sleeve removal tool for a OM617.92? - Page 3 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

eddie5555 · #31 05-03-2011, 03:04 AM

I removed all five sleeves. I used my wire feed welder. Turn it down to low then run about 6 beads the lenth of the cylinde sleeve. Then I built a bead about 1/4 inch for about 1 1/2 inches on the bottom of the sleeve about 1 inch up. I used a pipe and hammer to hit the welds at the bottom. Once they start to move they come out farely simple. It took me about 30 minutes a sleeve from start to finish. Remember let it cool a little when doing the 1/4 inch beads. Do not penatrate the sleeve and hit the block!!!

Ed

barry123400 · #32 05-03-2011, 11:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by eddie5555

I removed all five sleeves. I used my wire feed welder. Turn it down to low then run about 6 beads the lenth of the cylinde sleeve. Then I built a bead about 1/4 inch for about 1 1/2 inches on the bottom of the sleeve about 1 inch up. I used a pipe and hammer to hit the welds at the bottom. Once they start to move they come out farely simple. It took me about 30 minutes a sleeve from start to finish. Remember let it cool a little when doing the 1/4 inch beads. Do not penatrate the sleeve and hit the block!!!

Ed

Conventional approach used on large diesels by many mechanics and shops. Shrinks the liner enough to remove much easier.Actually removes the tension as the liner contracts a little from the upset of it's integrity by the weld.

As mentioned the liner thickness cannot be breached with weld.. The new liners will still have to be pressed in. For best effect a light weld from top to bottom will remove most liner pressure. A quick vertical down weld with a stick welder is the best bet. The amperage has to be kept down. You are just trying to upset the liner metal basically.

Using a used liner in another block of this type is questionable. One reason the allowance is made for machining with a new one is to deal with concetric problems in the cast iron block. That is why a new set of liners in an old block can result in a superior bore. The cast iron is not green any more but well aged and stable.Unless really aged after casting and before machining for the liner at the factory it is not all that stable.

The used liner should be measured carefully before and after transfer to the other block to find out if the move worked. distortions introduced by the cast iron bore might upset things.

Then there may be a pesky issue with the deck clearance once the used liner is installed. It was already shaved to match the block it came from. So a critical length measurement should be made between the donar and reciepient cylinders liners before starting. I am not saying it cannot work to transfer a used liner on a 616 617 or 603 but it is a challenge.

barry123400 · #33 05-03-2011, 12:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by lietuviai

That's just how one machine shop said they will do it. I wanted to resleeve one of my 617 blocks and they quoted me between $350 and $400 to do it. I also have to supply them the sleeves.
After it's resleeved I'm sure they still have to rebore them to have the pistons fit as the pistons will probably not fit right with the sleeves installed as they are. So I could imagine there's an extra charge for the extra boring to fit the pistons.

You could ask them about the charge to just do one liner. This is not unknown.

Diesel911 · #34 05-03-2011, 05:30 PM

Does anyone know the ID of a New Sleeve?

Added for clarification:
What I mean is what is the ID of a Sleeve when you purchase one. Not the ID after it is bored to fit the Pistons.

leathermang · #35 05-03-2011, 05:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diesel911

Does anyone know the ID of a New Sleeve?

The number one sleeve may be different size than the rest...or it may have to be honed out to a different size...

DeliveryValve · #36 05-03-2011, 06:06 PM

Mercedes tries to machine all the bores the same. No difference between #1 and rest of the cylinders. What happens after the machining process, the factory would choose a group of pistons out of three groups that matches the cylinder. Hence the perception one cylinder maybe bigger/smaller then the others.

617.95x info..
Group 0 = piston dia. 90.845-90.855 mm = cyinder dia. 90.898-90.908 mm

Group 1 = piston dia. 90.855-90.865 mm = cyinder dia. 90.908-90.918 mm

Group 2 = piston dia. 90.865-90.875 mm = cyinder dia. 90.918-90.928 mm

p/n 6160111210 Replacement Cylinder liners are rough honed to 89.9 mm.

.

leathermang · #37 05-03-2011, 06:25 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeliveryValve

Mercedes tries to machine all the bores the same. No difference between #1 and rest of the cylinders. What happens after the machining process, the factory would choose a group of pistons out of three groups that matches the cylinder. Hence the perception one cylinder maybe bigger/smaller then the others.

617.95x info..
Group 0 = piston dia. 90.845-90.855 mm = cyinder dia. 90.898-90.908 mm

Group 1 = piston dia. 90.855-90.865 mm = cyinder dia. 90.908-90.918 mm

Group 2 = piston dia. 90.865-90.875 mm = cyinder dia. 90.918-90.928 mm

p/n 6160111210 Replacement Cylinder liners are rough honed to 89.9 mm.

.

The NUMBER ONE CYLINDER BORE IS A DIFFERENT SIZE THAN 2-4 on four cylinders , OR 2-5 CYLINDERS on 5 cylinders....

DeliveryValve · #38 05-03-2011, 06:47 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by leathermang

The NUMBER ONE CYLINDER BORE IS A DIFFERENT SIZE THAN 2-4 on four cylinders , OR 2-5 CYLINDERS on 5 cylinders....

I have to respectively disagree at least for the 617.95x turbo motor. Piston size is a selective fit.

.

leathermang · #39 05-03-2011, 08:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeliveryValve

I have to respectively disagree at least for the 617.95x turbo motor. Piston size is a selective fit..

You are correct for the Turbo...
Had the 616 manual out...so my statement is modified to add NA.

For the 617.95x TURBO motor they are the same.

The NUMBER ONE CYLINDER BORE IS A DIFFERENT SIZE THAN 2-4 on four

cylinders , OR 2-5 CYLINDERS on NA 5 cylinders....

Diesel911 · #40 05-03-2011, 10:11 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by leathermang

The number one sleeve may be different size than the rest...or it may have to be honed out to a different size...

What I mean is what is the ID of a Sleeve when you purchase one. Not the ID after it is bored to fit the Pistons.

Diesel911 · #41 05-03-2011, 10:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DeliveryValve

Mercedes tries to machine all the bores the same. No difference between #1 and rest of the cylinders. What happens after the machining process, the factory would choose a group of pistons out of three groups that matches the cylinder. Hence the perception one cylinder maybe bigger/smaller then the others.

617.95x info..
Group 0 = piston dia. 90.845-90.855 mm = cyinder dia. 90.898-90.908 mm

Group 1 = piston dia. 90.855-90.865 mm = cyinder dia. 90.908-90.918 mm

Group 2 = piston dia. 90.865-90.875 mm = cyinder dia. 90.918-90.928 mm

p/n 6160111210 Replacement Cylinder liners are rough honed to 89.9 mm.

.

Thanks, I think you answered my question.

Also none of the Part Sellers I have seen sell a special Cylinder Liner for #1.

Diesel911 · #42 05-03-2011, 10:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by leathermang

The NUMBER ONE CYLINDER BORE IS A DIFFERENT SIZE THAN 2-4 on four cylinders , OR 2-5 CYLINDERS on 5 cylinders....

This info comes from the Technical Data Passenger Cars printed by Mercedes-Benz in 1990.
Page 95
"Cylinder Bores
Engine 616, 617.912, 617.95 (on all it also has see note #6) The
Standard dim. = 90.989-90.928

Note #6= For diesel engines normal dimensions only, no repair stages (from what I read repair stages means oversized bores as were shown on the gas engines). Diameter of 1st cylinder larger by 0.01mm (except engine 617.95)"

I take the "except engine 617.95" to mean that 617.95 Engines do not have the 1st Cylinder larger by 0.01mm

Also in the 617.95 Engine Rapair manual they do not list a separate bore diameter for #1 Cylinder.
There is a coordination piston-cylinder chart to match the Piston Group size to different cylinder bore ranges within the standard bore limits.

leathermang · #43 05-03-2011, 11:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by leathermang

You are correct for the Turbo...
Had the 616 manual out...so my statement is modified to add NA.

For the 617.95x TURBO motor they are the same.

The NUMBER ONE CYLINDER BORE IS A DIFFERENT SIZE THAN 2-4 on four

cylinders , OR 2-5 CYLINDERS on NA 5 cylinders....

You quoted me from before I corrected the statement in post number 39 shown above.....