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  #1  
Old 07-16-2006, 09:38 PM
DeliveryValve's Avatar
Chairman of my Benz
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Central California
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617 Turbo Diesel injectors.

Hello All,

Can anyone identify the injector on the left? The right injector is off of my 1983 300d turbo (917.952). These look like they could belong to an early 917 (917.950) turbo diesel. I am correct?
They a rubber around the neck and the markings “0432217101 REV” on the rubber.
Now I am not an expert at identifying injectors but I have been told if injectors have a rubber ring around the neck, they could have been rebuilt - Is that correct?
Also what will happen if you run injectors from a 617.950 (from a w116) on a 917.952 motor (from a w123 or w126)?

Last piece of information, which may not be relevant, my ‘83’s injectors have the markings of “KCA30S35/4”

Thanks

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617 Turbo Diesel injectors.-dieselinjectors.jpg  
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  #2  
Old 07-16-2006, 11:45 PM
Mark Tamburrino
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what will happen if you run injectors from a 617.950 (from a w116) on a 917.952 motor (from a w123 or w126)? Nothing as they are the same, according to the Adsit catalog, the same part# for both. FWIW the catalog is free by going to www.adsitco.com. They are a really expensive MB part source but the catalog is helpful this way-crossreferencing. So I would say the injector on the left is not from 617.95X, perhaps from a non turbo. I wouldn't risk it without knowing. Also, I've spent many hours trying to track down a bosch part going by the numbers on it-two hours worth on google-nothing, if this saves you any time. I don't know if a rubber ring means it has been rebuilt, but I'm not an expert either.
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Old 07-17-2006, 01:46 AM
DeliveryValve's Avatar
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I think your right about the origin. I took off the rubber ring off, and the markings are "KCA30S35/4 115 bar." Does anybody know what will happen if you run these injectors on a turbo diesel since these motors require 135 bar injectors?

Thanks
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Old 07-17-2006, 07:11 AM
Admiral-Third World Fleet
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Central FL
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My 80 300SD w/OM617.950 has injectors as pictured on left. It may be that style were used in other earlier diesels. But , as you suggest, the rubber ring suggests that they were rebuilt, so they may have been rebuilt for a turbo (higher pop pressure)
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80 300SD (129k mi) 82 240D stick (193k mi)77 240D auto - stick to be (153k mi) 85 380SL (145k mi) 89 BMW 535i 82 Diesel Rabbit Pickup (374k mi) 91 Jetta IDI Diesel (155k mi) 81 VW Rabbit Convertible Diesel 70 Triumph Spitfire Mk III (63kmi)66 Triumph TR4a IRS (90k mi)67 Ford F-100 (??)
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Old 07-17-2006, 01:16 PM
Mark Tamburrino
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I thought that the fuel quantity would be less with a non turbo injector.
After thinking about it-and I may be naive by saying so-I think the time of injection would be too soon. Reason being is the the IP on a turbo would also operate at a higher pressure if the turbo injector is 135bar instead of 115. If the 115 one is used, it will pop when that pressure is reached. 135bar will be reached when it is supposed to fire, so 115 will be reached before that.
So the injector will pop before it is supposed to, can't speculate how many degrees before. Just a guess, it's a good question and I'm sure somebody knows much more, mabee I'm incorrect altogether.
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Old 07-17-2006, 01:45 PM
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I also agree it will open a little earlier. Enough to be a problem is the unknown. You certainly would not want to mix injectors with large differences of pop pressures for example. A milli volt test with each type in operation might clue you in. It could also change the idle speed of the engine. You are also playing with the design paremeters for the engine to some extent. Personally I would not do it. Now if nozzle flow rate is the same they might be recalibrated by a shop to the higher pressure if they are the same internal design as the turbo injectors I imagine. A injector shop would know.
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Old 07-17-2006, 09:33 PM
DeliveryValve's Avatar
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Hey thank all for the input. I guess what it boils down to is that these injectors came with the motor I am going to install in my ’83 300D (the previous owner of the car didn’t like maintaining the engine, so I am stuck putting a replacement motor in). I am concerned now that if these injectors (four of them came with the engine) are actually 115 bar injectors and if they were running them this replacement motor for awhile, would that destroy this motor? Now I am not a diesel expert but learning everyday, I am wondering if there is a possibility of pre-ignition because they are popping early which can damage vital parts of the motor just like any gas motor with pre-ignition problems. Hopefully, these were just 115 bar cores and were rebuilt to the 135 bar specs.

Any more thoughts on this, love to hear ya?
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Old 07-17-2006, 09:48 PM
Admiral-Third World Fleet
 
Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Central FL
Posts: 3,069
I don't think there is any cause for concern. Either 115 or 135 bar will work and will not cause any real damage. Whatever they are, they just may not be optimal. If you want to invest in peace of mind, take them to a diesel injection shop and get them pop tested to see what they are- they may well be lower than 115 bar.

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80 300SD (129k mi) 82 240D stick (193k mi)77 240D auto - stick to be (153k mi) 85 380SL (145k mi) 89 BMW 535i 82 Diesel Rabbit Pickup (374k mi) 91 Jetta IDI Diesel (155k mi) 81 VW Rabbit Convertible Diesel 70 Triumph Spitfire Mk III (63kmi)66 Triumph TR4a IRS (90k mi)67 Ford F-100 (??)
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