617 Vacuum Pump Bearings

[mach4]

Pulled into the junk yard today to pick up some banjo bolts, a washer pump and an OAT sensor and had a hard brake pedal. Fortunately I had my Android tablet gauges project running and noted about 3 inches of vacuum. I did a cursory inspection for any obvious leak points and found none. It's been rock solid 21-22 in-Hg since installing so something was clearly wrong. On the way home, at normal cruise I was getting about 12" so I still had decent brakes but only good for about 2 pumps. At idle it dropped to about 6-7".

After a bunch of troubleshooting I determined that it is the vacuum pump that is not putting out enough vacuum. There is no unusual noise coming from the pump. I'll test the check valve tomorrow before tearing into things, but...

I want to rebuild my spare vacuum pump in case I need to install that and despite lots and lots of discussion on vacuum pump bearings on these forums found nothing definitive on which ones to get. The couple references I saw, turned up nothing on a Google search.

Can anyone recommend a reputable online supplier and a brand and part number to order?

It's probably not essential to replace the bearings as the ones in the spare look and feel good but as long as I'm in there might as well do it right. I've also got another vacuum pump on my spare engine that might be fine too if need be.

I'd also like to check the end play on the timing device while it's open and can't find pictures and a description on how to do that task.

Any suggestions?

[OM617YOTA]

I used a dial indicator and a magnetic base to check my end play on my timing device.

[Stretch]

Originally Posted by mach4

Pulled into the junk yard today to pick up some banjo bolts, a washer pump and an OAT sensor and had a hard brake pedal. Fortunately I had my Android tablet gauges project running and noted about 3 inches of vacuum. I did a cursory inspection for any obvious leak points and found none. It's been rock solid 21-22 in-Hg since installing so something was clearly wrong. On the way home, at normal cruise I was getting about 12" so I still had decent brakes but only good for about 2 pumps. At idle it dropped to about 6-7".

After a bunch of troubleshooting I determined that it is the vacuum pump that is not putting out enough vacuum. There is no unusual noise coming from the pump. I'll test the check valve tomorrow before tearing into things, but...

I want to rebuild my spare vacuum pump in case I need to install that and despite lots and lots of discussion on vacuum pump bearings on these forums found nothing definitive on which ones to get. The couple references I saw, turned up nothing on a Google search.

Can anyone recommend a reputable online supplier and a brand and part number to order?

It's probably not essential to replace the bearings as the ones in the spare look and feel good but as long as I'm in there might as well do it right. I've also got another vacuum pump on my spare engine that might be fine too if need be.

I'd also like to check the end play on the timing device while it's open and can't find pictures and a description on how to do that task.

Any suggestions?

If you have the patience look through this thread

More than you are likely to ever want to know about OM61X piston vacuum pumps

I think all of the answers to your questions are there

[Dan Stokes]

Remember that if you can get the existing bearings out you can take them to your local bearing supplier (most towns of any size have them) and and they can match them by size. For the most part bearings come in standard sizes so they can measure the OD, ID, and thickness and fix you right up. They often have several brands so ask for NSK, Timken, or other brand that you have heard of, preferably not make in Sri Lanka.

Dan

[charmalu]

This is a long thread, but I think Beagle mentions the bearing part #`s

VACUUM PUMP FAILURE! Are you neglecting yours??


Charlie

[Diesel911]

Concerning NSK or any other Ball Bearings; even the name brand companies have 3 or more grades of bearings. The lowest grade is made in China.

If you can find out whic bearing you have go on ebay and see if you can find one made in the USA, German or Japanese and you can sometimes see where it is made in the Picture or you can ask the eBay seller before you buy it.

Mainly you do not want a bearing with a Plastic Cage and I believe in one of the threads you want on with a lot of Balls in it as some come with less.

[OM617YOTA]

China is 100% capable of building quality products. As long as the bearings are of the appropriate grade AND sourced only through official channels, country of origin shouldn't make a difference.

Counterfeiters copy labels and packaging, too. If you buy outside of official channels, you have no clue whether you're getting the real deal, regardless of what is printed on the box.

These bearings are inexpensive through official channels, I bought mine from Motion Industries for ~$11/ea. No reason to roll the dice buying from eBay.

[Diesel911]

Originally Posted by OM617YOTA

China is 100% capable of building quality products. As long as the bearings are of the appropriate grade AND sourced only through official channels, country of origin shouldn't make a difference.

Counterfeiters copy labels and packaging, too. If you buy outside of official channels, you have no clue whether you're getting the real deal, regardless of what is printed on the box.

These bearings are inexpensive through official channels, I bought mine from Motion Industries for ~$11/ea. No reason to roll the dice buying from eBay.

Are you sure those high grade Chinese Bearing are being sold in the US? The next question is how can you tell a high grade Chinese Bearing from a low grade one?

I personally bought quite a few Roller and Ball Bearings on eBay with zero issues and that same bearing that you got would likely cost 1/2 of what you paid. Also I only buy made in the US or Japan Bearings.

When I replaced the Pinion Bearings and the Axle Bearings on My Van I was able to get the exact same Bearing which were Torrington made in the USA on eBay.

Are all eBay Deals perfect the answer is no. But, eBay has cleaned up their act somewhat and if an item is not as described you are going to get your Money back off of that item but it is going to take a little effort on your part to file for it and wait.

I would rate My eBay Transactions over the Past 5 years as a 99% with 1% of the deals having issues. I have saved a lot of Money on auto parts there.

[mach4]

Originally Posted by OM617YOTA

I bought mine from Motion Industries for ~$11/ea.

That's what I was looking for... there's a location here in San Diego. I'll check them out.

I put my spare vacuum pump back together and will install that for now and then rebuild the one currently in the car at my leisure.

[OM617YOTA]

Originally Posted by Diesel911

Are you sure those high grade Chinese Bearing are being sold in the US? The next question is how can you tell a high grade Chinese Bearing from a low grade one?

I personally bought quite a few Roller and Ball Bearings on eBay with zero issues and that same bearing that you got would likely cost 1/2 of what you paid. Also I only buy made in the US or Japan Bearings.

When I replaced the Pinion Bearings and the Axle Bearings on My Van I was able to get the exact same Bearing which were Torrington made in the USA on eBay.

Are all eBay Deals perfect the answer is no. But, eBay has cleaned up their act somewhat and if an item is not as described you are going to get your Money back off of that item but it is going to take a little effort on your part to file for it and wait.

I would rate My eBay Transactions over the Past 5 years as a 99% with 1% of the deals having issues. I have saved a lot of Money on auto parts there.

1. "High grade" is difficult to quantify, but I buy 4-5k ABEC 5 bearings per month that were manufactured in China. Due to the quantity I buy, I skip the distributor or dealer and buy directly from the USA based manufacturer that built, owns, and operates their Chinese factory, with final QC being done here in the states.

2. There are testing methods that can determine bearing quality, but the easiest method is to buy through trusted channels. If you buy outside your bearing manufacturer's list of authorized distributors, you are rolling the dice.

3. You say you buy USA or Japanese mfg'd bearings. Buying from eBay, you may be getting the real deal. You may also be getting a fancy box that says whatever the counterfeiter wanted it to say. You are rolling the dice.

4. If you're happy with your eBay purchases, great, don't worry about what some jackwagon(me) on the internet says.

[OM617YOTA]

Originally Posted by mach4

That's what I was looking for... there's a location here in San Diego. I'll check them out.

I put my spare vacuum pump back together and will install that for now and then rebuild the one currently in the car at my leisure.

You can google bearing suppliers in your area. Might find another option closer or with better pricing. Check out the bearing mfg page and make sure they're listed as an authorized distributor and rock on.

[mach4]

Pulled the vacuum pump today and upon opening the front cover immediately discovered why I wasn't getting a whole lot of vacuum. Also kind of explains why the decrease in vacuum was so sudden.



The interesting thing is that I was still able to get 12 in-Hg at cruise though it bled off pretty quickly at idle. That's a pretty strong vacuum pump.

Spare pump is in and pulling good vacuum. Guess I'll be grabbing a few spare valves at the junk yard next time I'm out there.

[OM617YOTA]

That's good news!

Kind of nice to see something dirty and greasy on your car for a change.

(Just poking fun.)