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  #1  
Old 08-11-2005, 10:00 AM
BusyBenz
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Question 603 lifter questions...???

Earlier this week, I posted a thread with questions about 603 cam lobe measurements: http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/showthreadad.php3?t=130921 I had the cam out to find the one or two weak hydraulic lifters that were tapping. A month earlier, I had the cam out for the same purpose and found one lifter very weak and upon replacement of a single lifter, the engine ran smooth and even, and without any taps, but only for about 200 miles, then it began slowly to develop a single tap, that was the reason I had my cam off this week.

This time around, I found 2 lifters that were questionable and replaced them both. Before putting the cam back in, I decided to measure each cam lobe and found inconsistencies in measurement, as much as 1-1/2mm. I also measured a spare 603 cam I have and found even greater inconsistencies to 2mm.

After replacement of the 2 lifters Monday, the engine was once again smooth, quiet, and even, just as was the first time I changed out 1 bad lifter before it started to tap again, and today, after about 120 miles since Monday, a lifter, or more than 1 lifter, is tapping yet once again!

NOTE: The replacement lifters I'm using are used, but were known to be good, so I little doubt about their integrity, but??????

This is beginning to bug me and I cannot make sense of it. Oil pressure and temp is normal, oil is Rotella dyno, not synthetic. I had been running M-1 for the past year, but lately cannot find M-1 15-50, so I'm back to dyno and 3k oil changes lately.

Anyone have any suggestions, or know what's going on here?

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  #2  
Old 08-11-2005, 11:18 AM
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From my own experiences and what I have read on this Board, the 603 has a known issue with noisy lifters, even if they are in good shape. I am told replacing them all with new helps for a while but doesn't entirely eliminate the problem.

In my own case a change to Synthetic has definitely made them quieter. I use the Wal-Mart Truck & SUV Mobil-1 which is identical to Devlac-1. Mobil-1 15-50 is fine also but not ideal up here in the winter.
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  #3  
Old 08-11-2005, 01:00 PM
BusyBenz
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dervman
From my own experiences and what I have read on this Board, the 603 has a known issue with noisy lifters, even if they are in good shape. I am told replacing them all with new helps for a while but doesn't entirely eliminate the problem.

In my own case a change to Synthetic has definitely made them quieter. I use the Wal-Mart Truck & SUV Mobil-1 which is identical to Devlac-1. Mobil-1 15-50 is fine also but not ideal up here in the winter.
All I've seen where I am lately is 5-30 M-1 and I'm reluctant to use 5 weight oil, heard bad things for older high mileage engines!
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Old 08-11-2005, 03:19 PM
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I had a really hard time finding the M-1 Truck & SUV oil at various Wally-Marts on a trip back from Florida, but I have friends in the Detroit Area that can get it no problem. It is certainly much cheaper than any synthetic I can get here.

The Truck & SUV Oil is 5W-40 rated, but it is specifically designed for Diesel Engines (Like Devlac-1) and I have had no issues that I can detect so far. In fact my Oil Pressure went up slightly (at hot idle - otherwise needle is pegged at 3+) and has remained so even through our very hot summer.

I wouldn't use regular 5W-30 synthetic or Dino Oil in a Diesel.
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  #5  
Old 08-11-2005, 03:37 PM
rdanz's Avatar
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Change the two small o-rings on the bottom of the oil filter center bolt and see if that helps.
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  #6  
Old 08-11-2005, 03:40 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BusyBenz
All I've seen where I am lately is 5-30 M-1 and I'm reluctant to use 5 weight oil, heard bad things for older high mileage engines!
If you don't mind going into Wal-Mart, they have the Mobil-1 Truck and Suv oil for $20.00 in the five quart container. IIRC it's 5W-40. This is fine for the diesels.
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Old 08-11-2005, 05:50 PM
BusyBenz
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rdanz
Change the two small o-rings on the bottom of the oil filter center bolt and see if that helps.
Thanks for that tip, but I have already installed new O-rings I bought from the dealership.

Oddly, today I have yet to hear any lifter tap and wonder that maybe I should return to M-1 buuuut I have only seen the 5-30 weight and want only to use 15-50.

Seems all I can find now is 5-30 in all brands of oil!
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  #8  
Old 08-11-2005, 07:42 PM
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I have been using Amsoil 15W40 heavy duty synthetic and it eliminated a noisy lifter on my '87 300D turbo but I have to add that I changed out all of the lifters to new ones when I had the valve guides replaced and the head resurfaced so that could be a factor.
I get Amsoil in 2.5 Gal jugs, it makes filling the beast easy.
http://www.amsoil.com/storefront/ame.aspx
I have a Amsoil dealer that gives a discount over what others charge for it.
We have no WalMarts around here, that is fine w/ me I am not happy supporting that organization.
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  #9  
Old 08-11-2005, 09:27 PM
t walgamuth's Avatar
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i have a 603 and

a 500sec. the 500 will tap a lifter if i use 1540 rotella and stop if i use 1030 mobil 1.

for my 603 i found mobil 1 20w50 at advance auto parts here in lafayette indiana. in my 603 tapping is one problem i have not had.

tom w
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  #10  
Old 08-11-2005, 10:10 PM
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I would imagin replacing every lifter with a new one and running good synthetic would solve the problem. Also is your oil pressure within spec?

Mobil 1 5w-40 or 15w-50 should be availible at Walmart, Autozone, Pepboys or any good autoparts store. 5w-40 is a little hard to find but 15w-50 is pretty common. Amsoil 15w-40 would be great as well if you don't mind ordering it.

What exactly goes bad with the lifters and causes them to make noise?
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  #11  
Old 08-11-2005, 10:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dervman
The Truck & SUV Oil is 5W-40 rated, but it is specifically designed for Diesel Engines (Like Devlac-1) and I have had no issues that I can detect so far. In fact my Oil Pressure went up slightly (at hot idle - otherwise needle is pegged at 3+) and has remained so even through our very hot summer.
Dervman, do you know of anywhere in Ontario that I can get the Mobil 1 Truck & SUV 5W-40? I have been to Walmart, Canadian Tire, and a couple other places can't find it anywhere. Everywhere I go I can find the Mobil 1 15W50 but I want to use 5W-40 in the Mercedes in the winter, and I need 5W-40 for my Jetta TDI.

Any ideas?
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  #12  
Old 08-12-2005, 11:23 AM
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Dataiv:
Nobody I have yet found sells the Mobil-1 Truck & SUV oil here in Canada.
Wal-Mart and Canadian Tire certainly don't. You can special order Devlac-1 from an Esso (Mobil/Exxon in Canada) Wholesaler but the price is ridiculous. I did this once and it was about $50Cdn ($40US) for 4 litres

That is why the US Wal-Mart Mobil-1 Truck & SUV oil is such a deal. As Brian said they sell it for about $20US ($25Cdn.) and that is for 5 Quarts or 4.73 litres!! I have asked a number of Wal-Marts here if they can get it and they don't know what I'm talking about.

I use Mobil-1 15W-50 as an alternative, but it is a little heavy for the Winter Months. Even that is costing $36Cdn. now ($29US) for 4.2 litres.

Not as good as Mobil-1 but Wal-Mart do carry Esso XG-3 Synthetic in a 5W-40 grade for about $25 for 4 litres. The Specs aren't the same as Devlac but it is Diesel Rated.
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  #13  
Old 08-17-2005, 09:07 AM
BusyBenz
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Update:

Last time I changed oil, I switched back to dino ROTELLA 15-40 from Mobil One 15-50 I had been using all winter. This is when I began to notice tapping from one hydraulic lifter. I replaced that bad lifter and the taps went away, for a while that was! Recently I replaced a couple more lifters and the taps went away, but only briefly!

What gives, I asked?

I have been hesitant to use the 5-40 synthetic oils, but after reading several posts here with regard to 5-40, I have decided to use it.

Back to Mobil One but 5-40 this time. Reason is I'm not using 15-50 is because I cant find it here, only 5-40 and it's rated for diesel.

Anyway, no more taps, yet so far!

Seems odd that M-1 15-50 was available all past winters, now in the summertime I can only buy locally 5-40! Wanna bet the idiots will start stocking 15-50 for the winter! It should be the other way around! Go figure Any way, no more taps, yet!
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  #14  
Old 10-24-2005, 10:33 AM
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I was in Canadian Tire the other day and I saw AMSOIL on the shelf as well as ATF. It was close to $10 a litre. I don't know if all C Tire stores have it or just this one.
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  #15  
Old 10-24-2005, 10:46 PM
t walgamuth's Avatar
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i think

that with the 1540 rotella the lifters stick loose. with thinner oil they pump right up. on my 500 if i use rotella one taps for long minutes on startup until i have driven 1500 miles or so then stops. on mobil one 1030 it doesnt ever tap.

i think that the lifters are not worn when they stick, so that is why changing them doesn t work. you need the synthetic oil for them not to tap i think. if that is your problem.

tom w

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