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  #1  
Old 02-05-2008, 02:07 PM
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My 190d 2.2 is a blank slate. What should i use for a 1 tank WVO conversion in MN?

Car is an 85 190d 2.2 OM601. Drives great, starts right up. New filter, glow plugs and relay in the mail. Now i want to convert it to veggie oil and am wondering what people have had success with in cold climates? I am in MN and it has gotten as low as -15 and winterized diesel + diesel 911 gelled up on me! But its been above 25 lately and i am itching to do my first wvo conversion! Here is my scenario:
I have plenty of garage space in a non insulated, non heated garage. When im out there wrenching, i have a 125,000 btu reddy heater (diesel/kero).
I also have some space in the utility room in the basement of the house that is heated.
My friend manages an oil change place and says i can have all the metal or plastic 55 gal drums i want (the whole shop is actually heated by the old oil they drain from cars! Really cool)
So i am wondering, what i should start out doing. So far i planned on getting a drum or two with some 2 micron socks and finding my wvo source. I will probably have to filter indoors during the winter.

Now with the car i was planning on getting some injector line heaters like this:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/single-injector-line-heater-kit-for-WVO-SVO-conversions_W0QQcmdZViewItemQQcategoryZ6763QQihZ003QQitemZ130195344400QQrdZ1QQsspagenameZWDVW
making my own HIH aluminum coolant heated hose lines with one of these:
http://cgi.ebay.com/NEW-5-Roof-Gutter-De-Icing-Cables-125-POWER-CORD-WVO_W0QQitemZ360019962813QQihZ023QQcategoryZ3188QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem
that i would zip tie to it and splice into the block heater's plug.

Do you think that would be sufficient for the winter weather? Ideally i would run 100% wvo, but i will probably have to settle for 50/50 in the winter. Do you think i will need a heated filter or any of that expensive crap?
Do the stick on heating pads for the fuel tank work well with our cars, or is it best to put an internal heating element in there?
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1993 2.6 (040) SportLinE 5-speed - Armed to the teeth w. roof rack/2x bike carriers/8x ski carriers/MB towing bumper
1993 2.6 (040) - deceased/reincarnated as a trailer.
1987 16v (702) - Now parting out(9/22/10)!!! - Email me your requests for 16v parts- Engine and full body kit avail!!
1987 300SDL (122)- For sale!

Last edited by chuni959; 02-05-2008 at 03:38 PM.
  #2  
Old 02-05-2008, 03:34 PM
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Are you seriously considering a 1 tank system for Minnesota?

Dear Christ in Heaven. That is not a good idea. You will kill that lovely car. You must go two tank. Frybrid, Greasecar (modified heavily) or PlantDrive.

Good luck to you, please don't singletank that car in MN.
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1995 Suburban diesel, frybrid kit. 20k on veg, runs great.

Future mods, Frybrid WVO.
  #3  
Old 02-05-2008, 03:36 PM
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If I ever moved back to the arctic regions like N Wis where I came from, I wouldn't even think of one tank system, like I run around on down here south of Miami. I would have two tank system with heat starting with fuel tank pickup to HoH, less apt to leak into coolant versus HiH. Flat plate heat exchanger, more plates the better before going to heated fuel filter, everything well insulated. Injection line heaters a must, block heaters, I like the kind that circulates water versus the freeze plug or oil dipstick type, I might even have a heating pad on oil pan. More heat the better. I might even have a heat exchanger on return line to tank.
  #4  
Old 02-05-2008, 03:37 PM
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hahah wellll i thought if i went overkill with the fuel line heaters (always heated when the block heater is plugged in) that i would be able to pull off the single tank! Anyways, my secondary plan was to use a small under hood tank of diesel to get the car to operating temp and then have a switchover valve. But i was thinking SMALL as in like the SLS resivoir bottle (.75 gal or so) from a 16v in there for pure diesel. Think thats a better idea?
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1993 2.6 (040) SportLinE 5-speed - Armed to the teeth w. roof rack/2x bike carriers/8x ski carriers/MB towing bumper
1993 2.6 (040) - deceased/reincarnated as a trailer.
1987 16v (702) - Now parting out(9/22/10)!!! - Email me your requests for 16v parts- Engine and full body kit avail!!
1987 300SDL (122)- For sale!
  #5  
Old 02-05-2008, 03:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Charles_B View Post
If I ever moved back to the arctic regions like N Wis where I came from, I wouldn't even think of one tank system, like I run around on down here south of Miami. I would have two tank system with heat starting with fuel tank pickup to HoH, less apt to leak into coolant versus HiH. Flat plate heat exchanger, more plates the better before going to heated fuel filter, everything well insulated. Injection line heaters a must, block heaters, I like the kind that circulates water versus the freeze plug or oil dipstick type, I might even have a heating pad on oil pan. More heat the better. I might even have a heat exchanger on return line to tank.
i know what your talking about with the coolant circulating block heaters! When i picked up my 2nd 190d parts car, i hear this PSHHH when i plug it in! I was so confused for awhile, but then i deducted that it must be circulating warm coolant in the block. Would it be possible to retrofit one of these to circulate warm coolant across the fuel lines when the car is off?
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1993 2.6 (040) SportLinE 5-speed - Armed to the teeth w. roof rack/2x bike carriers/8x ski carriers/MB towing bumper
1993 2.6 (040) - deceased/reincarnated as a trailer.
1987 16v (702) - Now parting out(9/22/10)!!! - Email me your requests for 16v parts- Engine and full body kit avail!!
1987 300SDL (122)- For sale!
  #6  
Old 02-05-2008, 03:41 PM
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You are in a climate where using veg oil in general is not feasible about 80% of the year....not to mention running veg oil in general can ruin your engine.

The 190d 2.2 is already a very fuel efficient reliable car, why wreck it? Treat it right and run dino diesel only....and it will reward you with many more miles of faithful service.

Unless you are driving 40+ continuous miles each day each way, it will not work, because at those temps it will take forever and a half to heat the oil properly before you could even use it. With that tiny little 4 cylinder it'd probably take you 20 freeway miles on diesel just to get the veg oil to the right temperature in a heavily heated TWO tank system. One tank is out of the question....it will wreck your car. Cost of a two tank system is significant and its a lot of work to install. I'd re-consider before doing anything you'd regret.
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'89 420SEL 168k - mine (OC-170,000)
'93 190D 2.2 - 223k - mine (OC-222,700)
'01 E320 Wagon - 149k - mine (OC-154,000)
'05 C240 4matic Wagon - 153k - wifes (OC-154,500)
'01 E320 - 162k - Dad's (OC-163,500)
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  #7  
Old 02-05-2008, 03:49 PM
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oh weak
well so much for that idea! Maybe an alternative would be to beef up my filters and once the car is warm, toss 50% veggie oil into the stock system before long trips?
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1993 2.6 (040) SportLinE 5-speed - Armed to the teeth w. roof rack/2x bike carriers/8x ski carriers/MB towing bumper
1993 2.6 (040) - deceased/reincarnated as a trailer.
1987 16v (702) - Now parting out(9/22/10)!!! - Email me your requests for 16v parts- Engine and full body kit avail!!
1987 300SDL (122)- For sale!
  #8  
Old 02-05-2008, 03:50 PM
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If you really want to run WVO in that climate, turn it into Biodiesel first and expect that you won't be able to run it year-round. A processor will be much cheaper than a conversion that'll actually work in MN.

Also, don't think you can just get away with heating the fuel tank - if anything goes wrong, you're going to end up with a car on fire.
  #9  
Old 02-05-2008, 03:53 PM
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how about a big no on that

run biodiesel and keep it clean
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  #10  
Old 02-05-2008, 03:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chuni959 View Post
oh weak
well so much for that idea! Maybe an alternative would be to beef up my filters and once the car is warm, toss 50% veggie oil into the stock system before long trips?
That would do nothing but likely leave you at the side of the road and ruin your injectors or coke up the engine's piston rings.

You might be able to get away with a heavily filtered mix of diesel/WVO in the hottest of the summer months, but it will still do engine damage.

Just run diesel! Your car already gets 35+ mpg!
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-diesel is not just a fuel, its a way of life-
'89 420SEL 168k - mine (OC-170,000)
'93 190D 2.2 - 223k - mine (OC-222,700)
'01 E320 Wagon - 149k - mine (OC-154,000)
'05 C240 4matic Wagon - 153k - wifes (OC-154,500)
'01 E320 - 162k - Dad's (OC-163,500)
'07 E350 Wagon - 116k - dad's (OC-121,500)
'02 E320 - 193k - Brother's (OC - 192,000)
'09 E350 4matic Sedan - 84k - Brothers (OC-85,500)
  #11  
Old 02-05-2008, 03:59 PM
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In Minnesota, do a two-tank or (as the don suggested) biodiesel.

The primary problem of one-tank conversions is sufficient heat upon startup. Electric heaters will only go so far.

Let's imagine that you DID somehow manage to heat the oil to 140F right on startup: the engine itself it infinitely larger than the fuel being injected, and thus your fuel will be cold the instant it touches the cold engine.

Think about it. I am a proponent of veggie conversions, and in some climates a one-tank is reasonable. Ehemmm.... not in Minnesota.
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  #12  
Old 02-05-2008, 04:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by thesst View Post
Let's imagine that you DID somehow manage to heat the oil to 140F right on startup: the engine itself it infinitely larger than the fuel being injected, and thus your fuel will be cold the instant it touches the cold engine.

Think about it. I am a proponent of veggie conversions, and in some climates a one-tank is reasonable. Ehemmm.... not in Minnesota.
yeah im pretty much talked out of the one tank approach... Biodiesel gels up way earlier than diesel doesnt it?

And about your engine being cold point... isn't that what glow plugs are for?
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1993 2.6 (040) SportLinE 5-speed - Armed to the teeth w. roof rack/2x bike carriers/8x ski carriers/MB towing bumper
1993 2.6 (040) - deceased/reincarnated as a trailer.
1987 16v (702) - Now parting out(9/22/10)!!! - Email me your requests for 16v parts- Engine and full body kit avail!!
1987 300SDL (122)- For sale!
  #13  
Old 02-05-2008, 04:28 PM
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and i think you guys are a little confused about MN summers. They are usually 50-90 degrees
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1993 2.6 (040) SportLinE 5-speed - Armed to the teeth w. roof rack/2x bike carriers/8x ski carriers/MB towing bumper
1993 2.6 (040) - deceased/reincarnated as a trailer.
1987 16v (702) - Now parting out(9/22/10)!!! - Email me your requests for 16v parts- Engine and full body kit avail!!
1987 300SDL (122)- For sale!
  #14  
Old 02-05-2008, 04:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chuni959 View Post
and i think you guys are a little confused about MN summers. They are usually 50-90 degrees
Even more reason to not do it. Too risky.


Glow plugs are there to help ignite the fuel when the engine is first starting up, then they shut off. Starting on cold veg oil is a sure way to ruin glow plugs and other things (engine!)
__________________
-diesel is not just a fuel, its a way of life-
'89 420SEL 168k - mine (OC-170,000)
'93 190D 2.2 - 223k - mine (OC-222,700)
'01 E320 Wagon - 149k - mine (OC-154,000)
'05 C240 4matic Wagon - 153k - wifes (OC-154,500)
'01 E320 - 162k - Dad's (OC-163,500)
'07 E350 Wagon - 116k - dad's (OC-121,500)
'02 E320 - 193k - Brother's (OC - 192,000)
'09 E350 4matic Sedan - 84k - Brothers (OC-85,500)
  #15  
Old 02-05-2008, 04:48 PM
chuni959's Avatar
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well thats too bad. Maybe ill start small here and buy some cooking oil and make up a 1 gal test batch of B50 and leave it outside and see what happens
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1993 2.6 (040) SportLinE 5-speed - Armed to the teeth w. roof rack/2x bike carriers/8x ski carriers/MB towing bumper
1993 2.6 (040) - deceased/reincarnated as a trailer.
1987 16v (702) - Now parting out(9/22/10)!!! - Email me your requests for 16v parts- Engine and full body kit avail!!
1987 300SDL (122)- For sale!
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