City of Berkeley Bad Biodiesel Experience - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

Rich300TDMBZ · #1 10-02-2007, 07:11 PM

"But 18 months into the experience, trucks started breaking down. Fuel filters were clogged. fuel injectors gummed up and the engines blew."

http://www.insidebayarea.com/oaklandtribune/localnews/ci_7060754

I'm glad they're giving biodiesel a second change. I think the people maintaining the trucks that blew their engines should be given the boot! What do you think?

LUVMBDiesels · #2 10-02-2007, 07:35 PM

Were they really using refined biodiesel or just WVO? The issues they had sound like classic WVO problems to me.
I am glad they are giving it a second chance. Municipalities across the country are experimenting with Bio-D. In WV, they are gong to be running the school buses on 100% Bio-D starting this year...

jkoebel · #3 10-02-2007, 07:46 PM

Biodiesel itself is a strong solvent that'll gum up filters with the crap dislodged from the rest of the fuel system...

WVO, well, if they were running WVO and not ASTM BioD, there are of course reliability issues with those that have to be addressed.

chetwesley · #4 10-02-2007, 08:22 PM

"Engines blew" is a very "journalistic" term... What does that mean? There is nothing in biodiesel that could make an engine "blow" or "wear out."

I know a very tech savvy heavy machinery mechanic/instructor at the tech college here who swears by biodiesel... also there are many many people running (good, ATSM spec) biodiesel for many miles now and not experiencing any problems other than old fuel lines that weep and fuel filters that get clogged from the gunk it loosens up in old cars.

Journalists obviously don't understand the technical aspects of the stories they write, so they have to use very general terms, and thereby distort the story.

Jadavis · #5 10-02-2007, 08:36 PM

A very large part of the city's problems came from using old underground fuel tanks that had never been cleaned and had issues with water/condensation intrusion. The biodiesel "cleaned" the tanks and took the water with it...right into the tanks of the busses. They were warned before that the tanks were not suitable as is. They were warned once they started having problems. Maybe this time they will use new or at least clean tanks.

-Jim

probear · #6 10-03-2007, 11:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rich300TDMBZ

"But 18 months into the experience, trucks started breaking down. Fuel filters were clogged. fuel injectors gummed up and the engines blew."

http://www.insidebayarea.com/oaklandtribune/localnews/ci_7060754

I'm glad they're giving biodiesel a second change. I think the people maintaining the trucks that blew their engines should be given the boot! What do you think?

Read the article and something seems very amiss.....I would seriously question either their definition of 'Bio-Diesel' or the quality of the fuel that they were getting. The only issue that would result running B100 would be clogged fuel filters (resulting from getting the #2 crap out of the fuel system).
It sound like they were running WVO or a blend of some sort. The other possibility is something that happened here a while back. Seems the Bio-D supplier's fuel was not processed correctly resulting in a partial conversion. There was also talk that the fuel was a blend of BioD and WVO. Either way, you will get results similar to theirs.

I hope that this time their source has verifiable quality control. Also sounds like their mechanics have something to do with the problems as I've never heard the statement about Bio-D over 20% shortening engine life.

BioBens · #7 10-03-2007, 11:18 AM

IMO as a former daily newspaper reporter, that story is so full of ambiguities that the reporter and his/her editor should seek employment for which they're qualified.

G350DT · #8 10-03-2007, 01:03 PM

I heat my house on WVO it is a great use. I have a wood stove in the basement and I use that to keep a 100 gallon tank of WVO warm. With a small amount of work it was very easy to set up.
The valve is very close to the fuel jet so there is no need for bleeding with standard fuel oil at shut off. The heater starts on standard oil and switches over after 15 seconds.
Last year I went through 800 gallons of WVO, house was nice and warm, got rid of a lot of WVO for a few places around me and I saved a few $$$
I see WVO being used for heating a lot more pratical then for cars right now

C Sean Watts · #9 10-03-2007, 03:59 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BioBens

IMO as a former daily newspaper reporter, that story is so full of ambiguities that the reporter and his/her editor should seek employment for which they're qualified.

As the old saying goes, "Tell us what you really think." But honestly, I agree, "...bio-fuel...converted their vehicles."

Starting to smell...something like Lovecrap.

dwoloz · #10 10-03-2007, 05:29 PM

This article doesn't seem to line up...

I don't see how this could happen with properly reacted biodiesel. Sure it will dislodge all the crap in the tank but why doesn't the city do a pressure washing of the tanks before they're switched over to B100? Once the tanks are cleaned you are problem free for the rest of the vehicle's life.
I have no explanation as to why their injectors are going south, shouldn't happen on biodiesel unless the batch used wasn't reacted fully or wasn't filtered properly.

Jadavis · #11 10-03-2007, 06:16 PM

Storm water intrusion into the underground tanks.

cscmc1 · #12 10-03-2007, 06:29 PM

I have to agree -- that article is VERY poorly written. Several comments make little/no sense. I also don't see a link to leave a comment asking for clarification. Has anyone tried emailing the author for clarification? Might be interesting.

dieseldiehard · #13 10-03-2007, 07:07 PM

There is an Email link to the author.
I replied to him and cc'd the Berkeley City Manager, telling them of the Bio Fuel coop I am familiar where nearly all of the Mercedes diesel members who are using Bio Fuel have had no problems whatsoever, the small number of leaks that developed have been solved by use of modern Viton rubber hoses, and so on.
Maybe they will get the jist of it, but in reality I bet these people are just happy with the gross ignorance that is on all levels of society.

dieseldiehard · #14 10-04-2007, 01:47 PM

article writer used a bogus email as it bounced, so I found his website

http://www.dougoakley.com/

I'm resourceful and sent him an email to his Yahoo account, not going to let this lie until he is advised of his crappy writing. I think his photos are good but he should forget writing news articles