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  #31  
Old 08-24-2004, 03:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by oldnavy
Be aware that there are a lot of BP/AMOCO stations advertizing the Premier (min 52 C) and Powerblend (min 48 C) fuels for sale, but tested fuel samples have proven they are sticking people. I had my source tested, cost $30 best I remember. Remember it only takes 2 of 5 requirements for it to be legal "primium" fuel.

I think the BP/AMOCO website gives a list of areas it's available or you can contact them for a list as I did a couple of years ago. We have one local AMOCO station that does not get it's fuel from AMOCO, but from independent jobber. His diesel is crud and I think he dumps used motor oil from his service bays in to the tanks on occasions.
Used motor oil in his tanks? Good grief.

I have two BP/AMOCO stations near me. I noticed about a month or two ago that one of the stations removed the 48 Cetane stickers from its pumps. The other station still has the 48 Cetane stickers. I inquired with the cashier at the station that removed the stickers, but she had no idea what I was asking.

What kind of fuel do you think I'm getting at these stations? They are really the only game in town. Everybody else around here who sells diesel, and that is not very many people, has 40 Cetane.
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  #32  
Old 08-24-2004, 03:24 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Carlton
I too like the extended drain intereval with the synthetic. I run Rotella T synthetic, at $13.00/ gallon, and I change it at 5K miles. Now, oldnavy, I have to disagree with attempting to go more than 8K with a 617 engine. I did that one time. I had the oil tested after that 8K run and, although the additive package was fine, the soot levels were definitely elevated. Since soot is an abrasive, it would be foolish to attempt to go 10K or more with any oil in a 617. The 616 is similar.

Since I feel the need to change every 5K due to soot levels, it does not make a whole lot of sense to purchase the better Group IV synthetics.
Some important points to keep in mind:

1) Every engine produces different amounts of soot. The only way to tell how much is to test YOUR engine. Don't attempt extended drains based on other people's data! My 603's make about 1% per 10kmi. My 617 makes about 1% in 2500 miles. Your engine type, driving habits (lead foot?), and conditions (stop & go?) affect this a lot.

2) Different engine oils can suspend different levels of soot. I believe Delvac-1300, Delo 400, Delvac-1, and Mobil-1 5W-40 can all suspend at least 4% soot. The other Mobil-1 varieties (of which 15W-50 is the preferred choice for MB's) can only suspend 2%! You need to change the oil before you reach that oil's soot limit.

3) Mercedes has recommended not exceeding 2% for MB diesel engines, especially for engines with hydraulic lifters. (That just means I should change my 603's oil at 20kmi/2% with Delvac-1, instead of the ~40kmi/4% which the oil is able to suspend.)

4) Side note on Group III synthetics. They appear to shear down more quickly and then the oil consumption increases, making them a poor choice for extended drains. They are probably OK for standard intervals like Brian is using. My Group IV/V oil lasts twice as long, which offsets the cost. BTW - the Rotella Syn is ~$14/gallon ($3.50/qt) at Wal-Mart, while the M-1 15W-50 is $19/5qt ($3.80/qt)... that convinced me to ditch the Group III stuff permanently, at least given that pricing!

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  #33  
Old 08-24-2004, 03:26 PM
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Oh yeah - here's the oil analysis results on my blue 87 300D, and my 84 300D (PDF files) :

http://www.meimann.com/docs/mercedes/oil_analysis_87b.pdf

http://www.meimann.com/docs/mercedes/oil_analysis_84s.pdf


I get the 'extended drain' test kit from Snider Petroleum in Sumner, WA and test at every oil change:
http://www.sniderpetroleum.com/oilanalysis.html
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  #34  
Old 08-24-2004, 03:46 PM
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Thanks Dave. That's very good info and a very convincing argument to switch from Rotella to Mobil 15-50. I see the results from the 603 are dramatically different than the 617. I'll be very interested to test this 603 to see if the results are similar.
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  #35  
Old 08-24-2004, 04:17 PM
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If you test your 603, I'm curious to hear the results as well. From the anecdotes I've read, in general most 60x engines produce less soot than most 61x engines. (There are always exceptions, but I mean in general, assuming similar conditions etc.) I'm not really sure WHY that is though, since the basic design is the same.

Side note: Engines with direct injection, like the Cummins, produce almost zero soot - but they are obnoxiously noisy. MB engineers chose indirect injection mostly because it's quiet, AFAIK, and decided that higher soot levels was an acceptable compromise for the decibel reduction.

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  #36  
Old 08-24-2004, 04:35 PM
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Red face It's a monster, Gadzooks

did I start this :GASP: :GAG: oil thread...
Oh, the shame, the horror, hmmm, the interesting information.

To answer an early valid question, there are no leaks.
"Baby blue", does not mark her spot.

I found one error on my part; the Rotella T is 15w-40.
Very surprised it makes that much difference in oil consumption.
The Mobile 1 15W-50 is in my trunk and goes in Saturday.
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  #37  
Old 08-24-2004, 04:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whunter
did I start this :GASP: :GAG: oil thread...
Oh, the shame, the horror, hmmm, the interesting information.
A POX on you sir, shame, shame.
:p :p :p
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  #38  
Old 08-24-2004, 05:29 PM
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I don't have a lot of knowledge of oils, but living in the heart of Wal Mart country with family members working for Wal Mart vendors, I would not doubt for one minute that the oil you get at Wally world could be of lower quality than the same labeled product elsewhere.
It works like this. When you get a contract to sell to Walmart, they have the right in the contract that you must provide the product for a decreasing amount of money. So every year you must sell them the product for less than you did the year before. Wal mart has the right to audit your books to find ways to cut costs.At first this benifits the producer, as it requires them to become more efficient. But eventually there is nothing left to cut, and you either go overseas for cheap labor, or go under. Wal Mart plays serious hardball.
If interested read up on what happened to Levi Strauss, Vlassic Pickle and others.
This is not intended as a political statement, or meant to start any flames. I think the truth is that Walmart vendors are under incredible pressure to cut costs, and if the product quality suffered I would not at all be surprised, and as consumers we should be careful.
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  #39  
Old 08-24-2004, 05:50 PM
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Aah, a neighbor from western AR or MO?
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  #40  
Old 08-24-2004, 05:56 PM
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Northwest Arkansas. Prairie Grove, not far from Fayetteville.
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  #41  
Old 08-24-2004, 05:59 PM
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Poplar Bluff, MO other corner about 20 miles nort of state line. Watch for a PM in a few minutes.
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  #42  
Old 08-24-2004, 07:23 PM
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Wal-Mart controls the world!
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  #43  
Old 08-24-2004, 07:32 PM
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Bruce is very correct. I am in school and we did an in depth case study last year on Wal-Mart and its effect on suppliers. While as mentioned it initially does increase efficieny, in the long run it usually kills the provider. Wasnt thier tag line a few years ago something like "buy American" or something similar? Well they are easily the biggest importers of Chinese made products. So much so that they have a significant affect on the GDP overall. It would not at all surprise me if their oil was of lower quality,just about everything else is
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  #44  
Old 08-24-2004, 08:53 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rdanz
Where did you get this info about Oil sold at Walmart being different? Dp you really believe that an oil company like Mobil,Shell, Chevron or any of the major brands would put lower quality oil in there premium containers that they sell to Walmart. Thats laughable.
At one time, Valvoline produced two oils (don't know if they still do). One for outlets such as Napa, etc. and one for Walmarts and cut rate places. Napa now has there own brand oil, but they use to carry the quality Valvoline. Another parts supplier here (White Bros./Autopro) use to carry both variants and give me the option of purchasing one or the other. Both Vavoline 10W40 All climate oil. Walmart also was the first to get the Cheap Fram filters. When this happened years ago, fram filters boxes had no English on them except the parts # and a small section while all the parts houses only carried the Higher quality Fram filters with boxes that were printed completely in English. Now, it seems the lower quality fram filters is all you can get. Walmart has this going on with everything from food to music CDs, to toys. Another thing that I saw start at walmart and now seems to have spread through the parts stores is premixed antifreeze. This has got to be the biggest ripoff out there. For the same price, you get 50% of the antifreeze you use to get, mixed with water. Walmart has a lot of control of their suppliers and can actually make (and sometimes break) a company.
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  #45  
Old 08-24-2004, 09:35 PM
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Rotella T

I have been using rotell t im my 1990 for as long a I rememeber, both sybthetic for winter and reg dino < yes I switch off with NO PROBS>

it is safe to say it has been used in my 1990 since about 1993 when it was the OLD sf/cc/cd or whatever

anyway I also use it in my 1992 since i purchaed it with 114k it now has
170k never burn a drop in either one.... seems like they find their own oil level i use 2 gals for each change althought the manual says 7.5 qts..

I love it and Yes I can get it at bj club or sams for dino at about 32 bux a case.. Dino synthetic about 18 i think maybe 14 cant remember.. I do see the mobil 1 5 qts there too but I am not required to use it since mine are older diesels..

had to put a timing chain in the 1992 right after i bought it but i will have no probs using rotella t for ever!!

www.shell.com has some interesting info on it..

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SOLD 1977 Jaguar XJ6 Coupe Antique Roadster 85K

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