Converting to SVO - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

#1 07-16-2002, 06:52 PM

Is there anyone that can share some concerns why I shouldnt convert to staright vegetable oil? I will be doing this on my 72 220D in a rebuilt motor!

Thanx

Mario S

surfblau · #2 07-17-2002, 12:11 PM

I am considering the same.

I got a quote from Elsbett for about $800 for their modification to the 617 engine. That is expensive, but I may go for it. I have seen the greasecar and a canadian site, but their solutions seem potentially less suited to the cars (plus I am not wild about adding a second tank to my wagon).

From my perspective (I am not superknowledgeable on this subject, just sortof reading a lot of web sites), but coking or sooting up the cylinder heads might be one concern. Injector fouling seems easy to fix yourself. On an old engine, you may just say - who cares. It all depends how much your rebuild cost.

later

#3 07-17-2002, 05:22 PM

I am thinking on following the "Greasel" diagrams how they designed it...my bigest concern is hot to design my veggie fuel tank that ill keep in the trunk...because it needs to have a coil inside. Anyways I will see what I can do I am only 20 so i dont have much experiance on welding and such

Let me know what you think the best way is?

Thanx

Mario S

surfblau · #4 07-17-2002, 05:38 PM

The whole concept for the greasel seems to me to have some short comings. For one, I thought that it said it preheats the fuel to 80 - 90 C, but at least in my 603 engine, there is a fuel preheater that goes from the fuel pump around the oil filter and back. Fuel flows through the loop between 8 and 25 C, above which fuel flows directly into the IP without heating.

In other words, it looks to me that pre-heating fuel, as long as it is flowing, is perhaps not needed. At least, that is the way the engine is designed. (since I am in northern cal, fuel gel is not really a problem).

I found a german website about a guy that uses SVO in a 60x series engine without modification. Maybe you have seen the same site?

I am thinking about running my current tank of fuel down to about 4 gallons and then adding a liter of canola without additive to the tank to see how it runs. In fact, I may try it tonight. That way, if everything heads south, at least I can dilute. I am not sure if I will tell my wife....she usually drives that car.

later

#5 07-17-2002, 10:48 PM

dont tell your wife you put her cooking oil in the car hahahaha

....and for that site that the guy is running the svo without any mods I havent seen it yet if you can send me link...I live in Canada ( Edmonton ) and it get's cold here so I couldnt go around the pre-heating the SVO I really want to do this on my Mercedes and use that car to drive around for free

I will read on some more and see what I can come up with as the best solution for me.

Thanx

Mario S

surfblau · #6 07-17-2002, 11:24 PM

So on my way home I dropped by the local CalaMart. They had wesson canola for $2.30 for 48oz- seemed like a good trial size. I mixed it with about 5gal of dino diesel in the tank already.

In the parking lot, with a smile on my face, in the tank it went. The hot idle shake that I have been living with (I will put new delivery valve seals in this weekend) TOTALLY DISAPPEARED.

It was nice to see my car idle at operating temperature just like it does cold.

I will look up that site when I am on the company clock tomorrow. Go canola...

alec

#7 07-18-2002, 02:08 AM

let me know if you have any problems starting in the moning.

Later...

Mario S

The Warden · #8 07-18-2002, 04:20 AM

Alec, was that on the 603 or the 617?

I'm basically in the same climate as you, so if you got that kinda results on the 617 by chance...I may have to give it a try.

I doubt my F-250's injector pump will like it very much, though...

surfblau · #9 07-18-2002, 12:02 PM

I told my wife- "Don't put any diesel in the car today, you have enough for your commute. If it feels like it is running on one cylinder, get over to a gas station and fill it up."

To which I got the reply - " What is a cylinder?".

It started same as always this morning, really easy. I let it idle 10 min before letting her go across the bay bridge. No leaks and running much smoother at cold idle too. The exhaust has a faint BBQ odor now, barely visible white smoke...

This is an interesting link

http://www.rerorust.de/

and a couple more
http://www.s-line.de/homepages/keppler/elsbett.htm
http://www.vwc.edu/~gnoe/salad_oil.html

I am going to experiment with my 617 for now. My 603 is leaking dino diesel all over the pavement whenever I stop. It seems like it is coming from the delivery valves. What a mess. I will change the o-rings and copper seals this weekend if my spline socket arrives.

I will post if there are any interesting developments over the next days.

alec

#10 07-18-2002, 02:12 PM

adding oil to diesel, either dino or veggie is the same as adding octane boost to gas. Will raise the cetane of the diesel. If you had added 48 oz of dino oil you would have had the same effect. I have seen the posts here by a guy in the UK who is running SVO without any mods. I guess if I lived where diesel was $4-5 a gallon I would use SVO as well. Here though because of price supports SVO would be about 5x the price of dino. Using waste oil and making bio-diesel is the only way to go for me, but it is nice to know if I was in a place with no diesel I could fill up at the local store with off the shelf crisco

McRoth · #11 07-19-2002, 01:08 PM

I've done a lot of research into SVO and IMHO the Greasel system or type of system is the way to go. It looks like you guys think you need some kind of special heater to heat the SVO, but you don't. You use engine coolant to heat it. You NEED two tanks, unless you live in the tropics where the oil NEVER solidifies or gets really thick. The reason is you need to start up and shut down on regular diesel or biodiesel to flush out the oil from the fuel system. If you don't then you will have solid or too thick oil in your fuel lines & pump. With the two tank system you don't switch to oil until your engine heats up, at which time your oil will be hot also. You have a hose-in-a-hose with coolant in the outer hose & oil in the inner hose to keep the oil hot on the way to the engine, that hose also carries coolant to the coils in your oil tank then another takes it back to the engine.
One of these days I'm planning on converting my 240D, but not till I have more spare time!

Ridge · #12 07-19-2002, 10:08 PM

Ever since buying the book "From Fryer to Fuel Tank" on geasecar.com, my son and I have been kicking around the use of used vegetable oil.

One of his ideas about circulating hot water to the second tank, was to use the automatic radiator in a manual tranny car so that you could use the lower radiator tank for the automatic tranny as a water source for heating the veggie oil in the second tank. By using this totally independant tank, you don't risk loosing all the cooling weater if the hose to the rear tank fails.

Further more the electric motor for the 300D and 300DT heater could act as the curcultaing pump and hangs very neatly down on the lower passenger side of the frame.

We've already made this pump relocation on our intercooler
conversion.

Using MBZ components already available and placing them neatly appeals to me very much.

Ben

andy · #13 07-21-2002, 05:53 PM

I'm going to try SVO soon. I live in Palm Springs, So I might as well take advantage of the natural preheater. It's been well over 110 lately. andy

#14 07-22-2002, 01:11 PM

I have been following the various discussions on burning waste veggie oil for a few months now and have also seen the diagrams at Greasel. Most everything seems to make sense, the only question I have is this - what do you do with the excess fuel that comes off the injectors and (under normal circumstances) gets returned to the fuel tank?
I know the supply fuel is separate lines and switched over w/ electric solenoid valves, so I would think that the return lines would need to be segregated also to make this concept work. I havn't figured that part out yet and from what I remember the Greasel site didn't address return lines on his diagrams.

#15 07-22-2002, 03:50 PM

the only thing that comes to mind is I would loop the return line to the heater coil of the intake lines so that the grease remains in the system.