Primitive car = good - Page 4 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

Hatterasguy · #46 10-13-2007, 12:27 AM

Well on my Camry with rear drums the rears would lock, and if you pushed a bit harder the fronts would as well. Same on the SD. Not really affective braking. In a split second accident its kind of hard to moderate the brakes.

Mark DiSilvestro · #47 10-13-2007, 01:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hatterasguy

Well on my Camry with rear drums the rears would lock, and if you pushed a bit harder the fronts would as well. Same on the SD. Not really affective braking. In a split second accident its kind of hard to moderate the brakes.

With front discs/rear drums, it's best to keep the rear shoes adjusted as tight as possible. In return, you get a firm pedal and less grabby rear brakes. Don't depend on the self-adjusters because they often aren't very efficient, and many rear drums adjust via the parking brake, which often gets very little use on automatic-tranny equipped vehicles.

As for my 240D's 4-wheel discs, I haven't yet panic tested them!

Happy Motoring, Mark

KAdams4458 · #48 10-13-2007, 02:09 AM

Since we're on the subject of brakes... After getting the vacuum pump working on the 300D after not even starting it for two months, I figured I'd take it up and down the private road to get the rust cleaned off of the brakes. I then decided to try a 30 - 0 panic-style stop on pavement. Not only did it lock up all four wheels and skid to a stop extremely fast, but I realised after I parked the car that I had a sore spots where the seat belt ran over my hips. A little bruising followed. That's some hard braking!

suburbanviking · #49 10-13-2007, 07:39 AM

Going back to the electronics, I too, feel everyone's partiality towards "keeping it simple". However, when my buddy picked up a new loaded Nissan Altima I have to admit I was a little jealous of all the new bells and whistles (Nav, Bluetooth, pushbutton starter, etc). However, quite a bit of this can be added to our vehicles as aftermarket without impacting the reliability or having to spend $30k+ for a brand new car. I added a small dash mounted navigation unit along with a nice stereo upgrade (including a steering wheel mounted control unit) to my 300SD. While it is not brand new like the Altima, it is just as reliable, gets the same or better gas mileage, won't depreciate, and I love the fact that I paid only 1/10th what my buddy did.

The older Benzes are the best value (cost, performance, reliability, safety, comfort) on the road today.

.....Dan

Mark DiSilvestro · #50 10-13-2007, 07:55 AM

My '98 Altima has far more 'bells & whistles' than any other car I've owned. Except for the factory CD player, they're all still working, though it DID recently need a replacement mass airflow sensor to the tune of $294!
But as I expect really old vehicles, such as my 240Ds and Fintail, to need the usual 'old car' repairs from time to time, I'm happy to not have to add diagnosing electronics failures with those.
As for 'pushbutton starting', my '61 Ponton 180b had that!

Happy Motoring, Mark

Ara T. · #51 10-13-2007, 08:44 AM

They definitely have good brakes. My 2000 Accord brakes suck in comparison in pedal feel and stopping power (has rear drums incidentally).

Before I installed stiffer springs in the Accord it also had some ridiculous brake dive, much worse than a W123.

didget69 · #52 10-13-2007, 08:59 AM

I must be the only forum member with good experience on domestic cars?

1989 Chevy S10 Blazer - 289k from new, original drivetrain
1995 Pontiac Trans Sport / 3.8 V6 - 4 speed overdrive automatic - 166k
original drivetrain
1999 Dodge Grand Caravan - 179k miles - original drivetrain
1993 Jeep Cherokee - 146k miles - original drivetrain
1988 Chevy 3500 truck - farm use - 6.2 diesel/auto - 198k original drivetrain
1977 Jeep CJ5 - 202k - original drivetrain
1990 Pontiac Grand Am - Quad 4/auto - no issues at time of sale w/ 155k on clock, never even had a head gasket issue, which some report that the engines are famous for...

And the list could go on... Never had anything more than occasional radiator,
minor gaskets, a couple water pumps, and the usual tires/brakes/etc...

I've been pleased as well with the MB's in the family, except for the '86 300E POS that was evidently the German's equivalent of the Vega -

FWIW -

bnc
1984 300D

#53 10-13-2007, 10:22 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by didget69

I must be the only forum member with good experience on domestic cars?

I had a few good experiences in/on the '69 ford that I owned in high school, but that's a different subject.

As far as driving them, nope. I gave up on them as soon as I could afford more than a $500 car and never looked back. I've rented a few (to many) and ridden in a few more since then and I haven't seen any reason to reconsider. One exception: I do own a POS jeep winter beater (at my wife's insistence), I hate to even look at the thing and refuse to work on it.

KAdams4458 · #54 10-13-2007, 12:27 PM

didget69, I've had perfectly good domestic car experiences. Take my Saturn for example. It's a '93, so it's loaded with enough electronic gizmos that could be a headache, but simply have not. Close to 200,000 miles now without anything more than basics. It starts, stops, and runs like the day it was new.

I'd be driving it now if it would pass emissions in the county I moved to. Unfortunately, I bashed the catalytic converter on high crest in the road a while back, and the material inside of the cat broke up and clogged the exhaust system, so I had to knock the pieces out. No way it will pass with a hallow cat, so I haven't even tried.

Gil · #55 10-13-2007, 04:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by KAdams4458

didget69, I've had perfectly good domestic car experiences. Take my Saturn for example. It's a '93, so it's loaded with enough electronic gizmos that could be a headache, but simply have not. Close to 200,000 miles now without anything more than basics. It starts, stops, and runs like the day it was new.

I'd be driving it now if it would pass emissions in the county I moved to. Unfortunately, I bashed the catalytic converter on high crest in the road a while back, and the material inside of the cat broke up and clogged the exhaust system, so I had to knock the pieces out. No way it will pass with a hallow cat, so I haven't even tried.

Crazy as it may sound, you might want to try it and see if it passes anyway. I had a friend with an old nissan who replaced his cat with a straight pipe (they don't actually look in some states) and he passed emissions anyway-! This is probably the exception rather than the rule, but it might be worth a gamble.

KAdams4458 · #56 10-13-2007, 05:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gil

Crazy as it may sound, you might want to try it and see if it passes anyway. I had a friend with an old nissan who replaced his cat with a straight pipe (they don't actually look in some states) and he passed emissions anyway-! This is probably the exception rather than the rule, but it might be worth a gamble.

I know that flies in some places, but King County, WA has almost California-like emissions standards. In fact, as I understand it, the state capitol has a ten year plan in effect that will have our vehicle air pollution control tactics identical to California's in the end.

On the other hand, if it flunks, I'm out what? $15? I also need a new windshield for it, though. It didn't occur to me how bad it really was until I got used to driving my wife's car with the cracked, but otherwise clear glass. I wonder if Safelite will just sell me the glass without installation. They suck at installs out here, where as I am pretty good at doing them.

It's a thought.

Dee8go · #57 10-16-2007, 04:07 PM

I can remember back when solid state electronics was "the coming thing." I heard lots of folks singing their praises with coments like "Unlike mechnical parts, these will never wear out!" That sounds great. If only it were true. I saw a new CLS500 in an MB dealer's garage with a wiring harness pulled out of the trunk. It looked like a Saturn rocket in there! That was only the trunk! I was afraid to look under the hood.

300SDog · #58 10-16-2007, 05:33 PM

"Primitive" i guess applies to 123, 116, 115 etc..... Then Bosch electrictronics became the new Prince of Darkness after Lucas with respect to reliability. Personally I think German electronics engineers oughta be lined up against wall and shot. Then bring in metalurgists insisting on aluminum heads for diesel engines. Am happy with 116 300SD, dont want anything more "modern."

Meanwhile anybody with 4-spd 240D manual windows, heat, sunroof, etc owns the most primitive vehicle on the road. They've already achieved cult-classic status, probly the most important vehicle MB's built since 110 taxi-cab sedans of 1960's. Scarey simplicity that makes adventuring into newer cars genuine culture shock. Nobody gives up their 240D on account of expensive repairs.

Awhile ago I shopped '87 diesel wagons and was stunned by laundry list of repairs done by PO's. None of the repaired components even existed on earlier models I'm familiar with.

zeke · #59 10-16-2007, 05:59 PM

DieselDog,
I love ya man

300SDog · #60 10-16-2007, 06:40 PM

Zeke, nothin teaches love for cars better than 100% manual 240D. I reckon there's zero attrition rate on 4-spd versions now. Owners dont wanna give em up. "Disposable car syndrome" is proven myth with crappy new car prices at downpayment for house.

Meanwhile the entire 123 series pretty much doubled in value over the past 3 yrs.