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#16
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no offense taken. It's your car and you should do whatever you wish with it. Good luck!
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'82 300SD - 361K mi - "Blue" "Good judgement comes from experience. Experience comes from bad judgement." listen, look, .........and duck. |
#17
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i put a K&N filter in my car about a year ago. i think i get about 2 mpg more on the highway. when i first measured that, my turbo didnt work, now it does. id imagine it whould be an even bigger difference now, if there is any. next time i take a road trip ill take a paper filter with me and compare for a more scientific test.
most people here say "those filters are for drag racing" or whatever, but all the race cars ive ever seen dont have filters on them at all! it generally seems like people here are very closed-minded about this kind of stuff, they like to be cautious and stick with the bigger filter, which is reasonable. when i took that paper filter out though, i noticed that it is very thick and very dense, and i cant imagine that air can get through there very easily. you said you dont like the oiled filters for diesels. if thats not what you mean by an "open air filter" what exactly do you have in mind?
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1991 300 D 2.5 Turbo, 220k also in the family: 1981 240 D 185k 1991 350 SD 185k 2006 S 500 2005 SLK 350 |
#18
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Not all open air filters are oiled. Here's a pic of the one on my truck. Baldwin Picrure . Notice the size. It's 11" tall x 8.5" diam and has a 4" opening in the end. I have seem comparison charts showing flow and filtration results between it and other popular filters and it wins hands down in both catagories. I would like to use this same filter onthe car, but I'm very limited on space and this one is to big. I've also seen reports stating that on some (maybe not all) turbo diesel engines that the turbo will actually suck the oil from the filter and into the turbo itself (not good).
Hey, what area of Houston are you in? I work in the Westchase district and live in Deer Park. |
#19
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I don't remember the exact part number. It is just a cone filter closed at one end. I mixed and matched tubing from my old setup with stuff I pulled from a federal parts car. I used a piece of PVC to reduce the diameter to fit the filter.
What is wrong with a little oil going into the turbo? I have my breather tube vented directly into the intake tube right before the turbo. There is oil bath inside the turbo bearings and your car burns oil, so what is wrong with that?
__________________
'85 300SD (formerly california emissions) '08 Chevy Tahoe '93 Ducati 900 SS '79 Kawasaki KZ 650 '86 Kawasaki KX 250 '88 Kawasaki KDX200 '71 Hodaka Ace 100 '72 Triumph T100R |
#20
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Quote:
my folks have a boat and its got a pair of CAT 3196's 660hp and it came from the factory with K&N filters right on the turbo inlet, and the filters are maintained under warranty by CAT certified techs. so how bad could these filters possibly be? those filters you posted are huge, so really they are the same filtration as the paper, but have a much larger surface area, that makes sense i live and work pretty much in the heights, to answer your last question
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1991 300 D 2.5 Turbo, 220k also in the family: 1981 240 D 185k 1991 350 SD 185k 2006 S 500 2005 SLK 350 |
#21
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Quote:
Well, the first thing I can think of is that as oil leaves the filter media, the more dirt particles can go though the system. I'm looking for a report about this. I'll post a link if I can find it. |
#22
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MY son did it
My son who still lives at home and whos car I drive when I can installed a K&N filter on his 1978 300sd against my advice after the change I noticed 2 things right off. It sounds great when the turbo kicks in and the engine compartment looks a lot better than it did. This SD was so much faster than any of the other 300sd or 300d turbo charged Mercedes we own or have owned it is hard to say if there was a gain in performance. With an odometer that is intermittent it is hard to track mileage. He has been running this filter for about a year with no known problems.
DHS |
#23
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Quote:
Here is a link to a fairly comprehensive test done by a guy on a duramax forum. Tests done on a real-live scientific test rig showed paper to flow nearly as well as oiled couch cushions and filter much better. http://www.dieselplace.com/forum/showthread.php?t=10372&highlight=air+filter+study
__________________
Keep everything as simple as possible-but no simpler--Albert Einstein |
#24
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The K&N style filter has been shown to increase silica levels in the crankcase oil through oil analysis. This means sand and grit is getting into the engines. You have to decide if the increase in crud and the possible decrease in engine life is acceptable or not. A larger paper filter is a good idea. www.airflowonline.com has some interesting filter options as well as parts that make plumbing a custom intake possible. Also try www.jagsthatrun.com for intake parts. RT
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When all else fails, vote from the rooftops! 84' Mercedes Benz 300D Anthracite/black, 171K 03' Volkswagen Jetta TDI blue/black, 93K 93' Chevrolet C2500HD ExCab 6.5TD, Two-tone blue, 252K |
#25
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for those of us that have them already, anyone have a link to a filter that will work just as well and fit?
I was going to throw in my opinion of it. since I added mine, I did not notice any performance gains (seat-of-the-pants meter). The only advantage of putting this in, is the sound. It adds more of a "growl" to your engine and you will hear the "fweeeee" of the turbo as well.
__________________
1980 500SE/AMG Euro 1981 500SEL Euro 1982 380SEL 1983 300TD 1983 500SEC/AMG Euro 1984 500SEC 1984 300TD Euro 1986 190E 2.3-16 1986 190E 2.3 1987 300D 1997 C36 AMG 2003 C320T 4matic past: 1969 280SE 4.5 | 1978 240D | 1978 300D | 1981 300SD | 1981 300SD | 1982 300CD | 1983 300CD | 1983 300SD | 1983 380SEC | 1984 300D | 1984 300D | 1984 300TD | 1984 500SEL | 1984 300SD | 1985 300D | 1986 300E | 1986 560SEL | 1986 560SEL/Carat | 1987 560SEC | 1991 300D 2.5 | 2006 R350 |
#26
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in my experiences with Ford diesels (6.9 Turbo), what needs to happen to have a good system is to try and get airflow from in front of the radiator and not from under the hood, you need to get the air intake temp as low as possible.
The other thing that needs to happen is that the exhaust needs to be openned up as well. It does no good to increase the air intake on any diesel engine if you can't pass that air on through. On my 86 F250 with the 6.9 and a Banks, just adding the K&N did nothing, but when I openned the stock exhaust up to a 5 inch system, that's when I noticed the results , turbo spooled up quicker, made more boost and I lost about 300 degrees of EGTs I see no reason the same principles would not apply to our MBs Think of a diesel as a giant air compressor, the more air you get in, the more air you get out, the more power you can produce. big jake
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85 300D, 210K (and adding 1K per week) 86 Ford F250 4X4, 6.9 International Diesel,Banks Turbo, 5 inch exhaust, rebuilt engine (70K miles) rebuilt C6 trans (about 12K miles), on board air system and locomotive horns 1957 English Ford Anglia Panel ( my retirement project) |
#27
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Yep, losing my muffler made a big difference. But I will stick with the stock air filter, as it gets air from in front of the radiator unlike a K&N conversion that gets it under the hood.
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'83 240D with 617.952 and 2.88 '01 VW Beetle TDI '05 Jeep Liberty CRD '89 Toyota 4x4, needs 2L-T '78 280Z with L28ET - 12.86@110 Oil Burner Kartel #35 http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b1...oD/bioclip.jpg |
#28
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Quote:
Johnhef: i dont know it the "seat-of-the-pants meter" works with diesels! if i can be convinced that there is no advantage to it, ill put the paper filter back in, and ill have to wait to do my road trip test to convince myself. it definately lets you hear the turbo, and i get a kick out of that every time.
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1991 300 D 2.5 Turbo, 220k also in the family: 1981 240 D 185k 1991 350 SD 185k 2006 S 500 2005 SLK 350 |
#29
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Here is a pic of my setup. Hopefully it comes across OK. I went this route after reading a bunch about it on this site. The filter is a K&N, if I remember right, PN #RU-1000. My setup also includes:
-- Junkyard intake elbow from a 220D. This elbow has a built-in bend and is also flexible, allowing the filter to angle away from the radiator/fan for more clearance and to move it away from the hot airflow coming out of the rad. It also has a handy port for the crankcase vent. -- I eliminated any oil separator with this setup. I was wary of this because I was afraid my oil consumption would increase. In fact it has DECREASED. This also eliminated a major oil leak I had under the car, which must have been coming from the oil separator drain tube. Lots less driveway mess now! I used hard plastic lines, also pulled from a 220D, to run the crankcase breather to the port on the 220D elbow. -- There is a short piece of 2.5" diam. aluminum pipe between the filter and the 220D elbow. This was to extend the filter out toward the front of the car more and also to serve as a mounting point for a brace that I might install later between filter and engine. But so far I see no need for that. -- You'll also see my Grainger boost control valve in there (the brass valve in the middle of the pic). I had been running only 8# of boost, probably due to a worn wastegate spring, but the valve allowed me to crank it back up to 12-13. Here is a good writeup on making your own: http://www.xmission.com/~dempsey/perform/grainger.htm I know about the concerns re K&N filters, and if I lived in a dusty area or drove dirt roads a lot I might do this differently. But I have a couple thousand miles on this setup so far and see no downside. On the other hand, these are the upsides: -- I can hear the turbo now. I like that. -- Eliminated the perpetually rattling stock air filter housing! -- Opened up the engine bay for better maintenance access, including more access for the boost controller. -- Reduced oil consumption and leaks! -- Better mpg, probably a 1-2 mpg increase on the hwy. -- Better throttle response. But this may be due mostly to replacing the rear muffler with a straight pipe, which I did shortly after the air filter mod. Not sure, but together these mods make a nice package IMHO!
__________________
'81 300TD turbo <<sold 12/05 to another diesel nut |
#30
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I would also add that if you do this you better already have a boost guage becasue you WILL need it to keep boost down to a safe level when you adjust it.
__________________
Proud owner of .... 1971 280SE W108 1979 300SD W116 1983 300D W123 1975 Ironhead Sportster chopper 1987 GMC 3/4 ton 4X4 Diesel 1989 Honda Civic (Heavily modified) --------------------- Section 609 MVAC Certified --------------------- "He who fights with monsters might take care lest he thereby become a monster. And if you gaze for long into an abyss, the abyss gazes also into you." - Friedrich Nietzsche |
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