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  #1  
Old 11-28-2006, 10:24 PM
crashone's Avatar
1983 300SD, 4 speeed
 
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Location: Raleighish, NC
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Turbo seals, valve stem seals and blue smoke...

Hello- OK, I hope some one can give me some ideas here. When I first start out in the morning or after the car has been sitting for a few hours I get some blueish smoke. Not much but enough to say hmmmm. At night I can see smoke in the headlights behind me if I get on it a little, but I think some of that is normal diesel. I have noticed that there seems to be a bit of oil in the air filter and some in the turbo inlet when I have removed the "u" tube. I am thinking maybe valve stem seals need replacing. Has anyone else had the same experience and did replacing the valve stem seals correct this? Also which seals could be going on the turbo? Thanks for any advice.

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1983 300SD, 4 speed
1994 C280
1987 300TD wagon
1996 HD Road King

Ride in Peace Eric Peterson, Harley of Macon
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  #2  
Old 11-28-2006, 10:36 PM
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My 79 TD does the same thing (except for the turbo part )...I would love to hear the consensus on the remedy.
How much oil does yours burn? Mine is going through about 1 quart every 600 or so miles. and the M1 5W40 ain't cheap.
John
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John HAUL AWAY, OR CRUSHED CARS!!! HELP ME keep the cars out of the crusher! A/C Thread
"as I ride with my a/c on... I have fond memories of sweaty oily saturdays and spewing R12 into the air. THANKS for all you do!

My drivers:
1987 190D 2.5Turbo
1987 190D 2.5Turbo
1987 190D 2.5-5SPEED!!!

1987 300TD
1987 300TD
1994GMC 2500 6.5Turbo truck... I had to put the ladder somewhere!
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  #3  
Old 11-28-2006, 11:54 PM
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Same situation here, but only noticeable when it gets cold. Some smoke on startup and I burn a quart every 6-700 miles. Might be leaking a good portion of that too though. Moderate blow-by when I take the oil cap off. Interested to hear the verdict on this one.
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  #4  
Old 11-29-2006, 12:00 AM
RAYMOND485
 
Join Date: May 2005
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Valve Stem Seals

1984 300d Turbo 141,000
Replace The Valve Stem Seals $12.00 Diy 4-8 Hrs If Smoke At Long Idle, Replace Valve Springs $50.00 Same Time And Camshaft $175.00 And 10 Rocker Arms $280.00 Also New Camshaft Bearing Towers 5 Ea $150.00
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  #5  
Old 11-29-2006, 01:31 AM
ForcedInduction
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RAYMOND485 View Post
Replace Valve Springs $50.00 Same Time And Camshaft $175.00 And 10 Rocker Arms $280.00 Also New Camshaft Bearing Towers 5 Ea $150.00
DO NOT waste money on a new springs, cam, towers, or rockers unless the are worn out of specs!

There is absolutely no reason to blow $655 unless you need them.
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  #6  
Old 11-29-2006, 09:56 AM
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try

checking your oil seperator in the air filter. make sure the oil can drain down the tube back into your engine. If not, it will get sucked in and burned as fuel.
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  #7  
Old 11-29-2006, 07:37 PM
crashone's Avatar
1983 300SD, 4 speeed
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Raleighish, NC
Posts: 664
Thanks for the replies. I don't seem to burn that much oil of course I have had a few leaks that I've been tightening up! Can anyone tell me about the turbo seals? I know I need to replace the ones on the "U" tube, what else? I have read the threads on turbo rebuilds and may try that in the spring. I guess I'll try the valve stem seals as soon as I can and see if that makes a difference. Thanks.
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If it ain't broke take it apart and find out why.

1983 300SD, 4 speed
1994 C280
1987 300TD wagon
1996 HD Road King

Ride in Peace Eric Peterson, Harley of Macon
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  #8  
Old 11-29-2006, 07:58 PM
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Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: jersey
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What you might have is a blow by the piston rings from to much crankcase pressure - ( OR ) if the air filter air oil seperator is clogged like mine was oil leaks out from around the rubber pipe on top of the cam cover and down the side of the cover and will also leak under the alternator at the point wheir the vent pipe that conects the oil pan to the air filter -- look at right side of pan for lots of liquid -- at that point mine was lumping globs of a thick guey oil sluge ( it mixed with dirt entering the front of the radiator ) it than went into intake and almost filled it to the point that the air was being stoped from coming into the motor -- i took the intake off a gallon of paint stripper and all the simple green i owned later it than colggggged 2 oil filters on my wash tank wrecked the cleaner and 3 large bottel brushes and it was as good as new -- what a mess if i had to do that again i would just buy a manifold -- 6 hours and 165 bucks wort of stuff 350 a gallon for safty kleen and it was garbage when i was done my shirt and swets the pressure washer was a mess the shop was trashed never again but i fixed it hahahahahahahahhahahahahh -- -- jz
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  #9  
Old 11-29-2006, 08:15 PM
vstech's Avatar
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RAYMOND485 View Post
1984 300d Turbo 141,000
Replace The Valve Stem Seals $12.00 Diy 4-8 Hrs If Smoke At Long Idle, Replace Valve Springs $50.00 Same Time And Camshaft $175.00 And 10 Rocker Arms $280.00 Also New Camshaft Bearing Towers 5 Ea $150.00
great list of things you did... did it help?
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John HAUL AWAY, OR CRUSHED CARS!!! HELP ME keep the cars out of the crusher! A/C Thread
"as I ride with my a/c on... I have fond memories of sweaty oily saturdays and spewing R12 into the air. THANKS for all you do!

My drivers:
1987 190D 2.5Turbo
1987 190D 2.5Turbo
1987 190D 2.5-5SPEED!!!

1987 300TD
1987 300TD
1994GMC 2500 6.5Turbo truck... I had to put the ladder somewhere!
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  #10  
Old 11-29-2006, 09:53 PM
vstech's Avatar
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Quote:
Originally Posted by resago View Post
checking your oil separator in the air filter. make sure the oil can drain down the tube back into your engine. If not, it will get sucked in and burned as fuel.
hmm,
that will help a turbo motor, but what about the N/A motors? the pcv goes straight into the intake, no oil separator. would it be worth it to install one? can a N/A motor use one? I have seen some for sale, but I may just try to build one.
John
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John HAUL AWAY, OR CRUSHED CARS!!! HELP ME keep the cars out of the crusher! A/C Thread
"as I ride with my a/c on... I have fond memories of sweaty oily saturdays and spewing R12 into the air. THANKS for all you do!

My drivers:
1987 190D 2.5Turbo
1987 190D 2.5Turbo
1987 190D 2.5-5SPEED!!!

1987 300TD
1987 300TD
1994GMC 2500 6.5Turbo truck... I had to put the ladder somewhere!
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  #11  
Old 11-29-2006, 10:03 PM
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Location: central Texas
Posts: 17,281
Quote:
Originally Posted by crashone View Post
When I first start out in the morning or after the car has been sitting for a few hours I get some blueish smoke.
That is the classic valve stem seal leaking symptom. They are cheap ... be sure to get the later design with the gas sealing lip and install carefully. I would not do this job without replacing the springs... they are cheap and do get metal fatigue over the years... even just sitting with the engine not running some are going to be in the compressed position... they are cheap also given the labor needed to go back and replace them if you don't do it when you are already there... also consider putting in new valve rotators...cheap also...
The next step up... cam, bearings and towers... I would only do if they show to be past tolerances given in the FSM.
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  #12  
Old 11-30-2006, 12:47 PM
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Location: Detroit, MI
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Quote:
Originally Posted by resago View Post
checking your oil seperator in the air filter. make sure the oil can drain down the tube back into your engine. If not, it will get sucked in and burned as fuel.

The E-Class owners bible gives a nice cutaway view of the oil seperator. I have to check and see if mine is clogged.

As of right now the entire intake side is caked over - I just spent hours cleaning the manifold out and painting it. The intake valves look horrid, if you have this problem I'd look into cleaning/replacing them.

The Procedure for this is as follows:
-Remove crossover pipe, and manafold.
-Remove Valve cover (have replacement gasket)
-Now's a good time to replace all those cracked/missing injector line holders
-Put first cylinder at TDC (turn nut on PS pump CW)
-Procede to start cleaning valves off (use a screwdriver, and an assortment of picks) (The use of brakecleener type products isnt recomended, but could be used, as your vacuuming it out whaile at TDC)
-To getto the other side of the valve, turn it via it's top (valve cover side)
-Vaccum it out - be Sure to get everything
-Continue for the next 4-5 cylinders (this allpies to OM60x engines)

Expect it to take about 20 hours (as per whunter's instructions) It's MUCH cheaper/easier than taking the head off
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  #13  
Old 12-01-2006, 10:12 PM
crashone's Avatar
1983 300SD, 4 speeed
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Raleighish, NC
Posts: 664
Leathermang- What part are you calling a valve rotator? I haven't heard that yet. Are these the valve guides? Thanks.
__________________
If it ain't broke take it apart and find out why.

1983 300SD, 4 speed
1994 C280
1987 300TD wagon
1996 HD Road King

Ride in Peace Eric Peterson, Harley of Macon
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  #14  
Old 12-02-2006, 12:06 AM
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Join Date: Sep 2001
Location: central Texas
Posts: 17,281
In the Haynes manual they are called ' rotocaps'.... page 90.

I do not see them discussed in the 617.95 FSM... but the picture on page 03.8-345/4 F2 shows it numbered item # 69.

They are only on the exhaust valves...and they are the first thing above the valve guides.
Each time the valve is activated it rotates it slightly.. this keeps the valve and the seat worn and cooled more evenly and adds lots of life to a valve... some cars have them on both the exhaust and intake...
I do not see them in the exploded drawings in the Performance Products catalog so they may be Dealer items only... they would be a replace ' on principle' item just like the springs in my book... can't cost much and do lots of good.
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  #15  
Old 12-02-2006, 09:28 AM
crashone's Avatar
1983 300SD, 4 speeed
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Raleighish, NC
Posts: 664
Thank you for the clarification, I will check the haynes out. I was looking at performance product and did not see them, that is why I asked. I guess I'll talk to the dealer and see what they have to allow. Well I'm off to some junk yards today to see what I can see.

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If it ain't broke take it apart and find out why.

1983 300SD, 4 speed
1994 C280
1987 300TD wagon
1996 HD Road King

Ride in Peace Eric Peterson, Harley of Macon
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