300D engine vacuum pump W124 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

toknow · #1 08-17-2006, 02:53 PM

The engine in my car has the old style. it works fine, no noise, leake etc. I read here that these can be self-destruct and destroy other things. Can these be maintained (cleaned etc.) or they need to be changed regardless. Also, some changed the newer ones as a preventive measure. In the MRBZ CD there nothing mentioned except " vacuum pump updated for cost reasons". can somebody explain more to me this issues,
Can I find a good used one (new style)?
thanks

dieseldiehard · #2 08-17-2006, 03:18 PM

All I can say is I would interpret "cost reasons" as the early ones self destruct and costs them (MBNA) a new engine (under warranty) and of course the factory warranty has long since run out on a 20 year old car.
Take my word for it, you are on borrowed time with an early style Vac Pump!

joel price · #3 08-17-2006, 03:30 PM

how can I tell if I have the early style vacuum pump? Was there a change during the production year?
joel

toknow · #4 08-17-2006, 03:51 PM

first, from the MRBZ CD:

"note
Engine 602.962
vacuum modified for cost reasons"

I thought this means they made them cheaper, less massive, or less complicated etc. but may be you are right about other failure cost, but why they did not mentioned this directly, and why only for engine 602.xx not 603.xx

Second, the new style has the hex bolts visible in the front, may be that is why it is cheaper to make!!?

80300dbenz · #5 08-17-2006, 05:39 PM

does that mean that anyone who has an old style pump should replace it?

Diesel Giant · #6 08-17-2006, 05:41 PM

The pumps rarely "self destruct" mostly the check valves and seals go out. Only is th rocker arm assembly breaks would it destroy the pump. The pump is very reliable so repair it when it fails.

compress ignite · #7 08-17-2006, 06:01 PM

There is a very distinct possibility,WHEN the pump fails IT WILL drop the ball
bearings into the timing chain cavity. [WITH the chain,sprockets,timing tension
rails,etc... AT RISK of deflating your retirement nest egg.]

toknow · #8 08-17-2006, 09:03 PM

Does this mean that it applies only to the 602.xxx Not the 603.xxx engines?
thanks

sixto · #9 08-18-2006, 03:13 AM

61x pumps can be rebuilt, 60x pumps are disposable. 60x pumps don't fail catastrophically. The bearing races displace which sends balls into the timing chain area. That's the catastrophe. I know a fellow whose SDL oil pump sucked one such bearing. I don't know how it made it through the screen but his insurance paid enough to get the engine rebuilt.

A further problem is when the bearing races displace the lever arm scores the IP timer cam. One more uncheap thing to replace.

To the 60x pump's credit, how many posts are there about 60x pumps not providing enough vacuum?

Sixto
... stay tuned

Hit Man X · #10 08-18-2006, 03:42 AM

Be safe and change it.

toknow · #11 08-18-2006, 08:47 AM

Well, we are talking about a part that costs $400 in an older car. Can I use a used one (if I can find it) or it will not be safe. Is there a way to maintain and check the pump? Or is there a way to notice any problem in the vacuum as an indicator for a coming pump failure.
thank you all,

Hit Man X · #12 08-18-2006, 09:02 AM

I have a used one I installed on my SDL. They go for about $200 on the high end.

dieseldiehard · #13 08-18-2006, 01:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diesel Giant

The pumps rarely "self destruct" mostly the check valves and seals go out. Only is th rocker arm assembly breaks would it destroy the pump. The pump is very reliable so repair it when it fails.

You are obviously not familiar with the pump used in the 603 engines!
They were early failures when the arm that has the small bearing in it disintegrated, jamming into the timing ramp that is driven by the chain, then the engine is self destruct. Then there are the small bearings that fell out and get into the oil pump. I had posted pictures of a failed one but the posts were lost when the server failed. I'll have to look for the pics. This isn't the 617 we are talking about. YOU DO NOT REPAIR THE 603 VAC PUMPS!
DO NOT LISTEN TO ANY ADVISE FROM 617 OWNERS ON THIS THREAD!

dieseldiehard · #14 08-18-2006, 01:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by 80300dbenz

does that mean that anyone who has an old style pump should replace it?

What engine do you have?
617 NO!
603 YES!
Do you know what engine you have?
Its the 603 that we were discussing in this thread, namely the '86 and '87 300D/TD/SDL.
All others are 617, this advise and thread does not apply!

dieseldiehard · #15 08-18-2006, 01:09 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by toknow

Well, we are talking about a part that costs $400 in an older car. Can I use a used one (if I can find it) or it will not be safe. Is there a way to maintain and check the pump? Or is there a way to notice any problem in the vacuum as an indicator for a coming pump failure.
thank you all,

NO and NO and NO.
Be Safe and Change It!