A working AC...at what price? - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

miner · #1 07-22-2006, 04:00 AM

I finally found a shop in Chicago that works on R-12 systems. I had to go through about 5 shops that only wanted to convert me to 134a. And most of them told me R-12 was illegal or would cost me $300 just for the recharge. One guy actually told me both these things at the same time.

Anyway the place I found quoted me $150 for the R-12 recharge and $60 for a "performance test". I wanted to see what you all thought of those numbers. He says the vacuuming, oil charge, leak testing, and so forth is all included.

The way I look at it, to do it myself, I would have to spend:

- $100 for an ok vacuum pump
- $70 for a set of gauges
- $80, at least, for r-12 off ebay
- a small fee, but who knows how much time, to take that EPA test so that I could actually buy the R-12.
- a few other odds and ends (I allways seem to need a few more things than what I originally plan for).

So that is around $275 at best, $300 more likely, just to recharge it myself and a lot of hours working. And I still wouldn't be able to test for leaks or fine tune or recover any refrigerant if I overfilled.

On the other hand, half of that is a one time expense AND I have two vehicles that I would like to get ac working on. Only one this year though. So I have not yet decided what to do.

I know a lot of people here have had to make decisions like this. Any advice or wisdom will be appreciated. Thanks.

RobertC · #2 07-22-2006, 08:21 AM

Hi,
You can make yourself a good vacuum pump by just getting hold of an old AC/refridgerator/freezer compressor and adding a schrader valve to the inlet side. You can get the shrader valve at any AC supply store. I've made a few of these for my friends in the past. They work great, and quiet too.

nhdoc · #3 07-22-2006, 09:32 AM

You can't do it yourself for $150 since, as you know, you need more than that much in tools alone to do it right. The question is, would you ever use the tools again? If not then let them do it, if so, then buy the tools and DIY. I don't know what a "performance test" entails...the important things to do are to do a good evacuation and check for leaks...once the system is evacuated and found to be leak free, then charge it up and see if it cools...if so you are all set to go, no "performance test" is needed really other than sticking a thermometer into the air outlet to see how cold it is...or you could just use your hand. If it is not perfect, are you then willing to spend more (much more) to explore the reasons?

I guess if it was me I would ask what the performance test was and probably just let them do the $150 service and see how it goes. That's $75 worth of freon so they are charging you $75 to evacuated and fill it...you're really not going to find anyone to work on an R12 system for less than that.

You also mentioned you have 2 cars to do...in that case it makes the argument for DIY stronger...the chances of both "coming to life" with just a recharge are pretty small...you may be looking at more $$$ with the shop doing it so maybe you should reconsider taking the plunge, buying the tools and doing it yourself...or find one of our board members with the tools already who is close by and could help you out...that's another option.

Gary F. · #4 07-22-2006, 11:14 AM

Auto Zone will lend you a vacuum pump, no charge, however you do have to put up a deposit on your credit card, which is credited when you return the pump.
The fee for the test is $15. at ASE.com. open book should take about 45 minutes to complete and they email you a certificate you can use until the mailed copy arrives. Auto Zone may also lend guages, if not you should be able to buy an used set on EBay for around $50, and these will come in handy later. I bought a set 15 years ago and have used them numerous times not only on my cars but on my home AC, they have paid for themselves 10 times over.
Good luck on your project, it is quite easy and you will wonder why these AC people charge so much for such little work.

JimmyL · #5 07-22-2006, 11:24 AM

Well, I think they are offering you a pretty fair deal. However, you always run the risk of what else they may find.

The mechanics version of Bait and Switch. You would like to think all are honest and straighforward, but with my Sainted Mother I have had to go deal with some dishonest mechanics preying on the elderly. Not to mention, there could be legimate issues. The freon went somewhere......
If it is just a simple check out, vacuum and recharge though, and you could have a cold car in a day or two, that has value also.
I have been using vac pump and gauges from Autozone almost this whole summer. I try to take them back before my credit car billing cycle ends, though....

tangofox007 · #6 07-22-2006, 12:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gary F.

Auto Zone will lend you a vacuum pump, no charge,

Not everywhere.

tangofox007 · #7 07-22-2006, 12:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by miner

I know a lot of people here have had to make decisions like this. Any advice or wisdom will be appreciated. Thanks.

Tools and equipment cost money. But they don't lose their value the first time they are used. And the satisfaction of doing it yourself can be priceless.

my123ca · #8 07-22-2006, 12:30 PM

Just got a quote yesterday. $135 for vac and fill...w/134A. That looks like a good deal but then they might find something wrong with your AC system. At $150, your half way to a new vacuum pump. Autozone just sold AC guages for $20 last winter

miner · #9 07-22-2006, 05:03 PM

In for a dime, in for a dollar. Or something like that. I didn't know about vacuum pumps and gauges from Autozone's rental program. Thanks. Maybe I'll study up and get certified and work on my Jeep. It is less broken than my 300d. But my wife can't find out about the test. If she knew I was taking a test to become a certified AC technician, or whatever, she would either laugh her ass off or yell at me for having too many little projects.

Thanks for the input.

Does anyone happen to know a good/easy/low tech way to leak test? Can I just pressurize the system with air and listen for leaks, or pull a vacuum and see how long it holds? Or do I have to use dyed freon and a special light? In my jeep, for example, I know all the freon leaked out of a rock hole in the condenser a few years ago. I am going to JB weld the hole and hope it works. What is the normal pressure in an R-12 system. The condenser is where it changes from high to low. So what kind of pressure am I looking at if I want to tet my JB weld job before I fill with freon?

jbaj007 · #10 07-22-2006, 05:44 PM

The condensor is always at high pressure.

Depending on the size of the rock, this may be better than JB Weld:
http://www.acsource.com/index.asp?PageAction=VIEWPROD&ProdID=385

Diesel Giant · #11 07-22-2006, 06:12 PM

That R-12 is way too expensive! Why dont you look at Freeze 12, lower pressures make the compressor happy and gets colder.

http://dieselgiant.com/repairyourac.htm

Scott98 · #12 07-22-2006, 06:18 PM

I bought a vacuum pump at Harbor Freight for $10. It worked just fine for working on my A/C.

Scott

Diesel Giant · #13 07-22-2006, 06:22 PM

You can rent vacuum pumps at lots of rental stores or buy a used one at a pawn shop.

#14 07-22-2006, 09:32 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by miner

Anyway the place I found quoted me $150 for the R-12 recharge and $60 for a "performance test". I wanted to see what you all thought of those numbers. He says the vacuuming, oil charge, leak testing, and so forth is all included.

Those prices sound reasonable for a shop to do the work. They are charging about $50/pound for R-12, which is about what I've paid at a shop. You need to make sure they are going to leak test the system before using the R-12, you don't want to pay for it to leak out in a week. I'm sure you can save some money in the long term if you learn to DIY, you just need to decide if it's worth the trouble.