Police-are they here to Serve or Harass the Diesel Motorist? - Page 6 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

Brian Carlton · #76 01-09-2005, 10:14 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aklim

Well, you were asking bout quotas so I thought I'd answer your question. Maybe I wasn't clear so let me try again. Why would I need to ticket you for going the limit? Because I need to get my qoutas so I can get a promotion or at least not look bad in front of my supervisor. Lets say that qoutas are ok, like you suggested. I am a cop that needs to meet the qouta. What is to stop me from ticketing you for going say 10 over even if you were going 5 under just to meet the number of tickets I need to hand in tonight? You argue it and who do you think the judge is going to believe? That you were goin under or that I said that you were 10 over? That is why I disagree with qoutas be it openly stated or hinted at. It would force the officer to ticket you or risk his job.

I was the only vehicle on the road unless you count the cars a quarter mile ahead or the ones way behind. So under those circumcisons, I would expect him to be exact.

No, I wouldn't have driven 100 miles to fight a ticket that I deserved. This was not a fair one. If I didn't fight it I would lose my licence for a while so I had to fight it. How did I get the justice I deserved? I had to fight like hell with a lawyer and be present in court, solicit a lawyer for 40 over. Sure, for my trouble it got to be 10 over. At 20 over, I wouldnt have to drive 100 miles there and 100 back and hire a lawyer. So yes, I am pissed about it.

I drove 10 over which was what I was pacing everyone ahead of me at. That area was a notorious speedtrap because suddenly it drops to 55 from 65 and many people get caught unawares. Still, I am not *****ing about that. I am *****ing about 40 over when it was 20 over. How would you feel if you were doing 10 over and got busted for 30 over and might have to lose your licence so you have to fight it even it is a long ways away?

My point to you was that there are more than enough people going 20 over so that there is no need to randomly pick on someone going the limit or 5 over for that matter. If the cop needs to meet a quota, there are sufficient law breakers out there.

With regard to your own situation, if he cited you for 40 over and he clearly could not have made a mistake with the chosen vehicle then you certainly have a right to be pissed about it. I'm not sure how common this is, however. It certainly does not occur around here, AFAIK.

aklim · #77 01-09-2005, 10:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brian Carlton

My point to you was that there are more than enough people going 20 over so that there is no need to randomly pick on someone going the limit or 5 over for that matter. If the cop needs to meet a quota, there are sufficient law breakers out there.

With regard to your own situation, if he cited you for 40 over and he clearly could not have made a mistake with the chosen vehicle then you certainly have a right to be pissed about it. I'm not sure how common this is, however. It certainly does not occur around here, AFAIK.

Around there, maybe. What I am trying to get at is this. What if the guy was short a few for whatever reason, dog died, mom drove over a cliff, etc, etc, etc, and decided to just pick a few people so he meets his qouta and can nap the rest of his shift? That is why they made it illegal so supposedly, there is nothign forcing the officer to write up people except for the fact that they broke the law. If you put pressure on the officer, he/she might just write up some people, whatever the case, when it is a slow day.

It happens everywhere, AFAIK. I suspect mostly accidental but sometime intentional so they can get a larger fish when it is time to go home.

rwthomas1 · #78 01-10-2005, 12:54 AM

Titan and any other PO on this board that thinks the same can just stick it where the sun don't shine IMHO. I have been witness to cops beating the crap out of people that didn't do a damned thing wrong. I have seen them using and selling steroids. I have seen them walk away from bar brawls they started while the others get arrested. I have seen them drive way too fast. I have seen them drive drunk. This is not BS and this is not "just a few instances". I used to work in bars. I used to go to a gym that was predominantly cops. I do a fair amount of shooting and you meet plenty of cops in that hobby. I still have LEO friends and even a few neighbors. Yes there are good cops, and I am sure the majority are BUT the reason I feel the way I do is YOU DON'T DO ANYTHING ABOUT YOUR COWORKERS THAT ARE CORRUPT! You just quietly let it happen and protect your "brothers" with that thin blue line everyone is so proud of. If I am seeing it then surely you are seeing it.

Regarding speed limits, around here they are set way too low. No one, including the cops, obeys them. There appears to be certain accepted allowable speeds on the local roads. You get to know them just from experience. Problem is when Officer Donut decides to pull you over you get written up for the full amount over the limit, not over the accepted limit. I don't condone reckless speeding such as what Brian Carlton is refering to in his posts, but the reckless speeders rarely seem to get ticketed. The cops just like to occasionally pull whoever they feel like and hand them a ticket. RT

Titan157 · #79 01-10-2005, 01:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aklim

So explain to me why that cop got fired then. And explain to me why they were able to qoute how many citations he issued to 2 decimal places and to compare it to other cops who took over that patrol. Yes, I know that the places you were at would look hard if you didn't have any paperwork for weeks on end. This is a case where he had tickets, just not as many as others. So, we know he was working because he had the tickets but got fired for not having as many as other officers. WHY?

You keep repeating that they are not legal. We all know that. However, as long as they are keeping track and have fired someone for it, how am I supposed to believe you or anyone that tells me that the number they write is not significant is some way?

Also, if most of the cops I meet have an attitude, what would you have me believe? That the next 1000 I meet are really nice people? Yes, my next door neighbour is a cop and while I have not met him professionally, he seems nice enough. However, 2 good cops is not enough to offset the fact that most of them I meet have an attitude when performing their jobs. I don;t mind that you write me a ticket. Just do your job and leave me alone. Don't try to show me what a big guy you can be. Is that too much to ask? Maybe you are a nice guy and will just do your job. Maybe your department is like that. I don't know. All I can rate it is based on the times I get pulled over and the number of those stops that turned into a demonstration of attitude.

Look, if everytime you bought a car with a 606 motor and the glow plugs were so stuck that it needed a head removal to get it out but everyone else is telling you how good they are, what would YOU believe?

AKLIM- You seem quite fixated on this one case you're referring to. I have no idea why the officer was fired. Did the agency specifically say that the officer didn't write enough tickets? You continue to beat the whole, "how did they have those numbers" thing into the ground. I thought I resolved that. It sounds like the agency keeps stats for officers. Many agencies do, I thought I said that before. I don't know about the case you're talking about all I can tell you is that at a majority of police agencies the officers are protected under civil service laws. This protection, unfortunately at times, makes getting rid of officers nearly impossible. I know of cases where officers have accidently shot and killed their partenrs while playing w/ a gun in a cruiser, been fired, and then had to hire them back. So I find it very hard to believe a officer would simply be fired for not writing enough tickets. I suspect there were probably much deeper issues involved.
I cannot tell you that there isn't some place where the number they write isn't significant. Some boss, who use to be a real road nazi may like a young road nazi in the making. Will that get the officer anything? Maybe. If the agency is governed by civil service rules the number of tickets written will have NOTHING TO DO W/ THE OFFICER BEING PROMOTED. Civil service exams are generic exams, and performance is not a factor. Unfortunately you could be a rather large $hit bag and just do good on the test and be promoted. Some agencies may have performance reviews as a factor, however, simply writing tickets is a very, very small part of a officers duties. It's the easy thing, albeit one of the most dangerous functions a officer does. Most agencies would not consider the fact that you're a really good ticket writer as some incredible factor that makes you especially desireable to promote.
In the end I don't care what you believe. I think it's too bad that you're so salty towards law enforcement after only having contact w/ them for traffic offenses. So the officers treated you had contact w/ treated you like krap for no reason, sorry, on behalf of all the good 5%'s.

Titan157 · #80 01-10-2005, 01:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rwthomas1

Titan and any other PO on this board that thinks the same can just stick it where the sun don't shine IMHO. I have been witness to cops beating the crap out of people that didn't do a damned thing wrong. I have seen them using and selling steroids. I have seen them walk away from bar brawls they started while the others get arrested. I have seen them drive way too fast. I have seen them drive drunk. This is not BS and this is not "just a few instances". I used to work in bars. I used to go to a gym that was predominantly cops. I do a fair amount of shooting and you meet plenty of cops in that hobby. I still have LEO friends and even a few neighbors. Yes there are good cops, and I am sure the majority are BUT the reason I feel the way I do is YOU DON'T DO ANYTHING ABOUT YOUR COWORKERS THAT ARE CORRUPT! You just quietly let it happen and protect your "brothers" with that thin blue line everyone is so proud of. If I am seeing it then surely you are seeing it.

Regarding speed limits, around here they are set way too low. No one, including the cops, obeys them. There appears to be certain accepted allowable speeds on the local roads. You get to know them just from experience. Problem is when Officer Donut decides to pull you over you get written up for the full amount over the limit, not over the accepted limit. I don't condone reckless speeding such as what Brian Carlton is refering to in his posts, but the reckless speeders rarely seem to get ticketed. The cops just like to occasionally pull whoever they feel like and hand them a ticket. RT

I don't know what you think I think ?? that I should be sticking whre the sun doesn't shine? You don't know who I am or what I'm like, so don't accuse me of doing, or not doing anything. If I knew about officers committing the crimes you described I would have no problem with pursuing them criminally. I've never felt bad for some dumb cop who went to a bar and got arrested for being drunk and stupid, much less one using controlled substances. Good riddens. I haven't seen those things, if you have and did nothing about it you're wrong, and a coward, go talk tough to that department's administration, not me.

Tirebiter · #81 01-10-2005, 02:47 AM

I have found just the opposite to be true. Police are taught to notice the unusual. MBs, of all years and models, are as common as potatos in California. I kinda doubt that any of the police have it in for diesels per se.

Perhaps my age is protecting me somewhat.

Driving seven MPH over the posted speed limit in a MB and I'm never noticed.

Driving seven MPH over the posted speed limit in a Porsche, smothered in roll cages, sixteen inch wide tires and five point harnesses, and I am followed for miles to see if I get to ten MPH over. God I love cruise controls.

Driving seven MPH over the posted limit on a modified cafe racer gets me pulled over because under a full face helment, we all look like kids.

I drove a 1989 500SEL for seven years without licence plates or a valid operator's license without ever getting stopped.

boneheaddoctor · #82 01-10-2005, 08:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by aklim

Like it makes a difference if qoutas are illegal. As long as I don't tell you openly that I am disciplining you for qoutas and I trump up some other excuse I can get away with it. I can pick on you for other petty stuff till your numbers go up but everyone will be fine since I am not disciplining you for not getting enough busts.

Exactly....to nail them for that you HAVE to be an insider.

And half these guys couldn't get jobs at McDonalds so where would they go....besides I bet they get their rocks off screwing innocent people.

Ever wonder what happened to the Bullies from High school? THey joined the Police force.

Carrameow · #83 01-10-2005, 08:44 AM

F ighting a ticket can be a pain in the a__, especially if you don't want to do it through a lawyer.
Does anyone know amateur law?
Twice I took the same landlord to Small Claims court when he wouldnt return my security deposit.
I also filed a motion on behalf of a family member in a divorce case that prevented the lawyers from taking the family home sale proceeds they were holding in escrow directly as their payment. The trick was to get it to a Judge, write it in the right format and not be scared of lawyers.
Fighting something like this can be done, but it would take a lot of work.
Plus, you can lose big and get points. I know this was a fishy ticket. And if you are smart (stupid?) enuff to play amateur lawyer and file motion after a motion to "paper" fight the case, you could eat up hours and hours of your time.
I dont think I was doing that speed (35 ) in a 20 mph zone, because a 300D is not a weak car, it just doesnt have the zip the new 6 cylinder 24 Valve DOHC's do. In my recollection, the cop car was sitting there and 2 seconds later he was behind me with shining lights, so how fast could I have been going?
Also I dont think Cape May has radar.
It would take like a whole week to case this out, because you would have to id the judge and prosecutor to get an idea of their chemistry and personality..and a lot of research on the Internet...and some luck, I guess..

I just dont think i was going that fast!

Pete Burton · #84 01-10-2005, 10:11 AM

Carrameow, when I feel like I didn't deserve a ticket, I do go in and contest it. As far as CT goes, I've always had a ticket reduced or thrown out. The last time was for a "rolling" stop, where the circumstances were IMHO questionable at best and the officer was pulling people over as fast as he could (notice I didn't use the word "quota") I had pictures and a fair explanation ready for the prosecutor. When I was called up I never got a chance to show anything. He started reading the file, muttering that the officer never sent in a detailed report along with the ticket. "there's no report, I nolle the case, you are free to go" Thus, I wouldn't go nuts in defending it, but do suggest you contest it. The points on insurance alone are more than worth it. My dad said that because my mom sent in a ticket their insurance rates went up and it cost him about $4000 total over a 3 year span. My dad is no moron, he has an economics degree from Dartmouth, and ran a successful insurance agency for 35 years. He's been president of the Professional Insurance Agents of CT, and written language for insurance legislation. If he could get stuck with extra rates, anyone could. The whole process can be rather arbitrary, so if you keep things in play until they fall more in your favor, you are better off. Good luck, I hope you get it dismissed!

Carrameow · #85 01-10-2005, 10:18 AM

An Economics degree from Dartmouth?
Dartmouth, where is dat school? Is that one of those on-line Internet schools located in the Caribbeen?

Seriously Pete, always did suspect you came from great Blood lines.
Thanks again..have a good day!

aklim · #86 01-10-2005, 10:48 AM

http://www.geocities.com/prohibition_us/quota1.html

http://www.motorists.com/ma/radar.html

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/articles/A48618-2004Aug7.html

There are many more links. Just google them.

rwthomas1 · #87 01-10-2005, 08:18 PM

Titan157,
Pull your head out. Oh yeah, I'm a coward 'cause I didn't report what I have seen to the correct authorities.... Actually I have. I have gone on record several times stating what happened in physical situations in and around drinking establishments. Didn't do diddly. What I had to say didn't wax with the LEO's version. They believed him (them) every time. Just like any other time a cops version of a story is questioned. Oh yeah, I'm real interested in sticking my neck out and ratting on a bunch of State and various town cops for things like substance abuse, DWI, etc. You think that they wouldn't figure out who I was and harass me for it? Pardon me, but I'll keep it below the radar. I have no interest in fighting a war I can't possibly win. RT

Old Charro · #88 01-10-2005, 09:59 PM

Carrameow, check your PM.

Andy

#89 01-26-2005, 05:10 AM

SOrry to dig up this post..but its the only place I can post it.

Here is the deal fellow diesel motorists...

I recently replaced my licence plate light bulbs (because the old ones worked real sporadically and the ends fell off the bulbs when I took them out. Anywho, last night my "favorite" police officer decides he finally got something to pin on me for driving around a lot at night (apparently the only calming activity I have anymore isn't a fav. of the fuzz).

He stuck me with a 153 dollar "Defective Equipment (License Light)" citation and I got a lecture about how I need to keep up my image and "keep a low profile" since I am a part of Search & Rescue (the other officer that talked to me is one that I have done personal SAR work for).

This particular police officer is quite a punk (I know his repuation) and he was drilling me about my ham radios in the car and asking if I had a camera. He also found it in himself to comment on how "boring" my life must be if I drive around this much. I told him I don't lead a particularly exciting life and he replied "I guess so!"

Anyway, my court date is 2-17-05 here 2 blocks away at the police station. Oddly enough my interview for dispatcher is before then. Hehe.

Do I just need to fix my lights (conductive grease I guess), have dad write up a R&R sheet and charge me 25 dollars and 2 bucks in new bulbs, and go to the court? I really haven't played this game before but I don't have 153 dollars laying around.

Anyone else think this violation is kinda bull****? This is the 2nd time this police officer has pulled me over. The first time I was reported "driving recklessly" and "fishtailing" in the gravel next to someones house in the construction zone. Not only was the road NOT closed (he seemed to like the idea that it was even though it wasn't), I was simply driving back and forth (about 3 times total) with some friends through a puddle (yeah...again...my life is sad

)

He pulled me over that night to "harass?" me and let me know that he was going to be out every night on night shift and didn't want me to "let this happen again." I am always nice to officers but this guy is sorta getting on my nerves lately. My explanation of how I wanted to keep my studded tires in good shape so why would I ruin them didn't seem to apphease him. Logic seems to escape this man...why would I come to the scene of my "reckless driving" 2 hours later in the middle of the night? You would think they would be MORE concered with the local jeeps/trucks that have been tearing up the local middle school's lawn (my lawn jobs are a thing of the past...these offroaders are just getting violently excessive).

I try to help out this police force and give them information I find out about such vandalism but it seems to go by the wayside when it comes to raping me on a loose light bulb.

They seem to think I follow them around town, hunt them down with my scanner, oogle, take pictures, rubberneck....

I drive around at night, happen to see them, and they decide to follow me wherever I go...no destination=he is up to no good even though they know I am a freaking sheriff office volunteer. I have been pulled over NUMEROUS times before but never cited as I wasn't doing anything illegal (not that I don't). I have had my fair share of unprofessional police officers, taking up massive amounts of time, play games, stopping me for reasons like "turning around in a closed school campus parking lot" or my favorite...exiting a parking lot??? I get calls into the PD about me walking around town at night, petting a cat, stopping to check on tires/adjust headlights, or (here is a zinger)...walking ACROSS the street from my house to my neighbors to drop something off and being attacked by the curfew enforcers...(they read my DOB wrong so I got off the hook...apparently I look "young" to them...with a beard, 6'6", and dressed respectfully.

Sorry to vent, I am just a little upset about being had like this tonight. I am all for professional clean cut good police officers but this follow me around town trying to scare me threaten me giving tickets for BS things is well....juvinile...

Hope I do not have to miss school for my court date (college is not cheap)...is this first one just to plea guilty or not guilty? Can the citation be excused? What would I do? Thanks.

boneheaddoctor · #90 01-26-2005, 08:34 AM

I got pulled over the sunday after thanksgiving adn accused of a reckless driving charge 77 in a 55 zone.........claims it was on radar.......keep in mind I was only going 55 at the time and 2 of 4 lanes were traveling faster than I was.........cop was a smart a$$ punk who walked with an attitude............well I took him to court.................

I had a witness.......my wife who stated to his attitude adn the fact she was watching my speedo at the time adn I was only going 55 and that traffic was too heavy to go 77 if I tried. Here is the tread Woo Hoo........sometimes the system works.

Sometimes these idiots with badges don't win..................the judge suspended the case as she doubted the cops version of the events.....those were her words not mine.

Only problem is that punk still has his badge and he is still harrassing the public.

That was the 4th radar ticket I have beaten...........and for the record I have almost never been guilty of what I have been charged with on radar. Only ONE time was I doing what I was accused of.....that cop was pleasant and friendly and I paid it without going to court. But a pleasant cop is rare....most have strong Sadistic tendencies.