Used ATF as alternative fuel? - Page 5 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

rwthomas1 · #61 03-18-2007, 07:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ltbordo

I'm about to run an old 240d on nothing but filtered waste ATF from a AAMCO franchise. The thing only cost me 400$ (plus about 200$ in repairs) so I don't have much to lose. I will install a combo filter/heater from love craft but that'll be the only modification to the car. I'll let you guys know how it goes.

john

Sounds like a good experiment. Filter the used ATF to 5 microns and you should be good to go. Look at it this way: He's got $600 into the car. I assume the fuel will be free or damned near it. If the car lasts two months then he broke even if you consider what the monthly payment would be on the most basic transportation. If it lasts a year, I am guessing it will do at least that, the car has paid for itself many times over. Go for it and let us know how it works out. RT

ltbordo · #62 03-20-2007, 02:45 AM

getting it from an AAMCO franchise, filtered down to 50 microns initially and then letting the love craft heated pre filter take it to 10 microns. It runs FAR better now than on diesel. I will take the good advice and thin it with a 10% blend of reg unleaded but that's it until either the injectors need cleaning or the IP itself needs rebuilding. My other mercedes gets a little more humane care.....but not too much more.

john in ATL

#63 03-20-2007, 03:18 AM

240Joe?

ltbordo · #64 03-20-2007, 03:21 AM

the only problem left is chasing down an air leak in the fuel system that leads to a warm hard start situation but the ATF seems to have cured it!
john

barry123400 · #65 03-20-2007, 01:52 PM

What is the base product in transmission fluid? It may not be as harmful as other bases. I am wondering about ring coking and nozzle build up particularily. Might be far less that wvo for example.

ltbordo · #66 05-12-2007, 12:04 PM

well, I've read all the posts

1) why run would you put anything but diesel in a luxury car?

these 1980 240ds and such are industrial strength, spartan, ex-taxicab workhorses so run whatever will save money without destroying them.

2) running used ATF without filtering? OBVIOUSLY you'd filter it before running it in your LAWNMOWER much less your daily driver. Running in through blue jeans would do a pretty good job in and of itself. When you look at a transmission pan, it looks a LOT cleaner than an oil pan anyway.

3)ATF has detergents and is a lighter oil than WVO and is a lot less messy to work with, clean up after, less corrosive to metal and rubber to boot!

I've been running filtered waste ATF for over 10K miles (NO problem with availability compared to WVO) with no heat exchanger/dual tank setup like I had when I ran WVO in my 300D and its been PERFECT.

I collect, gravity filter through thick denim, and I have a cleanable see through filter water seperator before the OEM secondary filter.

john in ATL running ATF vice WVO in a 240D

ltbordo · #67 05-12-2007, 12:24 PM

the original diesel (1893) engine ran on coal dust injected mechanically with compressed air ! These engines ran at EXTREMELY (~80rpm) to deal with this complex injection event. It took till the 20's when bosch invented a high speed inline injection pump (useable speed 0-2000 rpms) for automobile design (as opposed to steady speed generators, locomotives and marine tugboat engines ect). The M type inline IP in your 1980's vintage mercedes is the direct descendent (with higher injection pressure, an idle speed governer, and higher speed capabilities) of this monumental engineering breakthrough.

john

#68 05-12-2007, 02:27 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ltbordo

I've been running filtered waste ATF for over 10K miles (NO problem with availability compared to WVO) with no heat exchanger/dual tank setup like I had when I ran WVO in my 300D and its been PERFECT.

Please let us know what 240D parts you will have available for sale.

firemediceric · #69 05-12-2007, 03:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ltbordo

I've been running filtered waste ATF for over 10K miles (NO problem with availability compared to WVO) with no heat exchanger/dual tank setup like I had when I ran WVO in my 300D and its been PERFECT.

I collect, gravity filter through thick denim, and I have a cleanable see through filter water seperator before the OEM secondary filter.

john in ATL running ATF vice WVO in a 240D

John,
Are you thinnning the ATF with the 10% gasoline as you mentioned in an earlier post, or just running it straight without any fuel system mods?

Mark DiSilvestro · #70 05-13-2007, 12:27 AM

Well, on the subject of burning ATF in your diesel, a point was made in another thread that if by chance the authorities were to inspect the contents of your fuel tank, and find a red color, you could be in serious trouble for running untaxed, dyed fuel. The author stated, they wouldn't analyze the fuel for the origin of the red color as just the presence of red fuel would be enough for a conviction. And technically, any untaxed fuel, dyed or not, could be considered a violation. Awhile back, on a different thread, someone else posted a story about a couple of persons in England that were prosecuted under the tax regs for burning WVO.
This may be a remote possibility, but it's something to consider.
And, if enough diesel owners start experimenting with alternative fuels, I'm sure there are also some EPA regulations that would be enforced.

Happy Motoring, Mark

my123ca · #71 04-18-2011, 06:49 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ltbordo

I've been running filtered waste ATF for over 10K miles (NO problem with availability compared to WVO) with no heat exchanger/dual tank setup like I had when I ran WVO in my 300D and its been PERFECT.

I collect, gravity filter through thick denim, and I have a cleanable see through filter water seperator before the OEM secondary filter.

john in ATL running ATF vice WVO in a 240D

Your car still running?

ROLLGUY · #72 07-03-2011, 11:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by my123ca

Your car still running?

Just finished reading this whole thread. I ask the above question as well. I have been running WVO for years, but this WATF sounds interesting. I am interested in the pros/cons of running WATF, as I have an endless supply if I want it.

scottmcphee · #73 07-12-2011, 09:27 PM

1980 AMC Eagle Wagon Destined to be the most popular model and the only model available througout the entire production run. In 1980 its popularity was evident with the production of 25,807 units. Total Eagle 1980 Eagle Production: 45,379. In true AMC fashion this would become the highest production year.

Jangalls · #74 07-14-2011, 10:42 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by RichC

.
Hello All

This will be a very fun post to watch as it progresses

Lots of people have opinions.
Some people have facts.

Stupid people talk allot, and usually loudly.
People who understand will quietly explain.

Here is what I understand.

Used oils like: Automatic transmission fluid, vegetable oils, hydraulic oils, motor oils, will burn in a diesel engine.
The diesel engine was first made to run on oils that a farmer could produce himself.
There is no question there, they will burn.

Can there be problems ? Yes there can.

My personal experience...

I have poured used vegetable oil straight into my tank.
No filtering, no processing, nothing.
It ran. But I had to clean out and change the fuel filters a lot !
That meant the filters on the car worked.
Nothing got into the injectors and clogged them up.

I have burned, all of the oils mentioned except hydraulic oil ( I do not have a source ).
I filter everything to 1 micron now before it goes into the tank.

I have put thousands of miles on my old 81 300D using these oils.
Without an expensive ( kit ) or ( system ) sold by some people.
There is no second tank in my car, or auxiliary fuel heaters or filters.
Nothing, except stock parts.

So far, nothing has broken.
But there is always tomorrow.

A simple numbers game ....

My car gets about 20 miles per gallon on these oils. So that is the number I will use here.

Purchase price of my car = $810 (from eBay)
Purchase price of a gallon of diesel = $ 2.49
Number of miles I must drive on alternative fuels of offset the cost of the car = 6,506

Now lets do the numbers another way ...

Money saved / spent on fuels over the lifetime of a car.

100,000 miles = $ 12,450
200,000 miles = $ 24,900
300,000 miles = $ 37,350
400,000 miles = $ 49,800

Think of those numbers next time your at the pump !!!
And then add back in the purchase price of your car.

Average cost of a new Mercedes = $ 37,000 + fuel used (49,800) = $ 86,800

Are our vehicles really worth that much to us ???
And this is only purchase price and fuel... add in tires, tune ups, repairs.

Other observations ...

Everything mechanical breaks down over time, despite how well you take care of it.
An injector pump will break sooner or later, despite your best fuel, or efforts.
Engines quit running, injectors get clogged, combustion chambers get coked up.
Things wear out, that is a fact.

The thing is, how much are you willing to pay for that fuel filter. $ 86,800.00 ????

And this does not include any of the other benefits of alternative fuels.
Or drawbacks of fossil fuels.
You get to decide what value you want to put on those questions.

Nobody really knows anything !!!
Nope, we dont, all we can do is try to be well informed and make good decisions.

And that is what I am trying to do here.
Give people the information they do not get from the oil companies, and others.

PS : I am looking forward to your responses and other posts.

Thank you, Love you All.
RichC

Great response!! Very helpful and insightful. Thanks!

RichC · #75 07-14-2011, 04:24 PM

Thank you.