5-speed swap progress - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

DieselCJ · #1 10-25-2006, 09:13 PM

Well, I finally got around to installing the 5-speed yesterday. The transmission is bolted up; the shifter, linkage, and pedals may go in tomorrow.

I do need a hose to go between the master brake res. and the clutch master. Will fuel injection hose work (or will it break down due to brake fluid)? I also need to make up a new metric steel line between the clutch master and slave hose.

Overall it is going extremely well, the space is a bit more cramped, but handling a small alum. case > the 145 lb cast iron T-19+D300 which is in my Jeep.

Manual flywheel being bolted up after rear main seal replacement:

Clutch on flywheel:

Manual vs. auto:

Cleaning input shaft:

Friends beer can disposal (it was worth having them there though)

-John

t walgamuth · #2 10-25-2006, 09:47 PM

the correct hose is brake line. you can usually buy generic lines at the friendly auto parts place. they have a large selection of lengths for very reasonable prices.

dont even think of using fuel injection hoses.

tom w

DieselCJ · #3 10-25-2006, 10:06 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by t walgamuth

the correct hose is brake line. you can usually buy generic lines at the friendly auto parts place. they have a large selection of lengths for very reasonable prices.

dont even think of using fuel injection hoses. tom w

Oops... typo, it should read "I do need a hose to go between the master brake res. and the clutch master." This is the hose which gravity feeds the clutch master in the cabin with fluid.

I tried a few parts stores for the steel line going between the clutch master and slave, they all have SAE, one had "euro" ones, but they were too small.

I found the original fittings will slip over a 1/4" (SAE) tube, but it is more snug than the original. I will try another parts store tomorrow.

DieselCJ · #4 10-27-2006, 06:08 PM

Shifter in, now for the pedals and linkage.

t walgamuth · #5 10-28-2006, 10:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DieselCJ

Oops... typo, it should read "I do need a hose to go between the master brake res. and the clutch master." This is the hose which gravity feeds the clutch master in the cabin with fluid.

I tried a few parts stores for the steel line going between the clutch master and slave, they all have SAE, one had "euro" ones, but they were too small.

I found the original fittings will slip over a 1/4" (SAE) tube, but it is more snug than the original. I will try another parts store tomorrow.

oh, then any hose that will stand brake fluid would be fine.

tom w

DieselCJ · #6 10-28-2006, 08:33 PM

OK folks.... got everything installed, but cannot figure out how toe bleed the clutch!!!!!!!!1

I tried one person operating the pedal while the other opens and closes the bleeder screw.

Then tried mighty-vac'ing from the bleeder screw.

Then connected the mighty-vac to the feed tube disconnected from the master res, and pulled brake fluid up from the bleeder screw via. a tube, the fluid was sucked up, but bubbles came out up top.

Even when the bleeder was closed air still bubbled up, checked all connections and found nothing.

I searched and found someone who just pumped the pedal 50-100 times (which is the only thing that works for my Jeep), which did not work for mine.

Any ideas?
Thanks, John

DieselCJ · #7 10-28-2006, 09:56 PM

Good news, now there is enough pressure to return the pedal!

I am going to let it sit overnight then try again.

Gordo · #8 10-28-2006, 10:59 PM

I struggled with both of the problems you have described. The line between the clutch master and the slave can be fabricated with SAE tubing, the old metric fittings, and a flaring tool. Not the best but, it worked for me.

To bleed the clutch... I did mine by connecting the bleeder screw on the right front brake caliper to the bleeder screw on the slave cyl. Open the slave bleeder, then have an assistant pump the brake while you open and close the brake bleeder accordingly to make sure that fluid can only pass through the hose tourd the slave. Keep an eye on the level of fluid in the res. when no bubbles are come out in to the res. close both bleeders and you should be in business. Mercedes recomends a special tool to pressure fluid through the system, but this way worked for me.

yellowbenz · #9 10-28-2006, 11:30 PM

I don't think it is necessary to open and close the bleeder on the brake caliper. Leave it open, pump the pedal and when the bubbles have ceased to appear in the reservoir you are done. Close both bleeder valves and should be good to go. At least that is how I have done it with my 240D and the system should be the same on the 190D.

Kevin
1979 240D manual
1984 190D manual

bgkast · #10 10-29-2006, 05:13 PM

This is how I did it:

One person operating the clutch, the other person under the car with a wrench.

Open the bleeder when the clutch operator says that they are depressing the clutch, close the bleeder while the clutch operator is holding the clutch down, have operator release pedal, repeat.

t walgamuth · #11 10-29-2006, 06:59 PM

those clutches can be a bear to bleed!

tom w

#12 10-29-2006, 07:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bgkast

This is how I did it:

One person operating the clutch, the other person under the car with a wrench.

Open th...

Same here. I never got the caliper method to work.

yellowbenz · #13 10-29-2006, 09:19 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bgkast

This is how I did it:

One person operating the clutch, the other person under the car with a wrench.

Open the bleeder when the clutch operator says that they are depressing the clutch, close the bleeder while the clutch operator is holding the clutch down, have operator release pedal, repeat.

You have to keep pumping the brake pedal to force fluid through the clutch system and evacuate the air. It's not drawing fluid or air back into the system when you take your foot off the brake so no need to mess with the bleeder screws until you are done. By myself I did it this way and it worked like a charm. This is well described in many threads. I've got to do this again on my 190D because of a leaking clutch master cylinder that needs to be replaced.

Kevin

1979 240D manual
1984 190D manual

DieselCJ · #14 10-29-2006, 11:37 PM

Normally I bleed brake systems using either gravity, two-man method, or mighty-vac (pulling fluid down to the bleeder).

I will try the caliper bleed screw method.

DieselCJ · #15 11-02-2006, 06:38 PM

WOOHOO! Done! (well, nearly).

The new master, intake hose, and 2-man bleeding solved the hydraulics problem.

Now to diagnose the slack in the drivelne during sudden deceleration after acceleration. My upper and lower control arm bushings as well as a couple sub-frame bushings are in poor shape.

I will post all parts and part numbers used in the swap soon.