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  #1  
Old 03-08-2017, 01:13 PM
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Stealing used veggie oil

Who steals my trash....

Police: Two Westchester Men Use Van To Steal Cooking Oil From Restaurants | Armonk Daily Voice
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  #2  
Old 03-17-2017, 02:40 PM
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This confuses me. I was under the impression that restaurant owners pay to have the stuff removed.

Is it cheaper if they have more of it to remove? Why does the owner care if someone steals WVO?
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  #3  
Old 03-17-2017, 03:04 PM
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Stuff in a dumpster / at the curb is still owned by the person that put it there until the trash company dumps it into the truck and mixes it with the other trash. This should also apply to oil.

The restaurant may or may not pay to have it taken away, I don't know the details.

I would think that the restaurant would need to account for oil entering and leaving the site to prove they are not dumping it down the drain / somewhere else. If the waste company comes up short, the restaurant might have a problem.
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  #4  
Old 03-17-2017, 05:55 PM
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Originally Posted by 97 SL320 View Post
Stuff in a dumpster / at the curb is still owned by the person that put it there until the trash company dumps it into the truck and mixes it with the other trash. This should also apply to oil.
The trash company owns the trash once it is dumped into its container. This is CA state law. Not sure about other states but would expect to be the same. I am not sure why the restaurant owner cares as the WVO is NOT his property anymore, unless he owns the dumpster. Dumpster is expensive and is normally provided by the recycling/trash company. This kind of prosecution happens but is few and far between. May be some bad blood between them, who knows.
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  #5  
Old 03-18-2017, 08:13 AM
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here in TN the rendering company got in tight with health department,bussines must use them to control rodents.The free ride was over years ago.
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  #6  
Old 03-18-2017, 09:46 AM
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Another aspect of this issue (unauthorized removal of waste) that is often overlooked is disposal tracking. It is the waste generator's responsibility to track certain types of waste and it's subsequent disposal. As an example, waste lubricating oil (atf, motor oil, etc) must be tracked. Failure to appropriately track (willful or accidental) is usually punishable by large fines. It's possible that cooking grease, waste veg oil, fryer oil etc could fall into this category in the complainant's jurisdiction. Heck, something as simple as burned out light bulbs fall into this category. If a firm is already tracking their waste and there is an anomaly in their waste stream disposal, they have to explain the loss. Lack of prosecution/police report can be viewed as complicity. If you are a big enough generator, the EPA (state or fed) is routinely auditing your paperwork. They don't take excuses (or common sense). They want paper.
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  #7  
Old 03-20-2017, 05:22 PM
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Originally Posted by 97 SL320 View Post
Stuff in a dumpster / at the curb is still owned by the person that put it there until the trash company dumps it into the truck and mixes it with the other trash.
If this is so how is it that we can we conduct warrantless searches for evidence among discarded items and have that evidence admitted into proceedings notwithstanding search and seizure objections by the prior owner. One's rights of possession and ownership are vitiated by the act of discard.
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Old 03-20-2017, 07:11 PM
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If this is so how is it that we can we conduct warrantless searches for evidence among discarded items and have that evidence admitted into proceedings notwithstanding search and seizure objections by the prior owner. One's rights of possession and ownership are vitiated by the act of discard.

United States Supreme Court
CALIFORNIA v. GREENWOOD, (1988)
No. 86-684
Argued: January 11, 1988 Decided: May 16, 1988

CALIFORNIA v. GREENWOOD | FindLaw


Not certain if this applies in this specific argument but the SCOTUS has made clear their is no expectation of privacy regarding the contents placed at the curb.

The argument in this case seems to focus on who owns the trash, in the case of the WVO the restaurant/generator does until it is conveyed to the disposal organization. The arrangement between the waist generator and the disposal organization would likely detail the ownership provisions and expectations.

I don't think anyone pays for disposal of WVO since the bio-diesel craze, nowadays the WVO is paid for by the collectors and resold to the bio-processors.
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  #9  
Old 03-20-2017, 08:19 PM
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The issue would be if the oil is considered trash a the curb or an item on the owners property regardless if the oil is considered trash.

That old non running mower you are going to get around to fixing some day is still your property until is it hits the curb on trash day.

If there was a propane tank on someones property and another person drained propane out of it, that would be considered theft. If a DEA agent came across what looked to be a propane tank and took a sample looking for ammonia with out a warrant, I doubt the evidence would stand.

The van with tanks reminds me of a story where they would park over gas station tank fill covers and pump out fuel.
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  #10  
Old 03-28-2017, 09:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BusterBoyBenz View Post
United States Supreme Court
CALIFORNIA v. GREENWOOD, (1988)
No. 86-684
Argued: January 11, 1988 Decided: May 16, 1988

CALIFORNIA v. GREENWOOD | FindLaw


Not certain if this applies in this specific argument but the SCOTUS has made clear their is no expectation of privacy regarding the contents placed at the curb.

The argument in this case seems to focus on who owns the trash, in the case of the WVO the restaurant/generator does until it is conveyed to the disposal organization. The arrangement between the waist generator and the disposal organization would likely detail the ownership provisions and expectations.

I don't think anyone pays for disposal of WVO since the bio-diesel craze, nowadays the WVO is paid for by the collectors and resold to the bio-processors.
There is a difference between 4th amendment expectations of privacy and ownership. Anybody can see what you have in plain view in your car and can see the bicycle on your lawn. That doesn't meant they can take it. Ownership of dumpster contents is a matter of contract between the dumpster user and the dumpster provider/emptier. It's unlikely anyone would be prosecuted for stealing garbage (you want your tax dollars spent on investigating thefts of garbage?), but the owner (whoever it is) might have grounds to sue the garbage thief for conversion.

If it was toxic waste, there might be other issues, but used veggie oil? Dumping it is probably just littering, so unless a whole mess of it was being stolen and dumped, it's unlikely the police would care.
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  #11  
Old 04-10-2017, 07:50 PM
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Before the biodiesel craze we used to do this a LOT. We had huge old tour buses that were always hungry for more WVO. We'd pull off the freeway into locations with a bunch of restaurants and fan out, checking all the dumpsters. Then we'd back the bus to within 50' of the dumpster, fire up a gas generator and a grease pump, and suck most of the grease out of their dumpster. We never asked permission. About half of the time, a manager would come outside, totally freaked out, because they thought we were putting stuff INTO their dumpster. When they saw we were pumping from it, they generally chilled out. They were, of course, amazed that we were running our ancient buses on their garbage.

Those were the days. It was a little bit Mad Max. It still goes on, but it's mostly locked dumpsters these days, except in really small towns.
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  #12  
Old 04-11-2017, 12:07 PM
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Let me guess. You were touring for concerts and festivals.
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  #13  
Old 04-11-2017, 12:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by okyoureabeast View Post
This confuses me. I was under the impression that restaurant owners pay to have the stuff removed.

Is it cheaper if they have more of it to remove? Why does the owner care if someone steals WVO?

Sort of depends on the state. In the Palmetto State, there's a .25 cents a gallon grant so this stuff has a value now. Not sure if the grant is still going strong or not. So, no longer a business expense in S.C., but something of value.


Also, how in the world would a person be able to enter private property and take something which the taker would argue is "trash"? Isn't there a trespass at kick-off time? So, you would have a trespass and a theft of property. Some of those dumpsters are pretty big so not sure what the cut-off is from misdemeanor theft vs. felony theft. Plus, I cannot imagine a perfectly spotless grease swipe. Who cleans up the mess? The thief?
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  #14  
Old 04-11-2017, 06:58 PM
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Originally Posted by C.Doner View Post
Let me guess. You were touring for concerts and festivals.

I'm thinking Dead Head , Renaissance Festival , Burning Man , Hippy , Commune , Will you please accept this flower as a token of our appreciation, would you like to join the Hare Krishna ?
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  #15  
Old 04-12-2017, 03:10 AM
wrench dropper
 
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No.

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Originally Posted by 97 SL320 View Post
I'm thinking Dead Head , Renaissance Festival , Burning Man , Hippy , Commune , Will you please accept this flower as a token of our appreciation, would you like to join the Hare Krishna ?
No, I've never been to any of those. I hate crowds, festivals and large parties. And religion. And the Grateful Dead.
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