Parts Catalog Accessories Catalog How To Articles Tech Forums
Call Pelican Parts at 888-280-7799
Shopping Cart Cart | Project List | Order Status | Help




Go Back   PeachParts Mercedes ShopForum > Technical Information and Support > Diesel Discussion

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #16  
Old 11-05-2006, 03:31 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 18,352
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hatterasguy View Post
MB did make marine engines, you run across them in old Euro boats every so often. They are a rare bird in this country though.

As far as marinesing a 616 I think that would be throwing good money after bad. I have never seen an automotive engine successfully marinised.

Most sailboat auxiliaries are good for several thousand hours, so buy accordingly. You can probably re power yourself for $5k-$10k when the time comes. For example Mack Boring sells rebuilt Yanmars at very good prices.

Don't forget that space is very limited and the 616 is much larger than most of the engines it would be replacing.
Isn't the Perkins 4-108 used in both automotive and marine applications just like the OM352?
__________________
1977 300d 70k--sold 08
1985 300TD 185k+
1984 307d 126k--sold 8/03
1985 409d 65k--sold 06
1984 300SD 315k--daughter's car
1979 300SD 122k--sold 2/11
1999 Fuso FG Expedition Camper
1993 GMC Sierra 6.5 TD 4x4
1982 Bluebird Wanderlodge CAT 3208--Sold 2/13
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 11-05-2006, 04:08 PM
ForcedInduction
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
http://www.dmv-bootsdiesel.de/Englisher%20Index/Lieferprogramm/MercedesBenz/mercedesbenz.html

http://www.keysyachts.com (I HATE music on webpages )

I've searched for half an hour and I can't find the boat with the two OM617's.

Last edited by whunter; 12-18-2009 at 08:46 AM. Reason: repaired link
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 11-05-2006, 05:54 PM
Hatterasguy's Avatar
Zero
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Milford, CT
Posts: 19,267
Probably, but you don't see those Perkins that often anymore either. They are all extremly old at this point.

Buy a boat with a servicable engine. Don't buy a fixer upper unless you know what you are doing. If not it will just cost you a lot of time, money, and frustration.
__________________
2017 Chevy Silverado 1500 LTZ
Mercedes??

"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government."
-Thomas Jefferson
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 11-05-2006, 06:09 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 18,352
I wasn't intending to imply that repowering with a 616 is the best choice, only that there are some engines that work equally well in marine and automotive applications. I believe British Ford vans used the Perkins 4-108 for quite a few years. There is also a small French car that uses a Yanmar diesel but I don't know if it is one of their marine diesels.
I wouldn't hesitate to buy a sailboat with a 616 or a 4-108 in it as long as the engine was in good condition or the price reflected the cost of replacing with the same engine.
__________________
1977 300d 70k--sold 08
1985 300TD 185k+
1984 307d 126k--sold 8/03
1985 409d 65k--sold 06
1984 300SD 315k--daughter's car
1979 300SD 122k--sold 2/11
1999 Fuso FG Expedition Camper
1993 GMC Sierra 6.5 TD 4x4
1982 Bluebird Wanderlodge CAT 3208--Sold 2/13
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 11-05-2006, 06:50 PM
Bruce Kennedy's Avatar
Glutton for punishment
 
Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: Cincinnati Ohio
Posts: 230
Marine Mercedes

If I were to put a mercedes diesel in a sailboat in a saltwater enviroment I would choose a non turbo model, galvanize the oil pan, and cool it with a keel cooler. If you dont want to affect windward performance when sailing dont go with anything heavier than the origional engine ( heavier engine and you'll have to remove some ballast to get her to sit on her original lines and this will affect windward performance). Also take into account that it doestnt take much horsepower to push a 40' displacment hull. If you go too big it will be underworked and run too cool resulting in problems.

I just purchased a 83 240d with 140k for $200. The plan is to put the engine in a friends boat that we are going to turn into a sternwheeler. The engine will be keel cooled and drive a hydraulic pump for the sternwheel.

If you were talking about putting one in a trawler yacht weight wouldnt be a consideration. My 44' Trawler's engine and gear weighs 3800 lbs!, and generates 80hp @ 1600 rpm.

Too many cars, tucks, motorcycles, and boats to take the time to list.
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 11-05-2006, 07:19 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Wakefield, RI
Posts: 2,145
I have to agree with Hatterasguy on this one. Repowering with a homebrewed setup would be difficult and expensive unless you are a machinist/welder/fabricator.

The only statement I take issue with is the "never seen a successfully marinized auto engine" Pretty much EVERY marine engine with the exception of large "ship" engines have landlubber counterparts. Yanmar, Universal, Nanni, Perkins, Westerbeke, etc. all sailboat auxilliaries, are converted tractor or industrial engines. Detroit, Cummins, Yanmar, etc. the large engines used in powerboats are all truck, tractor and industrial engines. Successful conversion depends on who did the conversion. It is pretty easy to source the correct marine parts to get it right. Taking a known land based diesel and converting it to a known marine type is simple parts swapping. Converting a land based diesel that has no marine cousin is likely to be a PITA.

If you were to put a 616 into a sailboat it would have to be a fairly decent sized boat. IIRC, 616's are 67hp or so? That is plenty for a 50+foot sailboat. I have a 32hp Universal in my 38 foot sailboat and thats quite enough.

RT
__________________
When all else fails, vote from the rooftops!
84' Mercedes Benz 300D Anthracite/black, 171K
03' Volkswagen Jetta TDI blue/black, 93K
93' Chevrolet C2500HD ExCab 6.5TD, Two-tone blue, 252K
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 11-05-2006, 08:58 PM
Hatterasguy's Avatar
Zero
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Milford, CT
Posts: 19,267
Sure the block is the same maybe the heads, everything else is different.
__________________
2017 Chevy Silverado 1500 LTZ
Mercedes??

"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government."
-Thomas Jefferson

Last edited by Hatterasguy; 11-05-2006 at 09:06 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 11-05-2006, 09:27 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Pac NW
Posts: 690
Volvo-Penta.

They used the B18 engine pretty successfully in small craft, no?

Jay.
__________________
On the road, currently:
'83 300D (German spec.) 168k mi. - - Wolfgang (tucked snugly away for the winter!)
'87 300D 375k mi. - finally went over to "The Dark Side"
'87 300TD 225k mi.
Cannondale 66cm CAAD5 w/Campy/Jamis Aurora
Hujsak Custom Fixie/Landshark Track Shark Custom/Ahearne Custom 29'er
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 11-05-2006, 09:32 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 6,761
It's already been done with the 616/617 by a Italian company if I remember correctly on a wide scale for quite some time. I can't recall the name of the company off the top of my head, but it was successful and reliable. Nothing wrong with putting a thru-hull in and using a heat exchanger instead of a radiator- just make sure the heat exchanger is large enough, and of course you'll need to power some water thru the heat exchanger by a pump- belt driven prefered. Use a "ricer" K&N type filter- as there is very little dust in a marine environment and that is the standard filter anyways for less than 1400HP marine diesel engines. Do some checking and we'll find the name of the company... it's not a common name, but give me a day or two and I'll find it.
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 11-06-2006, 07:55 AM
Shorebilly's Avatar
Marine Engineer (retired)
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Location: West Virginia
Posts: 1,268
Holes in the water.....

Folks,

Amoung other things, when I first retired I lived aboard an old Hunter at the Mobile Yacht Club, and the Bear Point Marina in Orange Beach, AL!!

A sailboat makes a far larger hole in your wallet than does a home on the land. Trust me.....I know from experience....

I lived the life of Riley for a few years, until my daughter got old enough to need the stateroom...and I slept on a 1/4 berth for a summer. I then purchased a house a coupla blocks from the marina.....was really hard to do both!!! The house did appreciate in value, big time!!! The sailboat depreciated in value...at a far slower rate than the house appreciated....but depreciation is a factor when living on a sailboat.

As far as re-engining a sailboat......there are a lot of factors involved.....a typical marine cooling system uses a belt driven "raw water" pump to circulate water thru a heat exchanger and then to the exhaust system, to overboard. The heat exchanger has coolant on the engine side.....circulating via the engine's cooling water pump....and an expansion tank located a bit higher than the "entire" cooling system.....

Personally, I would use a non-turbo engine.....if you chose to follow this route.

It may be a good idea if you intend to sail to Africa and/or the Middle East....there are lots of old Benzes in those areas for spare parts if necessary....perhaps a 616 engine from a 240D would be the best choice...67HP should be plenty....

Also, when designing your cooling system......try to run your hot coolant thru a water heater.....so that you can take a shower after a hard day of "motoring" thru the inland waterway.......

Been there....
SB
__________________

Diesels:
'85 300D, "Max, Blue Benz", 155K, 27.0 MPG
'84 190D 2.2, "Eva, Brown Benz", 142K, 40.2 MPG
'77 240D (parts car)
'67 Eicher ES 202 Tractor "Otto" (2cyl, Air Cooled, 30HP)
Gassers:
'94 Ford F-150, "Henry", 170K (300 Six) 17.5 MPG
'85 190E 2.3, 148K....Parts Car
'58 Dodge W300M Powerwagon (Flat Fenders) Less than 10 MPG
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old 11-06-2006, 09:48 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 6,761
Nanni is the company name, I just did a google on "mercedes marine engines"... I found quite a bit. They no longer produce the 61X version, but they did.
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 11-06-2006, 10:29 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Phoenix AZ
Posts: 336
On a semi-related note

How well does a gasser turbocharged engine work for boat duty? I'm not enough of a boater to really get a feel for the various choices, but I'm wondering because it's hard, say, to build much boost in 1st in most cars, but easy in 5th.

Reason why I ask- was out on the BIL's 18 ft I/O with Chevy Vortec V6 power. Saw that the motor was around 4500-5000 revs when running at a good clip.

Saw a '70s vintage speedboat, the kind which usually has a big V8 inboard, rumble by on the water. Know where a similar one could be had for very cheap.

Have an Audi 5 cylinder turbo motor, complete, sitting under my workbench. These motors can stomp any GM V6 short of a Buick GN on land. Got to thinking about how much power one could make with a cold-water liquid intercooler.

that 5 cylinder/K26 scream thru straight pipes would just be bizarre on the lake, eh?
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 11-06-2006, 11:11 PM
ForcedInduction
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Quote:
Originally Posted by RobTheMod View Post
How well does a gasser turbocharged engine work for boat duty?
VERY well.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cgBc0o73CyM
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old 11-06-2006, 11:13 PM
Hatterasguy's Avatar
Zero
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Milford, CT
Posts: 19,267
Mercs new outboards are supercharged.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-2063552875566283163&q=gar+wood&hl=en

There is an odd one for ya, you RX7 guys should recognize this...
__________________
2017 Chevy Silverado 1500 LTZ
Mercedes??

"No free man shall ever be debarred the use of arms. The strongest reason for the people to retain the right to keep and bear arms is, as a last resort, to protect themselves against tyranny in government."
-Thomas Jefferson

Last edited by Hatterasguy; 11-06-2006 at 11:23 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #30  
Old 11-07-2006, 01:36 AM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Phoenix AZ
Posts: 336
Quote:
Originally Posted by ForcedInduction View Post

Thanks! Just what my inner mad scientist needed!

(Going to the garage to start thinking out the cold-water intercooler now...)
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On




All times are GMT -4. The time now is 04:19 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2011 Pelican Parts - Posts may be archived for display on the Peach Parts or Pelican Parts Website -    DMCA Registered Agent Contact Page