how rare is a stick - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

mr overkill · #1 08-13-2006, 09:28 PM

im in the market for a good deal on a diesel either a 190 or a 300

looked and found over a dozen of them but none a stick how rare are they ?

the reason im looking for a stick is because i dont want to have to worry about a trans problem and all

TheDon · #2 08-13-2006, 09:33 PM

a 4 speed from a 240D is feasible, ive seen the 190D with stick.. with the 2.5 engine.. but what we W123 owners are after is the rare 5 speed... rarer than jaded hens teeth

JimmyL · #3 08-13-2006, 09:37 PM

You can find the occasional 190D with a standard tranny. You can find quite a few 240D's with a standard tranny. The only 300D's with standard trannies were Euro imports, and they are very rare, and very prone to rust.
The automatic trannies on 300D's are actually very reliable. Auto tranny's on 190's are a ticking bomb, and are going out, just a question of when. almost always prior to 200K.

jwhughes3 · #4 08-13-2006, 09:55 PM

I say don't worry about a 300 tranny if you can find one taken care of halfway decent - they really seem to be as bulletproof as the engines.

John

#5 08-13-2006, 10:19 PM

You won't find a stock MB with a stick and a turbodiesel. The first time MB put that combo together was with the C30CDI AMG in 2003 (Only in europe). Link All the sticks you will find will be in 240D's and european imported (Grey market) non-turbo 300D's.

Mine started life as a 240D and I replaced the engine with one from my 300TD. It can be done the other way as well. Installing the manual tranny and pedal assy in a 300D.

mr overkill · #6 08-14-2006, 05:29 PM

wow i never knew it was that rare lol ok of its off to give the 300sdl im looking at a better look and go from there

winmutt · #7 08-14-2006, 05:32 PM

It comes down to how much work.... the 4spd transmissions are readily available on the cheap. Finding a car with one stock is a bit of a pickle.

I never understood why they never put a sitck and a turbo together.

iNeon · #8 08-14-2006, 05:39 PM

They didn't put a turbo/manual together because the turbo needs to be wound up to be effective, right?

So, if you have a manual transmission and you press the clutch, the turbo has to spool up again, every time you change gears. It is a luxury thing, not a "lets kill performance" kind of thing. Just like the 2nd gear start.

I could be completely wrong, however.

winmutt · #9 08-14-2006, 05:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by iNeon

They didn't put a turbo/manual together because the turbo needs to be wound up to be effective, right?

So, if you have a manual transmission and you press the clutch, the turbo has to spool up again, every time you change gears. It is a luxury thing, not a "lets kill performance" kind of thing. Just like the 2nd gear start.

I could be completely wrong, however.

Sounds like you just need to keep it spooled by keeping the exhaust flowing. Something about keeping your foot on the pedal while changing gears?

iNeon · #10 08-14-2006, 06:01 PM

Win--
I really have no clue how a turbo works beyond the whole "more compressed air= more power" thing. I just sort of put 2 and 2 together to come up with that answer.

Since the turbo doesn't start working until you are high in the RPM range, I assumed that the "fall-off" that happens when you press the clutch to switch gears would be the reason they never fitted a turbo with a manual. The N/A engines don't rely so heavily on RPM being in a certain range, so they were seen as more fitting.

I'd also assume the added power would make the turbo/manual be a more uhh... young person type experience. Can you imagine 40 year-old's actually enjoying the 'jerkiness' that would be inherent in such a car?

Rashakor · #11 08-14-2006, 10:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by iNeon

Win--

Since the turbo doesn't start working until you are high in the RPM range, I assumed that the "fall-off" that happens when you press the clutch to switch gears would be the reason they never fitted a turbo with a manual. The N/A engines don't rely so heavily on RPM being in a certain range, so they were seen as more fitting.

Ineon, i think you totally nailed it! turbo and manny trannies just don't go together easily. That is actually one of the reason turbos are a very rare sight in rice burners circles. There the belt drive compressors are kings!!!!

#12 08-14-2006, 10:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rashakor

That is actually one of the reason turbos are a very rare sight in rice burners circles.

No, it's all the high school wanna-be ricers that can't AFFORD a turbo!

JimmyL · #13 08-14-2006, 10:35 PM

INeon pretty much nailed it. You've been on top of several things lately.

Now remember young boys and girls, these were not race cars, nor were they really performance cars. They fell into the luxury car segment. The turbos just gave a dog a little more bark.....

Jim Anderson · #14 08-14-2006, 10:41 PM

I’ve had experience with both a gas and a diesel turbo hitched to 5 speeds, the worst I could say is that it makes the engine seem “peaky” when running through the gears, a bit like my motorcycle. Hill climbing is great, and at high elevation my turbo diesel was one of the fastest cars on the road (it didn’t help starting though.) That said, I’ve never driven a turbo auto. Theoretically it would be better but I was just fine with what I had.

#15 08-14-2006, 10:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jim Anderson

I’ve had experience with both a gas and a diesel turbo hitched to 5 speeds, the worst I could say is that it makes the engine seem “peaky” when running through the gears

That's HORRIBLE! You need to give that car to me so you don't have to live with that awful performance.