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  #1  
Old 03-15-2005, 11:57 AM
R Leo's Avatar
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Wilting Passion Flower - sick 300TD

I knew this car was ill when I bought it. How bad, I didn't realize until yesterday when I started the 'Flower to move her to new spot and was greeted with an engine that barely idles until warm and alternately produces clouds of either blue-white or dense black smoke.

At start-up she idles smooth until the glow plugs cool off at which time you have to mash on the throttle to keep it idling. After a minute or two, the engine will idle but is very rough and there is substantial blue-white smoke. The smoke doesn't really smell like burining oil (skunk-ish) but, it's not exactly raw diesel either. Reving the engine thins out the blue smoke some (no longer opaque clouds) but, quickly moving the accelerator from no-load to full load will generate an inky black cloud of Biblical proportions.

Here's my ideas and the order in which I will attack this problem:
1) check valve adjustment
2) Check timing chain for excessive elongation
3) Check turbo for free spinning
4) Pull injectors and pop test
5) Compression test/ leak-down test


I'm open to suggestions too...

I'll post the results of my troubleshooting so that we all learn something.
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  #2  
Old 03-15-2005, 12:01 PM
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So you have JimmyL's TWIN ?
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  #3  
Old 03-15-2005, 12:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leathermang
So you have JimmyL's TWIN ?
...with the added 'turbo' factor.
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  #4  
Old 03-15-2005, 12:09 PM
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Well, I have plenty of room...
and you can pick up Rex's book next time you are out here...
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  #5  
Old 03-15-2005, 12:16 PM
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I think you are on the right track. Injection time and quality along with possible valve tightness which could affect compression
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  #6  
Old 03-15-2005, 12:27 PM
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Hi R Leo

I loved your tranny conversion thread.I plan on converting my newly atained 81 td turbo 190 k,after i figure out the low oil pressure at idle and rough idle issues.any way I wanted to tell you, I found 17, 300 turbo parts cars,all totaled bodies but alot of good engines. I think the guy collected to part out ,but he has to move them now and he's selling them in the few hundred range.6 td's , 5 sd's the rest are 300 d's except 1, 250 C.
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  #7  
Old 03-15-2005, 12:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by R Leo
At start-up she idles smooth until the glow plugs cool off at which time you have to mash on the throttle to keep it idling. After a minute or two, the engine will idle but is very rough and there is substantial blue-white smoke. The smoke doesn't really smell like burining oil (skunk-ish) but, it's not exactly raw diesel either. Reving the engine thins out the blue smoke some (no longer opaque clouds) but, quickly moving the accelerator from no-load to full load will generate an inky black cloud of Biblical proportions.

Here's my ideas and the order in which I will attack this problem:
1) check valve adjustment
2) Check timing chain for excessive elongation
3) Check turbo for free spinning
4) Pull injectors and pop test
5) Compression test/ leak-down test

I am assuming that this issue happened suddenly and that it did not gradually develop over time.

Accordingly, the timing chain is unlikely to be the culprit.

Furthermore, the turbo won't affect the capability to idle unless it is frozen.

The valve clearance couldn't be the issue if the problem developed overnight. More of a gradual degradation in performance that won't give you clouds of black smoke unless one of them is partially burned.

It could be an issue with an injector, but, to develop that much smoke would require it to be dumping fuel in some fashion, as if the tip has completely failed.

I'm taking a guess, of course, but compression would probably be the best indicator of what is going on here. Sounds like one cylinder has a serious problem.

Should be interesting, that's for sure.

The vehicle has the right man on the job. Tell Greg to come over and help.
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  #8  
Old 03-15-2005, 12:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Brian Carlton
I am assuming that this issue happened suddenly and that it did not gradually develop over time.
Thanx for the input!

Actually, I suspect that it has gradually become worse over time. However, that is something that I do not know the absolute answer for. I will ask Thing One next time we talk and find out how/when this all developed.

I recall Seth asking me what would cause the car to be 'cold natured' and hard to warm up when he was in Skag. I sent him a thermostat and he installed it up there. That was the last I heard of the issue until it arrived at Area 51. In his defense, it does act a lot like a gasser with a stuck choke or bad cold idle issues.

FWIW, this car saw a LOT of continuous highway miles (Oregon to Skagway to Oregon to SoCal and then to Tx) and virtually no city driving before I bought it and, it seems that that at highway speed, this problem would be hard to detect.
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Old 03-15-2005, 05:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leathermang
So you have JimmyL's TWIN ?
Oh the pain......
So, I could pull The Flash next to Passion Flower (that's for you Bill), which I think would give you such a quality trouble shooting environment! Smoking non-turbo meets smoking turbo.
Misery sure loves company! The flash is even road worthy now. Well, it's drivable, but worthy seems like the wrong adjective.
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Gone:
'95 E300 188K "Batmobile" Texas Unfriendly Black
'85 300TD 235K "The Wagon" Texas Friendly White
'80 240D 154K "China" Scar engine installed
'81 300TD 240K "Smash"
'80 240D 230K "The Squash"
'81 240D 293K"Scar" Rear ended harder than Elton John
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  #10  
Old 03-15-2005, 05:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by R Leo
IHere's my ideas and the order in which I will attack this problem:
1) check valve adjustment
2) Check timing chain for excessive elongation
3) Check turbo for free spinning
4) Pull injectors and pop test
5) Compression test/ leak-down test
You left out step number 6

6) Make offer to sell

I'd like to pickup a basketcase non rust 300TD...
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  #11  
Old 03-15-2005, 05:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by billrei
You left out step number 6

6) Make offer to sell

I'd like to pickup a basketcase non rust 300TD...
I could TOW it up to you with my running wagon. Har, har...

Actually, I'm keeping this one so I'll have an extra wagon motor in inventory if Marlene ever pukes. Meanwhile, it will work pretty well as a skeeter fogger.
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  #12  
Old 03-15-2005, 09:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by R Leo
I could TOW it up to you with my running wagon. Har, har...

Actually, I'm keeping this one so I'll have an extra wagon motor in inventory if Marlene ever pukes. Meanwhile, it will work pretty well as a skeeter fogger.
I'll take it without the motor. Storing a motor will take up a lot less space!
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  #13  
Old 03-15-2005, 09:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by billrei
I'll take it without the motor. Storing a motor will take up a lot less space!
If this transaction were to occur, would the name go with the car, or stay with the motor?
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'05 Acura TL 6MT
2001 ML430 My Spare

Gone:
'95 E300 188K "Batmobile" Texas Unfriendly Black
'85 300TD 235K "The Wagon" Texas Friendly White
'80 240D 154K "China" Scar engine installed
'81 300TD 240K "Smash"
'80 240D 230K "The Squash"
'81 240D 293K"Scar" Rear ended harder than Elton John
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  #14  
Old 03-15-2005, 10:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimmyL
If this transaction were to occur, would the name go with the car, or stay with the motor?
This is all academic coz, I'm not selling. However, if I were to sell a car to Bill, the name would have to convey and, he would have to refer to the car by it's name.
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