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  #31  
Old 02-26-2004, 09:23 AM
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Now I see you said you tried "tube"units. Not sure what you mean by not having the internals. My bazooka has a built in amp, but I forget how powerful.
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  #32  
Old 02-26-2004, 09:56 AM
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Hi. What I was getting at is the relative size of the bazooka tube and its output, compared to the size of the Basslink or Kenwood. I tried a unit with, I think, 8" speakers, and wasn't impressed compared to the Kenwood. If you go up to a tube with 10" speakers (they have 1 active and 1 passive, right?) the sound improves, but the size gets bigger too. As to power, the Koss MSP8200 has '200W maximum' power, which might be 50W rms, who knows, but takes up the space of 3 Kenwoods. Let's not get into discussing sub enclosure design here, though. I'm just pointing out the space-to-bass merits of these compact units.
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  #33  
Old 02-26-2004, 10:21 AM
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No, I do not want to debate the merits of the designs either. I actually stayed away from the bazooka because of the size. Only reason I installed one in my 300D was because it came in another car and I hated it there.

Seriously, how does the Kenwood compare with the Infinity in terms of output? They are comparibly priced.
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  #34  
Old 02-26-2004, 11:39 AM
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Difficult for me to provide hard data there, because my Basslink is running along with 2 10" MTX subs and a 250W MTX amp, in a different car. Also, the power output of the Kenwood is stated at 50W/2ohms+50W/2ohms Maximum (dual voice coil drive), the Basslink is 200W RMS. So, based on the rated power output, the speaker sizes, and my subjective ear response, I'd say the Basslink is the winner of the SPL level competition, but the Kenwood gets the nod for the most sound out of the smallest 'box'. We're comparing the Kenwood with a 5 1/4" active woofer and a 6 1/2" passive radiator, to the Basslink's 10" driver and 10" passive radiator.
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  #35  
Old 02-26-2004, 12:52 PM
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The Kenwood just intrigures me, if it works in that it uses less power, is smaller and could be in the cabin, perhaps under a seat. That unit, in the cabin might be better than the Basslink in a trunk.

Why a Basslink together with the other subs? It seems to me it would be dwarfed. Don't want to beat this subject to death though. Just curious.
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  #36  
Old 02-26-2004, 01:41 PM
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I was off reading about the best placement for subs in a car, and the opinion of most is in the trunk, not in the 'cabin', but I haven't been able to find a clear explanation of why. I did try the Kenwood sitting on the package shelf, and it wasn't 1/2 as good as in the trunk. I think it's because the sound waves cancel each other out when the unit is in the same enclosed space as the listener.

Here's a link to a good study of mounting options in the trunk http://www.installer.com/tech/aiming.html

Well, on the idea of combining the Infinity with the 2 MTX's, it's still an experiment. I've had lots of back and forth with the car audiophile crowd on this. My theory is that if all three cones are moving together, as in 'in phase', I'll get more SPL since I'm moving more air. Combined, I'm running 450W RMS, no big deal really, with 3 10" active speakers and 1 passive radiator. All technobabble aside, it just sounds better, with more punch, with the Basslink than without.

Here's a link to my rod site, go to the sound system pages:
http://bryceandbernie.homestead.com/BrycesRodWebpage.html
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  #37  
Old 02-26-2004, 02:08 PM
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Great links. Great job on the street rod. I tip my hat to you. Would love to have the time and skill to do that someday.
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  #38  
Old 02-26-2004, 04:27 PM
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JHZR2 - Did you get the car back today, and how goes the install?
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  #39  
Old 02-26-2004, 07:35 PM
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I would suspect that the reason for all the suggestions of putting the sub in the trunk is because low end frequencies are non-directional.
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  #40  
Old 02-26-2004, 08:09 PM
mb123mercedes
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Don.

Cancellation only happens when the soundwaves
bounce back off of a surface and interfere
with the ones coming from the subwoofer.

Also an enclosure works best when securely
mounted to a solid surface(floor of the trunk)
This transfers the bass to the entire vehicle.

In some cases like the Bazooka it needs to
be corner loaded to achieve the best result.

Bass is like the ripples in a lake after you
chuck a pebble in it.
The ripples go in all directions.
Unlike a tweeter,which sound patern is narrow
and focused in a small area,like a flash light.
That is why you can mount a subwoofer in the
trunk and still hear/feel it inside the cabin.
The trunk usually amplifies the compressing
of the air(a subwoofer is basicly an airpump)
but sometimes some experimenting has to
be done to find the best mounting position.

It is a common misconception that bass is
only heard,it is also felt and creates richer
music.

In your case Don the rear glass most likely
caused the cancellation.
Or even the placement.

Louis.
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  #41  
Old 02-26-2004, 09:26 PM
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Thanks for the really well worded explanation Louis. I think it would be ideal to put the sub inside the cabin, but only if it is mounted properly to minimize cancellation by reflected waves, or absorbtion by upholstery. So, since this is usually impractical, they end up in the trunk, with as large an opening into the cabin as needed to let soundwaves through directly.
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  #42  
Old 02-27-2004, 12:29 AM
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Got the car back this evening... Will attempt to begin install tomorrow. I'm going to scout out mounting positions in the trunk and in the cabin, then start wiring it all up.

JMH
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  #43  
Old 02-27-2004, 11:58 PM
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Install complete

Finished the installation!

Started by wiring the speakers up. I was originally intending to leave the sub in the trunk, so I had full cabin space. But alas, as everyone has said, bass just doesnt get through the w123 trunk.
I wired the on/off to the antenna switch, and the power to the antenna constant, and tried turning it on and off at various situations, speeds, types of music. Besides on very bass heavy music, with the car off or at idle, there was no notiucable difference, and even in those situations, it was hard to tell if it was actually noticable or if it was my imagination.

So I decided to put it in the left rear footwell. I figure its sitting on the carpeting, and it wont really go anywhere, so I dont even have to drill holes. I left enough slack so that I could sit it in the middle of the rear seat if I had 4 passengers, or even pull it up on the rear parcel shelf if needs be

I decided that instead of stripping the antenna harness, I just attached the power right up to the battery. For the switched power, I got a $6 illuminated switch and wired it into the system from the wire I have for my CB and spare power outlet. Ground does go to the antenna grounding screw in the trunk, as that seemed the closest/most convenient.

All the wires hide nicely under the seats/carpets, and the sound from the rear footwell is really good. The kenwood unit puts out just enough bass to make a noticable improvement to the music, but it isnt sloppy or unclear. Its a great unit, wouldnt need it any bigger.

So Im happy. So long as I dont get any shorts or electrical problems.

Thanks for all the help!

JMH
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Own:
1981 240D (73K)
1982 300CD (162k)
1991 350SD (113k)
1998 Chevrolet S-10 ZR2 (62K)
2011 BMW 135i cv (14k)
2014 Honda Odyssey (6k)
2015 Honda Accord Hybrid (5k)
Had:
2008 VW Rabbit (70k)
2004 SAAB 9-3 (83k)
1991 BMW 318i (183K)
1983 300D (228K) (wrecked by at-fault uninsured driver)
1985 300D (233K) (now in FL)
1994 Acura Integra (188k) (Rusted out)
1992 Toyota 4Runner (72k) (Rusted out)
1990 Daihatsu Rocky (??) (No parts)
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  #44  
Old 02-29-2004, 11:01 PM
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where to put a sub

i faced a simular situation, I had a all plexi glass sub with a kicker solobaric and it slid around in the trunk so i took it out and had a custom trunk done with two rockford fosgate 12's fireing back, the rest of the trunk was all did so that the amps are sunk (above the tire, a rockford 800.2 and 400.4) and the sides were done, left side houses the clarion cd changer, right side houses the rockford digital cap and behind a pannel that pops off is a hidden vcr. to the guy that says you can't hear it, it is true with the benz trunk they are harder, perhaps you need more amp or speaker or both. mine pounds my ears off. i can find the pics and upload them if you'd like? good luck
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  #45  
Old 03-01-2004, 09:08 AM
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Still playing with location

Turns out the Infinity is capable of very good bass and the trunk of a Mercedes 126 seems to be far less air tight than a 123. I drove a lot this weekend and did a lot of tweaking to the point where I was able to achieve too much bass. I know some people believe there is no such thing as "too much", but I am simple after good clean bass which makes up for the rather smallish speakers that one can fit in the rear deck without major modifications.

Adjustments to the head unit are one of the keys. It helps to have a newer style head unit that understands subs and has adjustments to compensate for them.
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