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  #1  
Old 01-03-2001, 08:42 PM
Dr. G
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Well, I ambled down to a friendly mechanic this morn and tried to work with him on the difficult starting, no glow plug light problem using information I read here. Here is the problem: No glow plug light (although once or twice it was intermittent). Very hard starting (it is 20F here!). Block heater makes starting a breeze.

So I check the plugs: They were all drawing proper current.

So I put in a new relay. Tested the plugs - two of them were now not drawing current. I replaced all 5 plugs.

Plugs now draw current. Glow plug light lights. And the car starts.

(Will it start tomorrow when I leave at 5:30AM? Was the problem really the plugs?..or should I have kept the new relay?...)

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  #2  
Old 01-04-2001, 07:46 AM
LarryBible
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Dr. G,

I guess it's after 5:30 where you are, but my money says it started no problem.

Have a great day,
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  #3  
Old 01-04-2001, 08:56 AM
Dr. G
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It started

No problem starting in 20F weather...although I had block heater attached. Will try it tomorrow without the heater!
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  #4  
Old 01-14-2001, 09:18 PM
Dr. G
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It was the plugs

New glow plugs and the car starts great. I huess the new glow relay was not needed. The extension cords have been coiled up because the block heater is no longer needed. I guess the motto is when in doubt change the plugs first...

Thanks for your posts - they helped me.
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  #5  
Old 01-15-2001, 06:52 AM
LarryBible
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Dr. G,

That motto has kept my diesels starting for many years. Only recently have I experienced other problems which give me hard starting.

I don't know if your curiosity is still at work on this, but I'll tell you why I think the light did not come on. Although I think it best to replace all the plugs, you may have gotten by just replacing the number one plug. The way the relay measures to see if it's ready to start is measuring current draw on number one.

I think it's better to replace all five and keep the car easy to start. Starters are expensive for these cars, and a hard starting diesel will use up a starter in relatively short order.

I'm glad you're back in the world of easy starting.

Good luck,
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  #6  
Old 10-17-2001, 09:26 PM
Robert W. Roe's Avatar
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Location: Lehigh Valley PA
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I'm experiencing another intermittent electrical condition (these gremlins seem to follow me, but that's off-topic here): maybe one time out of three or four, when I turn my key to position two, my glow light won't light up at all. Other times it lights up fine, the car glows, and starts fine. The last time I had no light in position 2, I cranked until the car fired. Instead of a fraction of a second, it took three or four seconds of cranking, and there was lots of bluish-white smoke when it finally did kick over. I guess that just shows that the glowplugs really weren't doing anything.

Am I looking at glowplugs also? I want to get this fixed before PA winters strand me on a cold day. I always thought the glow relay signalled failure by flashing the glow light intermittently.
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1973 Olds 88, 1972 MB 280SE, 1978 Datsun 280Z, 1971 Ford T-Bird, 1972 Olds 88, 1983 Nissan Sentra, 1985 Sentra, 1973 230.6, 1990 Acura Integra, 1991 Volvo 940GLE wagon, 1983 300SD, 1984 300SD, 1995 Subaru Legacy L wagon, 2002 Mountaineer, 1991 300TE wagon, 2008 Murano, 2007 R320CDI 4Matic 52K, some Hyundai, 2008 BMW 535xi wagon, all gone... currently
2007 Honda Odyssey Touring, 2014 E350 4matic
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  #7  
Old 10-17-2001, 09:50 PM
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For the newer cars, a flashing glow plug light means a glowplug is out. No flashing and no light means at least two are out -- there may be a pattern to the # of flashes (my 220D has a glow element in the dash -- when it is orange, it starts when you pull the knob the rest of the way!).

They start slow without all the glowplugs. The new pencil type don't seem to last as long as the old filament type.

Peter
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1972 220D ?? miles
1988 300E 200,012
1987 300D Turbo killed 9/25/07, 275,000 miles
1985 Volvo 740 GLE Turobodiesel 218,000
1972 280 SE 4.5 165, 000 - It runs!
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  #8  
Old 10-17-2001, 11:13 PM
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How long???

How long do they last in general??

Thanks
Wolfgang
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1982 240D, 270K
1983 Ford F100, 260K
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  #9  
Old 10-18-2001, 08:05 PM
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Years. How many I don't know, but I had two bad ones on the Volvo when I did the injection pump about 4 years ago, and had to replace two again two years later, but I think that was because the relay was bad and the glow plugs stayed on all the time -- ran the battery flat on the road once, draws so much current that the alternator can't keep up with the headlights on!

Peter
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1972 220D ?? miles
1988 300E 200,012
1987 300D Turbo killed 9/25/07, 275,000 miles
1985 Volvo 740 GLE Turobodiesel 218,000
1972 280 SE 4.5 165, 000 - It runs!
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  #10  
Old 10-19-2001, 07:18 AM
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glow plug longevity

I put in 5 new ones two years ago, and had one go bad this year. Also, aside from total failure, glow plugs lose their ability to heat very fast and very hot over time. Being in Massachusetts, with cold winters, I put in new battery and new glow plugs every three years. If I do this, I can usually start the car even when outdoor temps are in the zero F range....maybe even at 10 below (???). I routinely use a block heater, but if I go up to New Hampshire in the mountains for an overnight, and wake up to 10 below, I will have real problems if my battery or glow plugs are marginal. (My car is 85 300D, pencil type glow plugs)

Mark
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  #11  
Old 10-19-2001, 07:25 AM
LarryBible
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Robert Roe,

I think you have a flaky ignition switch. They are not very expensive and not very difficult to change. If you don't want to change it without checking it, I would think that you could use an ohmmeter and turn it on and off and wiggle it to see if it makes contact every single time. Pull out the instrument cluster to gain access for the ohmmeter.

Good luck,
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  #12  
Old 10-19-2001, 07:28 AM
LarryBible
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woofi,

On your 240D with pin type glow plugs, if you drive it alot, I wouldn't be surprised if you had to replace them every couple of years.

I have driven many miles in the pin type glow plugged motors and found that when it starts giving trouble, replace them all and your troubles will go away.

Good luck,
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  #13  
Old 12-11-2001, 08:47 PM
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PROBLEM SOLVED

Well, a couple weeks ago I took my car into the shop to have them check my glow, or the lack thereof. They measured my glowplugs' resistance at .8 to .9 ohms, which they said was ok (although I thought .5 was the correct value).

Anyway, they couldn't replicate my problem, saying they got a glow every time, which is possible because it was raining, and I hadn't had the problem prior to a long (for PA anyway) drought. They kept the car for a second day, and still the thing glowed each time.
My mechanic (after some coaching; thanks to the experts in this thread for the suggestion about the ignition switch, and me telling them I still had 12 volts rather than 9-10 upon turning the key to position 2) went ahead and put in a used glowplug relay and only charged me $30 for the part.

OK, and more than that $$ in labor, but they also fixed my windshield washer O-rings which had cracked and made me lose all my washer fluid.

It's been almost two weeks and my SD has been glowing each and every time. Thanks for all the good info. Still waiting for my glowplugs to fail, after owning the car for 2 1/3 years +...
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1973 Olds 88, 1972 MB 280SE, 1978 Datsun 280Z, 1971 Ford T-Bird, 1972 Olds 88, 1983 Nissan Sentra, 1985 Sentra, 1973 230.6, 1990 Acura Integra, 1991 Volvo 940GLE wagon, 1983 300SD, 1984 300SD, 1995 Subaru Legacy L wagon, 2002 Mountaineer, 1991 300TE wagon, 2008 Murano, 2007 R320CDI 4Matic 52K, some Hyundai, 2008 BMW 535xi wagon, all gone... currently
2007 Honda Odyssey Touring, 2014 E350 4matic
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  #14  
Old 12-12-2001, 12:25 AM
fryerpowered
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Glow plug life

There are a lot of factors that will determine the life of glow plugs. For one just the brand alone! I haven't had to play with Mercedes glow plugs much. ( replaced two when I bought the 300D)
On my VW's it made a huge difference just by brand...I wouldn't buy ANYTHING that says "champion" on the box ever again. These are much cheaper than bosch, I guess that sums it up..cheaper! They lasted 3 months. The USED bosch plugs I put in to replace them have lasted over 2 years!

Rule 1) Buy OEM parts, or reasonable facimile thereof. i.e. bosch

Next, a bad injector can eat a glow plug farly quick. i.e. a poor spray pattern. ( a firehose pattern will eat away the tip) Or in the case of my "old style" in my 300D it could just make a hairline crack in #5 and render the rest inoperable!

Rule 2) If you are going through glow plugs faster than you think you should test, or if you don't have the equipt. have your injectors tested. Usually places like "diesel injection service" will test them for free, or in some cases a niminal fee of $5-10.

I must admit it would be nice to see my glow plug light without standing on my head and looking under the dash, one of these days I'm gonna put it back in the dash. Or get one of the kids with small hands to do it!

Gotta go , the bio-processor should be finished, time to shut off the mixer! ( I need to get a timer on that thing too)
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  #15  
Old 12-12-2001, 04:11 AM
David Oxland
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One of the simplest things that might appear and happened to me was that the big 80A fuse in the relay was not held down tightly.

The screws were finger tight giving a lot of resistance across their fastenings. A lot of resistance occurred here caused local heating and finally ruptured the fuse. Searching for the blown fuse revealed the finger tight contacts and a $1.00 fuse brought us back to normal. Just a possibility
David

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