Highway diesel?
 

Well, as you know I am new again to putting diesel in a car. Well I am a moron and accidentally put highway diesel in my 85 300SD. Wasn't paying close enough attention. Is this going to be detrimental to my car or is that it's just not legal to put in a passenger car. Car is still running great!
What is this low sulphur warning I am seeing on a few pumps?
Do I need to worry about that too?
Thanks for the help.

You have absolutely nothing to worry about..... Highway Diesel is just regular diesel fuel......


The stickers you have been seeing on diesel pumps is basically just to let you know that they have lowered the sulfur content of diesel fuel.

I believe the posted "warning" about the low sulfur fuel is to contrast it with the "no sulfur" fuel that is going to come for 2007 and later model year Diesels. Not sure if there will be "no" and "low" sulfur offered at the same place and the same time. The stickers I saw merely note the fuel contains some relatively small number of parts per million of sulfur and that even such low concentrations are illegal for use by, and could damage, 2007 and later model year Diesels meant for "highway" or over the road use (vs. farm use, or construction site use, possibly). It is perfectly ok for any earlier model year Diesels. Jim

Cool, thanks buds! Was worried and feel like an idiot. Usually not brain dead, maybe it's the heat.(lol) The filler didn't fit right in my tank, should have told me something but didn't. I have noticed when I put in "normal" diesel that sometimes the filler isn't fittin right in the tank. But I guess things change from 1985 to the present. Is low sulfur diesel gonna lower the performance or quality of the fuel?

The only thing different in low sulfur diesel is that it doesnt have the same lubricity that the higher sulfer diesel has.

My question is, since the 2007's are on the brink of release, when will this fuel be updated for those cars?

I was confused about this as well. I know the manufactures just aren't gonna up and quit making diesels. Interesting point!

a friend of mine recently went shopping for a 320CDI....
 

Off topic for a second.... I went along with a friend of mine while she was shopping for a new 320CDI.

One of the questions I had for the salesman was when and where would the new diesel fuel be available. His answer was he didn't know. So, my followon was to ask if they expected people to take delivery before the new fuel was really available. And his answer was "good question", and "no".

So.... Your mileage may vary, but I think owning a 2007 CDI will be almost like owning a model year 1975, the year no lead was required. (early on, you had to look for fuel. After a while, it wasn't an issue.)

A local place has "truck diesel"
 

There have been lots of discussions about these issues - do a search on "ULSD" if you are interested in the particulars. ULSD is being phased in now and is supposed to be widely available by the fall.

If you are driving a MY 2007 Diesel you will need to verify the pump you are using to refuel is dispensing ULSD, Federal law currently requires all retail pumps to identify the sulfur content via a sticker on the pump. About half the stations in my local area are already pumping ULSD and it seems like more are being converted over everyday.

Another off-topic, and slightly amusing: I was driving past the dealership the otherday, and on thier brand new LCD sign (we're talking HUGE), they were boasting "2007 E320 CDI, 38 mpg!" That's great milage, but I don't think people buying a $40k car are really all that concerned about fuel prices/economy :wacko:

Apparently, people were interested in fuel mileage when they paid $30K for early 80s 300D's. BTW, I think a new CDI costs closer to $60K, than $40K.

Whats "Highway diesel?:confused: No 1 or no 2???:confused:

Most of the stations that have the LSD signs are probably pumping out ULSD anyway. They have to flush their tanks with several batches of ULSD in order to get it in spec. The sticker is probably just to exclude them from liability in the event someone fuels up their 2007 Diesel and then comes back and gives them a hard time. I would expect most of these stations to keep that sticker on there until the government requires them to change it.

The same reason most mfrs aren't making Diesel passenger cars for 2007. During the changeover...i am sure more than a few people will accidentally fuel up using LSD instead of ULSD which will damage the PMF for the new 2007 Diesels. Then you can bet people would be playing the blame game. It's best for them to just wait until the switch is fully set in, before they start rolling out the vehicles with this new emissions equipment. When someone drives a 60k car, they are probably a lot more likely to pay attention to what type of fuel they put in...but you can bet it will still happen. Not only that, but in VWs case, they are going to be switching away from the pump dusse (unit injector) system, and moving to a common-rail setup for the 2008 TDI models. This is due to the fact that the unit injection models are unable to meet light-duty emissions requirements.

Just my two cents.

Also there is off-road diesel (no highway tax$) and truck diesel high volume pumps. If you fill from a high volume pump DO NOT WALK AWAY FROM THE VEHICLE WHILE PUMPING!!!!!!!!!!!!! These pumps pump around 20 GPM.
My '79 300SD filler neck won't take some pump nozzles but to h!@!! with them, I burn WVO!

I think your answer needs futher explanation:

Yor are correct if you mean at the first stage of refining - but my understanding is that the refiners will then add sufficient additives to bring it up to recommended or acceptable lubricity standards.

This is correct for the most part. Low sulphur does not mean low lubricity. The process of removing the sulphur content from the fuel (hydrotreating) also removes/changes the naturally present lubricity as a side effect. An additive is then introduced to make the fuel meet spec.

Long story short, when you pull up at the pump, the ULSD should have just as much lubricity as LSD. If you are concerned about lubricity, use an additive like powerservice or run a low blend of soy Bio-Diesel like B2 or B5.

SO: what's the bottom line?
 

Will the new fuel be compatible with my '84 300SD? Will I need to use some sort of additive, and if so, which one? I intend to drive this car as close to forever as I can, and don't want to do anything to damage it.

Did you read my post above? It's not going to damage your car...if you are worried about lubricity then use an additive. The fuel is required to have a lubricity additive put in to meet government spec. If you are going to loose sleep at night worrying about lubricity, then use 6-8oz of power service at each fill. Although I believe that lubricity will be fine, I will still use an additive in my vehicles because it is cheap insurance.

Read your post
 

but was looking for another opinion. No offense intended. "Trust, but verify....."

Really, don't worry about it. There are plenty of engines just like yours in europe that have been running on ULSD for quite a while. These IPs are pretty well built, I just replaced mine after 340K miles. What's the worst that can happen, it will only last 250K with ULSD? You will have plenty of other things to repair before you have any negative effects from ULSD.

:D If you want to verify, just do a search. This has been discussed numerous times on this forum as well as many others. As Craig stated, cars in Europe have been running ULSD for a while. There are people out there running used motor oil through these IPs....not recommended though :D

Thanks
 

Will do the search. Other comments also appreciated.

No, it will not affect your car's performance. The lower sulfur fuel will work with modern catalytic converters, etc., so that pollution is reduced, and so that manufacturers like Mercedes, VW, etc. can once again meet EPA emissions requirements, enabling them to sell the same excellent diesel-engined models here in the US that they have been selling in Europe and elsewhere all along.

As far as the pump nozzle not fitting in your tank... It has nothing to do with the car being a 1985, or anything of the sort... You were just using a "truck" pump, which is perfectly fine.

It's the same fuel....

The difference in "truck" diesel pumps -vs.- "normal" diesel pumps is that the "truck" ones pump fuel at a much faster rate, for obvious reasons... most large commercial trucks have large, high-capacity fuel tanks.

This high-speed fuel delivery rate is not necessary for the relatively small fuel tank in a car, and it actually can cause accidental overflow and fuel spillage, so the high-speed truck pumps are fitted with a bigger nozzle, to discourage people from using them to fuel cars.

Regular gas stations typically have diesel pumps with the "normal"-sized nozzle, whereas truck stops have the larger-nozzled "truck" pumps, but they also usually have a couple of specifically designated "car" or "car/RV" pumps, with the smaller nozzles that will fit in your tank's filler neck properly.

The stuff that is illegal to burn in your car is "farm/off-road" diesel. It is also exactly the same fuel, but it is dyed red to make it easily identifiable. The reason that it is illegal to use this in your car is because it is untaxed. The government doesn't want you driving around on highways that you're not paying for (the aforementioned fuel tax). ;) It is not typically found at gas stations and/or truck stops, so you shouldn't need to worry about accidentally putting it in your vehicle.

Mike

Q
Will I need to put an additive in my fuel tank to replace the lubricity
that was provided by the higher sulfur content?
A
Like Low Sulfur Diesel fuel, ULSD fuel requires good lubricity
and corrosion inhibitors to prevent unacceptable engine wear. As
necessary, additives to increase lubricity and to inhibit corrosion will
be added to ULSD fuel prior to its retail sale. With these additives,
ULSD fuel is expected to perform as well as Low Sulfur Diesel fuel.


Hope this helps.

www.clean-diesel.org

Good link.

"Highway Diesel", "Truck Diesel" and "Diesel #2" are all EXACTLY the same thing. Only difference may be the sulfur amounts, depeneding on labels where you get your fuel. "Off highway diesel" is also the exact same thing, except it does not have tax(s) added to it, and is dyed pink. Because it's not taxed, it's not legal for use in cars, but intended for farm machines and generators etc. In rual places, where people have their own fuel tanks, sometimes inspectors will come around and dip in to fuel tanks to make sure dyed diesel isn't in their road cars.
The truck stop pumps are fun too. They do pump around 0.6-0.8Gal/sec. Normal pumps are 0.06-0.1Gal/sec. The guy who used to fill the 500gal tanks on the farm used to have a 1.1-1.5Gal/sec, much fun. But at truck stops I can fill my SD in under a minute.