are you suggesting the organization you buy your fuel from isn't fleecing you?

Unless you're making your own fuel *you're getting fleeced*.

Well, if I had to be fleeced, I'd rather be fleeced LESS, if you want to get technical. I don't like the idea that they are charging a premium for their stuff because there are people who care about a good cause AND will pay more.

Then I'd be fleeced. I'd have to go gather the stuff (my labor) , have a place to process it, the mess and all that, storage, processing (my labor again), etc, etc. Not to mention the potential threat of somebody getting spooked that I have a fuel storage tank that they think might explode and take the world with it. Diesel fuel here is actually a little over $2.00 when you consider that the rest is the road tax by the govt. If you used Biobens figure of 72 cents, you might save tops $1.50 a gal. Now, I have to figure in my labor and all that. So, I think it isn't economical at this time.

http://tonto.eia.doe.gov/oog/info/gdu/gasdiesel.asp

carusle · #43 01-01-2007, 12:13 PM

Don't attack the individual purchaser that does not want to pay an extra $1.00 per gallon. Don't accuse them of wanting to support foriegn governments and terriorism or wanting to destroy the environment. Attack the suppliers that want to gouge the purchaser. If they charged fair prices and made fair proffits more would be sold, thus accomplishing the goals.

aklim · #44 01-01-2007, 04:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carusle

If they charged fair prices and made fair proffits more would be sold, thus accomplishing the goals.

1. How do you define "fair"? Fair is very hard to define. It depends on who is viewing it.

2. What goals? Your goal may be this, that or the other but a company's goal is to make as much money as it can. If you want to set up a philanthropic organization to sell a product at cost to benefit a cause, go for it.

JWJ · #45 01-02-2007, 03:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by carusle

Don't attack the individual purchaser that does not want to pay an extra $1.00 per gallon. Don't accuse them of wanting to support foriegn governments and terriorism or wanting to destroy the environment. Attack the suppliers that want to gouge the purchaser. If they charged fair prices and made fair proffits more would be sold, thus accomplishing the goals.

All the suppliers are gouging the purchasers. This includes petro and bio diesel suppliers. OK, maybe not the petro Hugo Chavez sends for free - but all the stuff we pay for: yes.

If buying petro diesel supports foreign organizations that want to kill us - aren't purchasers supporting that organization financially?