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  #31  
Old 07-01-2007, 07:09 AM
Cervan's Avatar
Crazy mechanic.
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: olympia washington
Posts: 1,809
Quote:
Originally Posted by ForcedInduction View Post
The same guy that built a turbocharged Fiero and claimed it was not a down-draft carburated turbo gasser but a "hot-air-engine".
lol. fuel being dumped directly into the turbo. sounds healthy.

__________________
Have you ever noticed that anybody driving slower than you is an idiot, and anyone going faster than you is a maniac?

As long as they would add one additional commandment for you to keep thy religion to thyself.
George Carlin (Wonder where he is now..)

1981 240d (engine donor 1983 240d) recently rebuilt engine hurray! - No more.. fought a tree and the tree won.

pearl black 1983 240d 4speed (Converted!@$$%) atleast the tranny was rebuilt.
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  #32  
Old 07-01-2007, 12:54 PM
AHH,What's up Doc????
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,212
Quote:
Originally Posted by Cervan View Post
lol. fuel being dumped directly into the turbo. sounds healthy.
What this page doesn NOT tell you is this engine was designed for racing around a track at constant high RPM's! This design is very efficient for that, but would be lousy in the realities of day to day stop and go driving! This was for LeMan's or Monte Carlo style driving where output and power remain high at 3200 to 6000 RPM for hours! These engines don't idle very well and the fuel being dumped into the turbo once the engine is hot is NOT liquid, but vapor only! Know what you read! There are also a lot of engine designs by Smokey Yunick that deal with what you can do to your engine making it fit well into daily driving while maintaining good fuel economy! One of the things recommended is a 3 angle valve job. This will not only make your valves last longer but will increase compression as well over the long run, but know that REGULAR valve adjustments are Critical in vehicle performance and maintenance! Second, using gapless rings like Childs and Albert, Eropean parts designers for performance, will help to keep compression in your cylinders where it belongs! Note that Childs and Albert DO NOT offer Chrome piston rings, but get them your corrct bore size and they will get them to you. If you have the courage to get Smokey Yunick's power secrets and read it all the way through, you should become aware of how different engines that he built will fit different driving situations, but will NOT often cross over to other uses well. You have to use your own head and decide with the help of a GOOD machine shop how far your expectations and budget will go. His explanation of camshafts is well versed even to Chrysler engineers like me and this is where you should start. It is also the very first chapter of the book. Good Luck and keep us imformed of how it turns out and remember, my 1983 300D will do 0 to 65 MPH in under 10 seconds compared to the average 13 to 15? P.S. Gasoline engines with a carburetor will dump the fuel and air mixture directly into the turbo! Those turbos were designed for it! (You do realise your looking at a gas engine in this picture, right?
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  #33  
Old 07-01-2007, 03:47 PM
ForcedInduction
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Knightrider966 View Post
my 1983 300D will do 0 to 65 MPH in under 10 seconds compared to the average 13 to 15?
With a fast reading speedometer I'm sure you can do 0-60 in 10 seconds..........
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  #34  
Old 07-02-2007, 01:27 AM
AHH,What's up Doc????
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,212
Quote:
Originally Posted by ForcedInduction View Post
With a fast reading speedometer I'm sure you can do 0-60 in 10 seconds..........
My speedometer reads fast at a consistent 2MPH for every 10MPH. That will mean that to reach 65 REAL MPH it will have to read 78MPH and yes it does it!

Last edited by Knightrider966; 07-02-2007 at 01:48 AM.
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  #35  
Old 07-02-2007, 05:26 AM
t walgamuth's Avatar
dieselarchitect
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Lafayette Indiana
Posts: 38,161
Quote:
Originally Posted by ForcedInduction View Post
Probably a 3.46 like the autos unless MB changed the diff with the manual 300s.

I'd like to try a euro M-pump, crank it up as far as it can go and see if it will make as much or more power than the turbo MW-pump.
Sticks were 346 too.

Tom W
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[SIGPIC] Diesel loving autocrossing grandpa Architect. 08 Dodge 3/4 ton with Cummins & six speed; I have had about 35 benzes. I have a 39 Studebaker Coupe Express pickup in which I have had installed a 617 turbo and a five speed manual.[SIGPIC]

..I also have a 427 Cobra replica with an aluminum chassis.
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  #36  
Old 07-02-2007, 05:31 AM
t walgamuth's Avatar
dieselarchitect
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Lafayette Indiana
Posts: 38,161
I remember back when smokey had the hot air engine idea.

When I read his account of it it sounded really great.

He built a car with that idea and offered it to one of the car magazines to test....I think maybe it was a Chrysler k car or one of their earlier little front drivers ....the magazine found it to ping like crazy and not really do that well on economy IIRC.

I really loved Smokey but this was not one of his more successful ideas I don't think.

Tom W
__________________
[SIGPIC] Diesel loving autocrossing grandpa Architect. 08 Dodge 3/4 ton with Cummins & six speed; I have had about 35 benzes. I have a 39 Studebaker Coupe Express pickup in which I have had installed a 617 turbo and a five speed manual.[SIGPIC]

..I also have a 427 Cobra replica with an aluminum chassis.
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  #37  
Old 07-02-2007, 03:52 PM
Cervan's Avatar
Crazy mechanic.
 
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Location: olympia washington
Posts: 1,809
well right now im looking for a good 617 engine at the junkyard. What should i look for in the turbo? no shaft play laterally?
__________________
Have you ever noticed that anybody driving slower than you is an idiot, and anyone going faster than you is a maniac?

As long as they would add one additional commandment for you to keep thy religion to thyself.
George Carlin (Wonder where he is now..)

1981 240d (engine donor 1983 240d) recently rebuilt engine hurray! - No more.. fought a tree and the tree won.

pearl black 1983 240d 4speed (Converted!@$$%) atleast the tranny was rebuilt.
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  #38  
Old 07-02-2007, 05:54 PM
Bio240D's Avatar
Turbocharged OM616 Diesel
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Albuquerque,NM
Posts: 120
My Turbo Setup

Hi all,
Turbo 240 asked for some pics and explainations of my setup, so here they are!

I used an exhaust manifold off of a 617 with an adapter plate that blocks off the port for the Fifth cylinder. This is quite easily accomplished. I'm a machinist, so I used a milling machine to make the port openings, but It could be easily done with a die grinder and some patience.

The intake manifold is from a 77 240D with the vacuum controlled Injection Pump. The throttle blades have been removed, but the shafts are still in place to plug the shaft bores. I would have tapped them for plugs, but I didn't want to mess up this manifold just in case I want to use the throttle blades for some reason in the future.

The turbo is off of a 2.2 liter Peugot diesel, so it has the smaller .36 A/R turbine and housing. This works much better than the turbo from the 617 because it spools up much faster.

The plumbing from the turbo to the intake is just stuff I picked up wandering around the junkyard, and I have no clue what I pulled it off of.

The exhaust system was pulled off of a 300 in its entirety, so the flex pipe ect, all lines up just like its on a 300.

Here are the Pics. Enjoy!
Chris
http://s184.photobucket.com/albums/x30/Bio240D/?action=view&current=100_6241.jpg
http://s184.photobucket.com/albums/x30/Bio240D/?action=view&current=100_6239_00.jpg

http://s184.photobucket.com/albums/x30/Bio240D/?action=view&current=100_6238.jpg

http://s184.photobucket.com/albums/x30/Bio240D/?action=view&current=100_6237.jpg
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  #39  
Old 07-02-2007, 06:03 PM
Bio240D's Avatar
Turbocharged OM616 Diesel
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Albuquerque,NM
Posts: 120
Turbo Play

Cerven,
A good turbo will have no perceptable play Axially, but will show some Radial play. You should not be able to push it far enough radially to touch the compressor housing, and there should be no evidence of the compressor wheel having touched the housing while spinning. If it has, the compressor wheel will have to be re-balanced, and the turbo will at least need bearings.

Radial play should not exceed about a sixteenth of an inch. The shaft should turn smoothly without any "tight spots". I hope that helps!
Cheers, Chris
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  #40  
Old 07-02-2007, 07:38 PM
Rudolphrocks's Avatar
Dazed and Confused
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: Rockford, MI
Posts: 148
Quote:
Originally Posted by ForcedInduction View Post
I've currently got the fastest "240D" around. 0-60 in 13.5 seconds.
Holy Crap! that is more than twice as quick as my 75 240d, at 35.75 seconds!
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  #41  
Old 07-02-2007, 07:47 PM
ForcedInduction
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rudolphrocks View Post
Holy Crap! that is more than twice as quick as my 75 240d, at 35.75 seconds!
Lemmie guess, automatic transmission? Even the auto 240D's should be around 21-25 seconds.
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  #42  
Old 07-17-2007, 04:39 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 7,381
Quote:
Originally Posted by Knightrider966 View Post
What this page doesn NOT tell you is this engine was designed for racing around a track at constant high RPM's! This design is very efficient for that, but would be lousy in the realities of day to day stop and go driving! This was for LeMan's or Monte Carlo style driving where output and power remain high at 3200 to 6000 RPM for hours! These engines don't idle very well and the fuel being dumped into the turbo once the engine is hot is NOT liquid, but vapor only! Know what you read! There are also a lot of engine designs by Smokey Yunick that deal with what you can do to your engine making it fit well into daily driving while maintaining good fuel economy! One of the things recommended is a 3 angle valve job. This will not only make your valves last longer but will increase compression as well over the long run, but know that REGULAR valve adjustments are Critical in vehicle performance and maintenance! Second, using gapless rings like Childs and Albert, Eropean parts designers for performance, will help to keep compression in your cylinders where it belongs! Note that Childs and Albert DO NOT offer Chrome piston rings, but get them your corrct bore size and they will get them to you. If you have the courage to get Smokey Yunick's power secrets and read it all the way through, you should become aware of how different engines that he built will fit different driving situations, but will NOT often cross over to other uses well. You have to use your own head and decide with the help of a GOOD machine shop how far your expectations and budget will go. His explanation of camshafts is well versed even to Chrysler engineers like me and this is where you should start. It is also the very first chapter of the book. Good Luck and keep us imformed of how it turns out and remember, my 1983 300D will do 0 to 65 MPH in under 10 seconds compared to the average 13 to 15? P.S. Gasoline engines with a carburetor will dump the fuel and air mixture directly into the turbo! Those turbos were designed for it! (You do realise your looking at a gas engine in this picture, right?
Hey! Can you write without using the exclamation point? It's hard to read! I'm really glad you've found the winning formula for the 617! Now post a video of your timed runs so we can all see that you are the real deal! Use a GPS and a stopwatch inside your car or NO ONE WILL EVER BELIEVE YOU.
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  #43  
Old 07-17-2007, 08:03 PM
ForcedInduction
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MTUpower View Post
I'm really glad you've found the winning formula for the 617! Now post a video of your timed runs so we can all see that you are the real deal! Use a GPS and a stopwatch inside your car or NO ONE WILL EVER BELIEVE YOU.
Ditto. 10seconds 0-60 is not possible in a stock 300D, even an 87 300D, without cheating or significant performance modifications.

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