Great to hear more info! I do have much to say about what I read though...

1) What happened to variable rate springs? Vogtland gave one N/mm value per spring...this value should change during compression of the spring and there must be some data they can give us.

2) I reviewed the given spring rates and it seems similar to stock up front, at least compared to my car (1984 300D-T W123.133), but need to know unsprung lengths. My front springs are 54.3 N/mm and rears are 52.3 N/mm. Unsprung lengths (important for calculating ride height adjustment) are 450mm, and 371mm respectively. I found this data in the MB chassis manual based on the listed exclusive wire diameters measured with a digital caliper. My part numbers should be F:1233214104 R:1233214104 .

3) Relating to comment 2, no numbers were provided for unsprung length. Can they provide those? Also, coil outside diameter would be nice to verify. Some of this may be compensated for by spring pads between chassis variations. I'm sure they may not have all their calculations finished though.

4) The MB chassis manual lists both the 300D-T and 300CD-T with same curb weight at 1625kg (3585lb)...do they know what they are talking about with their coupe comment? (Just in case anyone wants to know...1715kg, 3780lb for the 300TD-T)

Sorry about being so critical , but I want to verify they will match up to the requirements of our cars . Do they need suspension measurements and other data that we/I could find and provide? Let me know if I could help.

Thanks again, rudolfgreen, for all youv'e done!

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Dave

2002 Audi S6 Avant
1983 300D
1984 300D (sold)
1990 560SEL (sold)

bio, great response. you are certifiably guru status with all of the specs you have provided,
and will definitely pass along your words verbatim. being critical is critical.

hopefully the engineers are digesting the last email,
and we can compile a bit of bc, bg, omega, forced, and dare i say thedon
for another email back to them next week.. thanks for the productive input.

Im only worried about the ride and how much lower the car will be. No more body roll and maybe 2-2.5 inches lower and I'll be happy

I would definatly be interested in a set of lower springs.

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81 240d

I've got a line on some frign sweet Penta's that will be coming my way in the summer all the way from england.... wooo.... They will look sano with some lowering springs

Is all of this going to come together before MAY07?

__________________
Current Stable:
1994 S500 v140, 210k miles, white with grey.

Former Mercedes in the Stable:
1983 300CD Turbo diesel 515k mi sold (rumor has it, that it has 750k miles on it now)
1984 300CD Turbo Diesel 150 k mi sold
1982 300D Turbo Diesel 225 sold
1987 300D Turbo Diesel 255k mi sold
1988 300 CE AMG Hammer 15k mi sold
1986 "300E" Amg Hammer 88k mi sold (it was really a 200, not even an E (124.020)
1992 500E 156k mi sold
etc.

Well any news?

unfortunately no new news.. and really hoping to have these before spring. keep you guys posted for sure.

Springs before spring
Can't hardly wait.

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Mercury is a boxer

1984 300d
1999 Prelude
Medici road bike
Klein touring bike
Klein mtn bike

Do these suspensions have enough adjustability to compensate for the increased...negative camber? Or are there camber plates you need to get. Or find. Or request a production run of

I've blown through a set of tires within 12K miles because of shot bushings in the front end and it ain't no fun. Not with a car that handles like a W123 anyways.

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1985 CA 300D Turbo , 213K mi

From Vogtland NA:

Sorry for the delay. Too many projects going at once.

Included are the details concerning the 6 cyl / Diesel spring specs.

The drop on the car will be approximately 50 mm (2") in the front. The nominal drop for the rear will be 40 mm (1.6"). However, that can be altered with spring pads. Since the front wheel arch has a larger opening we want to have rake in the car for a better overall appearance.

The spring rates.
F: 290 lb/in.
R: 360 lb/in.

The designs are complete so we can commence production on these as soon as you have your orders together and a 25% deposit. As I stated if you get 15 orders or more the kit cost will be $319.99. If you can get 25 kits or more then the price per kit is $201.59. I would average about $30 - 35 for shipping. West coast would be less East coast higher. The kit weight will be around 45 - 47#.

Let me know if you need anything else.

Few thoughts here.. 25+ kits=$210.59 each!!
My main concern is to have the drop adjusted to 40mm front, 30mm rear.. would like to hear some input on this.
Realize he cited "6cyl/Diesel Spring Specs", but have repeated our weight concerns and feel the point made.

With the numbers given (figuring 25+ kits), actual S/H, and using Paypal Merchant Services..
(easiest 3rd party solution we all are familiar with; results in small finance charge)
figure the final rate to be +/-$250 depending on where you live.

Vogtland will start the run as soon as a 25% deposit is received for 25 orders.
To keep things straight all orders will require a $75 deposit, with full payment due upon drop date.
The onus for all of this is on me, take concern this is for forum members, not an ebay offer, please act consciously.
So with that aside, here is as simply as can figure to break things down.

To participate in the group buy, email your interest to vogtland123@hotmail.com
You will receive an invoice from Paypal (make sure the link you click reads https) to initiate a deposit.
Will update all as things continue, including periodic active lists of commitments.
Delivery should be within 6 weeks (as have been promised). As always, all positive input appreciated.

Anybody have a answer to this? I'm intetrested to know too.

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1979 240D- 316K miles - VGT Turbo, Intercooler, Stick Shift, Many Other Mods - Daily Driver

1982 300SD - 232K miles - Wife's Daily Driver

1986 560SL - Wife's red speed machine

The only easy adjustment I know of is the front toe angle. I also noticed the front guide rods have threads for adjusting the length...is that for adjusting the caster?

There is a "front lower control arm inner bushing eccentric pin kit" available on the parts link, but I'm not sure if that is for adjusting or a standard part...if it is NOT standard, it would definitely affect camber. Anybody know?

Also available, are eccentric trailing arm bushings used for repair or adjustment on the rear axle. Talk about a PITA to adjust/tweak those after they're in the car. Anyone have more information on these?

EDIT: I looked in my FSM last night and found reference to chapter 40-320 for front end alignment and 40-330 for rear end alignment. Those are nowhere to be found on the 123 manual, but I did find them on the 126 manual The suspensions between these two chassis are very similar, if not identical for the early model 126s. What I did find though, is camber, castor, and toe is adjustable for the front. The rear only mentioned procedures for toe, but it reads that camber is also affected by toe adjustments.

Toe and castor up front are adjusted by changing tie rod and guide rod lengths (threaded ends). Camber up front is adjusted by changing the position of the eccentric bolt at the lower-inner control arm bushing (it is standard equipment). Toe (& camber) is adjusted "after a wreck" by replacing standard trailing arm bushings with eccentric ones and lining them up correctly.

__________________
Dave

2002 Audi S6 Avant
1983 300D
1984 300D (sold)
1990 560SEL (sold)

Thanks for the update! That's a great price too.

My only concerns are the ride height and "progressive rate".

I'm thinking that 35/30mm lowering front/rear might be better also. It would look good to go lower, but I don't think my engine's "chin" will like it when i hit a speed bump! I'm not completely sold on the rake aspect (as my numbers above show). Any other's opinions on the proposed rake? Check this page out http://www.geocities.com/johan01.geo/AMG/ I know there is more area in the front wheel arch, but I'd rather have a level ride like shown in the classic AMG photos.

What happened to progressive rate springs that were mentioned at the beginning of this thread? Those would really be good to have, especially when we are talking about removing some suspension travel "buffer" between normal ride height and the stops.

__________________
Dave

2002 Audi S6 Avant
1983 300D
1984 300D (sold)
1990 560SEL (sold)

just to check again, this is for the front and rear springs right? i will be able to pay after March 16th, will that be ok?

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Grey '91 350SDL 214k Dad's car
Beige '81 240D 4 Speed 254k SOLD
Blue '82 300D 225k SOLD
White '95 E300D 46k SOLD
Blue '87 190D 2.5 Turbo 315k SOLD
Brown '80 240D 4 Speed 716k SOLD
Beige '80 300D N/A 119k SOLD
Blue '85 300D Model 186k T-Boned