Hey...

I was thinking of maybe purchasing another mercedes in the near future but this time it might be a 1995 320SL. I was wondering if any of you guys ever made the crossover from diesel to gas in the same mercedes family ? Is it actually worth doing it ? Are the gas models built like tanks as well ? Don't get me wrong, I still love the diesel but I'm a young buck that has new ideas every day.... you only live once so why drive the same car for a long time ?

Picture for people that don't know the car..These aren't even that bad and can be had for less than 20k.

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Audi TT

MB makes some of the best gas engines in the world.

Other then the fact that SL's are not cheap cars to own they are very very nice. The driveline on that car is the cheap part, I'd worry more about the rest of the car.

I think that would be a M104 I6. Other then head gaskets they are pretty hard to kill.

I'd buy an SL500 though. The M119 is a much better engine and I'd rather have 300hp under the hood of a sports car.

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1999 SL500
1969 280SE
2023 Ram 1500
2007 Tiara 3200

Right on with that, that engine like to have a new headgasket every 60K or so. Not a bad car, good luck paying the insurance if you are young...

I've got a few gas benzes myself, theyre not too bad. I like my pair of 560's though, its nice to punch the gas and actully have quick throttle response once in awhile

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1980 500SE/AMG Euro
1981 500SEL Euro
1982 380SEL
1983 300TD
1983 500SEC/AMG Euro
1984 500SEC
1984 300TD Euro
1986 190E 2.3-16
1986 190E 2.3
1987 300D
1997 C36 AMG
2003 C320T 4matic

past: 1969 280SE 4.5 | 1978 240D | 1978 300D | 1981 300SD | 1981 300SD | 1982 300CD | 1983 300CD | 1983 300SD | 1983 380SEC | 1984 300D | 1984 300D | 1984 300TD | 1984 500SEL | 1984 300SD | 1985 300D | 1986 300E | 1986 560SEL | 1986 560SEL/Carat | 1987 560SEC | 1991 300D 2.5 | 2006 R350

I've driven quite a few of both. The diesels are great and I started with them back in the days when most gas engines still had carburetors. Compared to a carbureted gas engine, a diesel Benz will outlast it by a wide margin. An injected gas car is a totally different matter. As far as engine longevity goes, the injected gas engine will last about as long as a diesel and if it is has the same number of cylinders it will usually be less expensive to repair/overhaul when the time comes.

As far as the 95 SL goes, it has an M104 engine which is a good engine. The head gasket reputation it has is a bad deal, but this does not mean that EVERY 104 engine will need a head gasket at a given mileage.

Good luck,

I've driven gas all my life till we got the diesel. So, to answer your question, I have one foot on each side of the line. I could go either way depending on what the use of the vehicle is. To be an in town commuter, I'd go gas. For long distance cruising, diesel

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01 Ford Excursion Powerstroke
99 E300 Turbodiesel
91 Vette with 383 motor
05 Polaris Sportsman 800 EFI
06 Polaris Sportsman 500 EFI
03 SeaDoo GTX SC Red
03 SeaDoo GTX SC Yellow
04 Tailgator 21 ft Toy Hauler
11 Harley Davidson 883 SuperLow

i have had lots of benzes. most have been diesels. i like the performance of the gas cars but in my mind i just always think of diesels as being a more quality motor. when i think of the gas engine equipped benzes... i just think "too bad the motor is inferior". at present i own three diesel mb and two gas.

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[SIGPIC] Diesel loving autocrossing grandpa Architect. 08 Dodge 3/4 ton with Cummins & six speed; I have had about 35 benzes. I have a 39 Studebaker Coupe Express pickup in which I have had installed a 617 turbo and a five speed manual.[SIGPIC]

..I also have a 427 Cobra replica with an aluminum chassis.

I feel the same as Walgamuth.

I feel that that Mercedes-Benz Diesel engines are far superior to their gas powered engines. In addition to being over-engineered, they seem to actually feel more durable in comparison to the gas MB's when behind the wheel. And in fact, my w123 has had ZERO problems due to faulty design other then a broken air filter bracket here and there, whereas the C280 has had a handfull of design and engineering realted faults on its near 200K mile life thus far....
From the head gasket and wiring harness, electrical problems (interior lights shorting out, instrument cluster gauges failing, "botched" speaker wiring faults), to less mechanical problems such as fit and finish issues.... rattles and creaks, interior panels not aligning etc etc....

I will say that despite these problems with my MB gasser, I LOVE the car to death!!!! And I would not want to, or prefer to drive any other make of gas powered car.....

My C280 is still a very teutonic feeling car when compared to other comparable cars of its time... and OVERALL quality while falling second to older MB models (mainly diesels), I feel is still far superior to other cars.....

Get yourself a gas Mercedes-Benz, roll with the few light punches it may give you, point that hood star in your direction of choice, and enjoy the rush of power accompanied by goosebumps that a gas MB can provide.

The diesel Mercedes Benz feels very well footed on long distance trips at 80MPH, and could run all day for the rest of your life if you keep it well maintained.

The gas Mercedes-Benz feels just as nice on the highway, and a little more well footed on the twisty backroads, yet seems to lack in engineering precision and elegance.



Happy Motoring.

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Nate

1995 E420
1992 BMW 525i
1984 300D Turbo sold
1993 Volvo 244 sold
1995 Volvo 944T R.I.P!


"The details are not details. They make the product."
-Charles Eames

www.cbs.nu

Got an '87 300E today for a pal. Only 126k on the ticker.

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I'm not a doctor, but I'll have a look.

'85 300SD 245k
'87 300SDL 251k
'90 300SEL 326k

Six others from BMW, GM, and Ford.

Liberty will not descend to a people; a people must raise themselves to liberty.[/IMG]

Your experience is anecdotal, not statistical. There are poor MB diesel engine designs just as there are poor MB gas engine designs. The worst diesel is probably the 350SDL that is known for bending rods. Also the aluminum head diesels have head gasket and warping problems just as much as the gas engine counterparts.

I sort of understand how one can feel that the diesel gives a more solid driving impression, but overall the gas engines are every bit as well built as the diesels. Maybe you would have to see them both apart to understand.

Have a great day,

I crossed over and only the CDI could bring me back!

I loved my diesels and enjoyed the reactions from my friends when I told them my car had 5 cylinders and no spark plugs!

But... I didn't realize until the diesels were gone how much SOOT they were leaving in my garage! WOW! what a difference! (No, I wasn't backing in!)

I don't miss the smell, nor the soot, but I sometimes miss the masculine sound the engines made, and the ability sometimes to 'smoke out' someone that was following me too closely.

Now, I'm in my second childhood with a 400E and a 500SL. While my Turbo Diesel would chirp the tires sometimes as it hopped in to second, I'd be doing burnouts all the time on my v8 cars if they didn't have this darned traction control thingy...

The gas engines are quite reliable. Just keep your timing chain guides in good repair!

Be aware that the 129 SL series has lots of little things to need attention as the car ages. Don't ever think that it would be as trouble-free as a 300D, but the engines are quite durable.

Good luck in your decision!

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02 S500
92 500SL
92 400E (Sold)
87 300E (Sold)
83 300D Turbo (Sold)
75 300D (Sold)
74 240D (Sold after 20 years)

Guys, when will you learn? Larry is always right.

The older diesels were certainly a bit more reliable and/or durable than their gasoline equivalents. Twenty years ago a diesel engine was much simpler than a gasoline engine - mechanical injection pump, no electronics (heck, no electricity required once it was running), little or no pollution equipment.

This ain't the case anymore. Modern diesels are every bit as complex as gasoline engines. As a result, they no longer have a reliability advantage. How many problems do you read about on this board for the OM606 vs. the M112? I see many more questions and issues with the diesel; I bet the gasoline engine outnumbers it 20:1 on the road and on this board.

To the original question, I've gone from all diesel to all gas. Do I regret it - no, not a bit. A modern gasoline engine certainly has advantages over an older diesel. It's smoother, quieter, has better power, and pollutes much less. (The M112 engine achieves ULEV status; it's exceptionally clean running.) Thanks to 20 years of engineering advances, a modern gasoline car delivers about the same fuel mileage as an older diesel. My 124 wagon with OM603 did 23 or 24 city, about 28 highway. My 210 wagon does 22 city, 28 highway, and it's about 50% more powerful.

Do I miss the diesels? Yeah, a bit. I rather liked the rumble and clatter when they fire up - you know it's a real machine! The gasoline cars are sterile in comparison.

- JimY

Sure, I have thought about venturing into gas but it will be extremely hard to give up that purring sound of contentment that a diesel makes.

I used to like the romp and stomp of gasoline, but now I am leaning more towards smooth acceleration and cruise. I drive in DFW traffic (company truck) for 4-5 hours a day and get really tired of all that swerving and slamming on the brakes all the time.

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Sam

84 300SD 350K+ miles ( Blue Belle )

My 560SL, even with 110K miles on it is still the smoothest running engine I have ever owned. It is only rivaled by an accura 6 cylinder, 24 valve 2.5L I had which was also a superb but much more complex engine.

The 560 idles like silk and accelerates (quickly and smoothly) to speeds I cannot, in good conscience, drive at for prolonged periods of time. I've never taken it to its limit or anything close but am sure it could get to 130MPH without even laboring. Sure, it only gets 15-17MPG but that is the price you pay for these big gassers. I am sure it will last as long as any diesel, but will have consumed twice as much fuel in its lifetime.

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Marty D.

2013 C300 4Matic
1984 BMW 733i
2013 Lincoln MKz

Gas engines pollute less? That is a subjective opinion. Diesels produce less CO2 but more particulates. Have you heard the latest that particulates slow global warning. Make your diesel soot with pride and who has a squeaky clean garage anyway.

There is no doubt that almost any petrol mercedes will out perform and be more fun to drive than a diesel with the exception of then the new cdi diesels. With modern diesels becoming more electronic driven you loose the simple mechanical elements of the old diesels. Larry's analysis sounds right. For longevity, long freeway commutes and do it yourselfers late 70's and early 80's diesels are a great bet. If you love instant acceleration or primarily drive on stop and go roads a gasser is probably for you.

Bottom line always buy a car based on your goals. I bought my 300SD to eat miles and use veggie. I have driven it for a year on diesel. However I am finally getting around to my veggie. Now I have read these groups I would probably be willing to buy a muscular mercedes gasser if fuel was cheap.

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My Daily : 96 E-300 Diesel with 195,000 miles
Retired: 92 300D 2.5 T 345K miles and for sale
Retired: 95 E320 157K miles and currently parked with blown engine

Both retired cars are for sale as is my w124 shop inventory

Sure, it would be nice to be able to get off the line a little bit quicker now and then, but how could you drive around a car that doesn't purr like the old diesels?
Advantages you'll be losing:
1. The diesel cycle is more efficient (heat/energy transfer) than the otto (gasoline) cycle by a great deal. It's even more efficient than gas turbine engines over the entire range of rpms.
2. The diesel can idle for long periods of time with minimal fuel consumption due to its constant uninhibited air consumption.
3. You'll generally get better mileage.
4. Your engine can run on any number of fuel oils.
5. Diesels engines as well as fuel systems must be built to higher tolerances.
6. You can't blast tailgaters with noxious clouds of exhaust.
7. With the old benz diesels, you have to deal with basically no electronics.
8. You won't have the "turbo" emblem anymore

Whichever way you go, good luck.