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  #31  
Old 06-13-2007, 07:31 PM
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Best bet, (been there) is the diaphram in vac pump, kit is about $20 from dealer, I think about 4 bolts to take cover off, carefully remove old, watch how it comes out, put back, probably post here on this, clean as much as possible the vent tube to air cleaner, should fix, have you had any trouble stopping, door locks, brakes hard? Strong indicators.
ron

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  #32  
Old 06-14-2007, 12:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kerry edwards View Post
You still need to figure out if the oil is coming from the crankcase vent hose or up the drain tube, so yes, I think so.
Please bear with me... some oil has always come up from the crankcase since the time I bought the car: initially it made quite a mess at the connection with the breather hose (on top of the crankcase). Then, after I placed a couple of screw clamps, two years ago, on both breather hose elbows (at both ends of the breather hose), the leaking stopped and the oil circulated properly from crankcase to manifold intake...

It worked wonderfully for two years that way, so I tend to doubt it's that (but I might be wrong). If I disconnect the lower end of the hose and put it in a plastic bottle, of course the oil is going to get into it...

The oil causing all this mess, as I said in my original post, COMES UP THE MANIFOLD INTAKE (the drain tube, to use your wording) - that I know already, since the "tube" on which the air filter is fasted gets covered up with a lot of engine oil from the inside. Again, the oil comes up from the manifold intake, gets through the air filter, then drips down to the floor...

In my car, the breather hose from the crankcase connects directly to the manifold intake, way BELOW the air filter housing (and NOT to the air filter housing). How would it be possible, in your opinion, that the oil, once it gets into the manifold intake from the crankcase, then comes up into the air filter housing?? It would be logical for it to circulate again in the engine, right?

I was thinking, could this problem be caused by a strong engine blowby, causing the oil to come up from the engine, through the manifold intake, through the air filter?

In view of the above, if you still think that I should do that test with the plastic bottle, I will do it. Please let me know...

Thanks...
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  #33  
Old 06-14-2007, 12:48 AM
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Originally Posted by arew264 View Post
Personally, I would try to get that vacuum line off and get it cleaned, dried, and reinstalled, just to make sure.
OK...

What I haven't yet grasped and I need to understand is, if it were the vacuum line/vacuum pump causing the problem, how so? Would the vacuum line actually suck engine oil from the manifold intake into the air filter, is that so?
If not, how?
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  #34  
Old 06-14-2007, 12:51 AM
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Originally Posted by toomany MBZ View Post
Thanks for the pic. Completely different from my turbos. To remove the fan, on turbos, a 10mm box end ground rather thin on outside, is a big help.
Yes, I have already removed the fan blade/housing a while ago, so that's no problem to me... The issue here now is to understand if I need to replace that pump diaphgram/valve checks or not...
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  #35  
Old 06-14-2007, 01:00 AM
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Originally Posted by Moorewr View Post
Best bet, (been there) is the diaphram in vac pump, kit is about $20 from dealer, I think about 4 bolts to take cover off, carefully remove old, watch how it comes out, put back, probably post here on this, clean as much as possible the vent tube to air cleaner, should fix, have you had any trouble stopping, door locks, brakes hard? Strong indicators.
ron
I am a little confused now, because before it was said earlier in this thread that if the hose from vacuum pump to air filter housing is not blackened by oil (and it is not in my case), then the problem is not caused by the vac pump diaphram...

As I said earlier, the automatic door locks never worked since I bought the car... the brakes seem to be working fine.

What's the best way to clean vent tube to air cleaner (hose from vac pump to air filter)?

Thanks...
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  #36  
Old 06-14-2007, 01:01 AM
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Originally Posted by rino View Post
OK...

What I haven't yet grasped and I need to understand is, if it were the vacuum line/vacuum pump causing the problem, how so? Would the vacuum line actually suck engine oil from the manifold intake into the air filter, is that so?
If not, how?
If the diaphragm is leaking, it forces crank case oil up through the clear tube directly into the air cleaner.
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  #37  
Old 06-14-2007, 01:14 AM
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Originally Posted by slarson80 View Post
If the diaphragm is leaking, it forces crank case oil up through the clear tube directly into the air cleaner.
OK, I see, thanks!

In my case, the oil seems to be coming up the manifold intake (drain) instead... I say this because the air filter gets uniformly blackened with engine oil (the white of the filtering paper is no longer visible), and there is plenty of oil on the inside/outside of the tube on which the air filter gets fastened... However, my assumption might be wrong...

Hopefully, all these descriptions of mine in the posts here will be sufficient to establish if I need to do go ahead and replace the diaphram, or what else...
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  #38  
Old 06-14-2007, 01:33 AM
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you can check other vacuum lines to see if there is oil in them. I'm not sure about 240D, but in my 300D there are some lines that run above the oil filter housing.Trace them up towards the driverside firewall. It's easier to see oil in the yellow lines, they are for the door locks. Pull one of the lines out of a connector. If there's ANY oil in there, the vac pump is bad. This is really easy to do, takes 2 minutes from the time you pop your hood.
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Last edited by slarson80; 06-14-2007 at 02:16 AM.
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  #39  
Old 06-14-2007, 09:12 AM
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Originally Posted by rino View Post
OK, Hopefully, all these descriptions of mine in the posts here will be sufficient to establish if I need to do go ahead and replace the diaphram, or what else...
Maybe I'm missing something here but, if the diaphragm was leaking oil it would not be making vacuum...does it produce vacuum?
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  #40  
Old 06-14-2007, 10:11 AM
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It looks like the vacuum diaphragm can be ruled out since the tube is clear and oil is coming up the intake manifold and not down thru the filter housing.

One thing I did not understand initially is that your car does not (apparantly) have an oil return line going down to the pan from the air filter housing (mine does) but the fumes/oil from the crankcase vent hose is deposited diectly into the intake manifold. Am I understanding this correctly? If this is the case, then it seems to me that disconnecting the vent hose should stop any oil from going to the intake manifold. I would try this. Put the hose in a milk bottle or something like that so the liquid can accumulate in the bottom and the fumes escape out the top.
If there is oil entering your intake manifold from some source other than the vent hose, I would be very surprised.

When you stop the car after a drive, I would remove the air filter and look down into the manifold and see what you observe.

It is a very very long shot, but I suppose it is possible that the oil return galleries have become blocked and oil is accumulating under the valve cover and getting pushed out the vent hose . This seems far fetched to me, but there does need to be some explanation for the sudden occurence.

Why was there an air filter in there that did not fit tight? Changing styles of air filter could have increased vacuum in the intake causing oil to get sucked out the vent hose. Can you describe the differences between air filters some more?
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Last edited by kerry; 06-14-2007 at 10:22 AM.
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  #41  
Old 06-14-2007, 10:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slarson80 View Post
you can check other vacuum lines to see if there is oil in them. I'm not sure about 240D, but in my 300D there are some lines that run above the oil filter housing.Trace them up towards the driverside firewall. It's easier to see oil in the yellow lines, they are for the door locks. Pull one of the lines out of a connector. If there's ANY oil in there, the vac pump is bad. This is really easy to do, takes 2 minutes from the time you pop your hood.
Thanks!!!

I just did what you suggested and pulled out both yellow lines: there is not a trace of oil in either case...
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  #42  
Old 06-14-2007, 10:44 AM
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Originally Posted by Stevo View Post
Maybe I'm missing something here but, if the diaphragm was leaking oil it would not be making vacuum...does it produce vacuum?
What's the easiest way to establish that?

Thanks...
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  #43  
Old 06-14-2007, 10:58 AM
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Originally Posted by rino View Post
What's the easiest way to establish that?

Thanks...
The best way to establish vacuum is to measure vac on the line from the pump to the brake booster and "T's" that come off of that line. Should be around 20-22 'units' of vacuum. An easier way to get some "idea" of vac is if you have functioning power brakes. A loss of vacuum means you have to push extremely hard on the brake pedal to stop the car.
I think driving around with the breather hose in a jug is the best step at this point.
Maybe I missed it, but have you verified that your oil is at the correct level?
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  #44  
Old 06-14-2007, 11:22 AM
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Thank you so much for your thoughtful answer, Kerry.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kerry edwards View Post
It looks like the vacuum diaphragm can be ruled out since the tube is clear and oil is coming up the intake manifold and not down thru the filter housing.

One thing I did not understand initially is that your car does not (apparantly) have an oil return line going down to the pan from the air filter housing (mine does) but the fumes/oil from the crankcase vent hose is deposited diectly into the intake manifold. Am I understanding this correctly?
Yes, that's the case with my car.

Quote:
If this is the case, then it seems to me that disconnecting the vent hose should stop any oil from going to the intake manifold. I would try this. Put the hose in a milk bottle or something like that so the liquid can accumulate in the bottom and the fumes escape out the top.
If there is oil entering your intake manifold from some source other than the vent hose, I would be very surprised.
OK, I'll try that later today. However, in my case, the breather hose is of a rigid type (not bendable) and it is shaped (curved) as to connect to the manifold intake. I do not know whether it will be feasible to attach a bottle to that end...

Quote:
When you stop the car after a drive, I would remove the air filter and look down into the manifold and see what you observe.

It is a very very long shot, but I suppose it is possible that the oil return galleries have become blocked and oil is accumulating under the valve cover and getting pushed out the vent hose . This seems far fetched to me, but there does need to be some explanation for the sudden occurence.
Actually I did that when someone, early in this thread, suggested that I check the breather hose for obstructions. The breather hose is perfectly clear. Besides, I did a valve adjustment job a couple of months ago, and examined the inside of the valve cover and the breather hose connection opening: it was spic & span there too...

Quote:
Why was there an air filter in there that did not fit tight? Changing styles of air filter could have increased vacuum in the intake causing oil to get sucked out the vent hose. Can you describe the differences between air filters some more?
That is something I thought and voiced early in this thread... I am glad you concur that it might be a possibility, since it seems logical to me.
The filter that had been there for a year was a FRAM CA3159. I noticed from the very beginning that it fit VERY loose (I mean, with 1/4" of space all around between inside of the filter and the tube it goes on). And yet it is what Kragen lists for my car model.
This last March the time came to change the air filter. I got the new one at AutoZone, this time an STP SA3159 (that's all they had for my car). Upon installing it I noticed right away that it fit extremely tightly, very hard to fit in, to the point I thought it was the wrong type of filter.
This problem with the oil getting into the air filter housing started around mid-May, approx a couple of months later... with the air filter being completely soaked with engine oil. I right away got a new filter, making it a point to choose a different brand (one that hopefully fit more loose). I installed a Purolator A51708 (that's what PepBoys lists for my car), and was pleasantly surprised that this filter finally fit right... But, unfortunately, it did not take care of the problem, which, by the way, seems to be getting worse.

Do you think that putting in the original filter, the FRAM which fit ridiculously loose, might be taking care of the issue? (I definitely know it is not the appropriate size for my air filter housing, even though they list it as the proper one)
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  #45  
Old 06-14-2007, 11:29 AM
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Originally Posted by JimmyL View Post
The best way to establish vacuum is to measure vac on the line from the pump to the brake booster and "T's" that come off of that line. Should be around 20-22 'units' of vacuum. An easier way to get some "idea" of vac is if you have functioning power brakes. A loss of vacuum means you have to push extremely hard on the brake pedal to stop the car.
I think driving around with the breather hose in a jug is the best step at this point.
Maybe I missed it, but have you verified that your oil is at the correct level?
The power brakes are functioning fine, I just need to apply a light pressure to stop the car. So that does not seem to be the case here.

Sure, the engine oil is at the correct level, right between the high and low marks. I know for sure because I had to add a lot of it (almost daily) during the past couple
of weeks, due to all this leaking...

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