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  #1  
Old 03-07-2006, 01:35 AM
DBR DBR is offline
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123 chassis project

I'v got an 82 240D/ 4-speed with around 270K and the motor is starting to show it's age. I've got several options but the one I've chose is to build a strong 617. (Does the 617 bolt up to the 4-speed tranny in the 240D?) I know MBZ got around 190HP out of a 617 used in one of the C-111 race cars so it can be done. I Have never seen or heard of anyone really building up a 617 and I think it would be alot of fun to see what I can get out of it. I do performance for a living so I'm not afraid to do it I'm just really having a hard time finding some resources. I'm going to do a custom turbo and intercooler and injection pump but the part I'm having trouble with is find good internals to handle more boost. Also I'd like to really improve the suspension. I've seen the 123 chassis cars raced in rallys so I know there has to be something out there but I just can't find anything. I'm in no real hurry for the project but I'd like to finish buy the end of 2006 summer. Any help or suggestions would be awesome!!

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  #2  
Old 03-07-2006, 10:00 AM
t walgamuth's Avatar
dieselarchitect
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Lafayette Indiana
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the 617 will

bolt up. if you build it the 240 tranny may get to be marginal as well as the clutch.

tom w
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[SIGPIC] Diesel loving autocrossing grandpa Architect. 08 Dodge 3/4 ton with Cummins & six speed; I have had about 35 benzes. I have a 39 Studebaker Coupe Express pickup in which I have had installed a 617 turbo and a five speed manual.[SIGPIC]

..I also have a 427 Cobra replica with an aluminum chassis.
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  #3  
Old 03-07-2006, 12:11 PM
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[QUOTE=DBR] I Have never seen or heard of anyone really building up a 617 and I think it would be alot of fun to see what I can get out of it.

I spoz it would be allot of fun but I cant help thinking of the old saying about "making a silk purse out of a sow's ear" If you want to build up a diesel, a Cummins would be a better choice. (they call it "bombing" ) Theres allot of folks into that so theres plenty of "go fast" equipment on the market, plates for the IP, bigger exhaust, bigger turbos, high volume injectors, Theres none of that for MBs, well not much anyway.
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1985 Euro 240D 5 spd 140K
1979 240D 5 spd, 40K on engine rebuild
1994 Dodge/Cummins, 5 spd, 121K
1964 Allice Chalmers D15 tractor
2014 Kubota L3800 tractor
1964 VW bug

"Lifes too short to drive a boring car"
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  #4  
Old 03-07-2006, 12:12 PM
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As you complete this project, please post updates here. I know of several members that would be interested in following along, including myself.
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  #5  
Old 03-07-2006, 03:39 PM
DBR DBR is offline
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I agree with the ole saying "making a silk purse out of a sow's ear" and with building a cummins. The problem is I deal with gas and diesel performance everyday at work on all kinds of cars except MBZ. I know I'll never make a race car, I have a 5.0 for that, or a race diesel which I've done those too--and your very right about the cummins. I just want to see what i can get out of the benz. I think it would be really cool to have a fast 25 year old diesel. Anyway thanks for the reply and I will keep it posted as soon as I get started.
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  #6  
Old 03-07-2006, 06:31 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DBR
I agree with the ole saying "making a silk purse out of a sow's ear" and with building a cummins. The problem is I deal with gas and diesel performance everyday at work on all kinds of cars except MBZ. I know I'll never make a race car, I have a 5.0 for that, or a race diesel which I've done those too--and your very right about the cummins. I just want to see what i can get out of the benz. I think it would be really cool to have a fast 25 year old diesel. Anyway thanks for the reply and I will keep it posted as soon as I get started.

I think its a great idea to see what you can do to jack up preference on an MB, I didnt realize people did this to diesels till I got on the Dodge/Cunnins forum.
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1985 Euro 240D 5 spd 140K
1979 240D 5 spd, 40K on engine rebuild
1994 Dodge/Cummins, 5 spd, 121K
1964 Allice Chalmers D15 tractor
2014 Kubota L3800 tractor
1964 VW bug

"Lifes too short to drive a boring car"
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  #7  
Old 03-07-2006, 10:52 PM
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w123 and w203
 
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First off good luck...

With that said I am running about 230hp with a domestic power plant in my w123...

To upgrade the chassis you will need to get creative...

I am using long/limo L version suspension bushings were ever possible. the front sway bars are marginally different if at all between a sedan, long, and a wagon...the rear bar in a wagon is thicker - but may throw things out of wack to the front if not upgraded...the rear bushings are 201 part pns now

I am using slotted rotors on stock calipers with textar pads, and goodridge stainless flex lines, new booster and master...all new hard lines both fuel and brake...I will do the "big brake" upgrade to w126 parts when this set up goes...

I am running lowering springs by Ventura, and bilstein shocks...it took a little messing with different spring cups to get the right ride height...kmac made a camber set for our rears...it is an expensive part as well

Adjust your front eccentric if lowered

I have a home made fiberglass and urethane body kit - and installed a third brake light...

Dad and I put in a mustang rack, with custom arms and steeda bump steer kit when I installed the jba headers - using borgeson unis on the double d shaft...these turn 17" monoblock type wheels

You will want to look at the rear axles and the drive line, replace tore or damaged parts - carquest has lifetime axles, but make sure all the Allens are tight!

They say there is a possi / locker rear diff from amg - good luck with that, or that you can hybrid one with w126 parts...but all in all the stock one should hold 250hp...Check your axle slop, and the inner rear hub bolts...

I used a turbo flex disk, the front is a universal from the Ford tranny to a custom sleeved and spun balanced drive shaft - I have ripped up a carrier bearing - check yours...

The diff and rear sub frame mounts are important - and easy to replace - also check the integrity of the front sway bar to upper control arm, and the lower spring perch in the rear trailing arm...

I am running all stainless 2.5" mandrel exhaust through a borla turbo muffler...
I have white face gauges and two in the ash tray for volt and
air/fuel...working on an apillar gauge pod for boost and fuel press...

I am running a large aluminum radiator from wizard cooling with trans cooler...

I also have a spare intercooler for in front of the radiator if you think you want or need it...I could think about selling it...

When set up and running right the blower goes through carbon fiber tubes, a front mount IC and into the upper intake...

Again - good luck - have fun - be safe
Jake

I forgot - we made a upper cross bar / strut tower bar...call it what you will...
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  #8  
Old 03-08-2006, 01:16 AM
DBR DBR is offline
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Thanks for the great ideas. Do the W126 brakes bolt on the W123? Sounds like you got quite a cool W123. What kind of engine r u using?
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  #9  
Old 03-08-2006, 04:29 AM
t walgamuth's Avatar
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bfj230

has my head swimming. all that would have to cost a fortune.

there is a guy who posted here a few months back about mods he has done to his 116 sd that involves mods that are much more subtle, like tweaking the turbo and related things.

extensive modifications like bfj230 is describing are a sure way to make your car about sale proof and while it is worthwhile from a learning standpoint it won't pan out money wise.

for myself i seem always to be chasing just getting the car back to stock most of the time.

though i have upgraded two two forties to three hundreds, i used all mb parts. and yes the 126 brakes are a bolt in for some years. you need a caliper and the disc. the pads are the same. your parts seller should be able to tell you the years you need.

i have a set of lowering springs that i bought years ago for my euro 280 that i never installed (k and b?, eibach?) cant remember the brand).

good luck

tom w
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[SIGPIC] Diesel loving autocrossing grandpa Architect. 08 Dodge 3/4 ton with Cummins & six speed; I have had about 35 benzes. I have a 39 Studebaker Coupe Express pickup in which I have had installed a 617 turbo and a five speed manual.[SIGPIC]

..I also have a 427 Cobra replica with an aluminum chassis.
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  #10  
Old 03-08-2006, 09:27 AM
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So you don't try to reinvent the wheel try a search ....there have been a few threads on the subject with what works and what doesn't work......You can save time by finding out what has already been done. 200HP should be achievable....if a bit costly to achieve. THe major bottlenecks are the IP...and the non-crossflow head.
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Proud owner of ....
1971 280SE W108
1979 300SD W116
1983 300D W123
1975 Ironhead Sportster chopper
1987 GMC 3/4 ton 4X4 Diesel
1989 Honda Civic (Heavily modified)
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"He who fights with monsters might take care lest he thereby become a monster. And if you gaze for long into an abyss, the abyss gazes also into you." - Friedrich Nietzsche
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  #11  
Old 03-08-2006, 10:06 AM
BF_JC230's Avatar
w123 and w203
 
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it did not cost that much...i should total it all up and see...it was A LOT of time from both my dad and i...when i turned 16 it was like our bonding project - so i wouldn't trade the little bit of money - and all the great memories (and lessons) for anything...
Jake
Attached Thumbnails
123 chassis project-1.jpg   123 chassis project-2.jpg   123 chassis project-3.jpg   123 chassis project-4.jpg  
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  #12  
Old 03-08-2006, 12:37 PM
boneheaddoctor's Avatar
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BF_JC230
it did not cost that much...i should total it all up and see...it was A LOT of time from both my dad and i...when i turned 16 it was like our bonding project - so i wouldn't trade the little bit of money - and all the great memories (and lessons) for anything...
Jake
Try researching what it costs for Myrna diesel to modify a Euro pump to replace your american pump (the elements for the American market pump just aren't availible at any price)....you can buy a descent car for that...but its the only way you are going to get big numbers......the stock pump is only able to deliver just so much fuel.
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Proud owner of ....
1971 280SE W108
1979 300SD W116
1983 300D W123
1975 Ironhead Sportster chopper
1987 GMC 3/4 ton 4X4 Diesel
1989 Honda Civic (Heavily modified)
---------------------
Section 609 MVAC Certified
---------------------
"He who fights with monsters might take care lest he thereby become a monster. And if you gaze for long into an abyss, the abyss gazes also into you." - Friedrich Nietzsche
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  #13  
Old 03-08-2006, 06:53 PM
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Bomb the benz with bolt ones. Rig up a propane injection system and see what it will do.
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1981 300D 147k
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  #14  
Old 03-08-2006, 07:36 PM
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If you want big power I believe there some guys in Finland that are getting some amazing hp #'s from the 2.5 OM602.XXX engines. Here's a link Very fast W124 turbodiesel (video)
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  #15  
Old 03-08-2006, 08:11 PM
t walgamuth's Avatar
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bfjc230

that installation looks very professional. you and your dad must have some serious skills.

what is with the headlights? do they actually work?

tom w

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[SIGPIC] Diesel loving autocrossing grandpa Architect. 08 Dodge 3/4 ton with Cummins & six speed; I have had about 35 benzes. I have a 39 Studebaker Coupe Express pickup in which I have had installed a 617 turbo and a five speed manual.[SIGPIC]

..I also have a 427 Cobra replica with an aluminum chassis.
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