Compression? 300TD
 

Hello, my girlfriend recently acquired what we thought was a good 300TD Wagon. The car started right up in cold weather and had good power despite that it isn't even a turbo engine. After driving a couple of hundred miles I noticed that the oil was leaking profusely. We brought it to a mechanic who diagnosed it without a compression test to have a worn out engine with blow by. We then brought it to another mechanic who said the same. It now wont start at all. Is it possible for the engine to deteriorate that quickly? Before she bought it, it had had a valve job and new timing chain. I recently re-adjusted the valves, most of them were very tight but following the adjustment no change is apparent. When trying to start it, it will not even hint at trying to start. Before it quit, it didnt have much of a problem starting but was starting to run rougher. I also recently did a compression test on two cylinders which were both around 200 psi. after 8 cranks. This was done on a cold engine as it wont start. the other cylinders were in a position so that i needed another adapter to reach and so I am planning to return and test the others soon (the car is 2 hours away at my girlfriend's moms house) but 200 isnt good anyhow. I am just wondering what can be done as i would like to get her car back on the road. New rings? could the timing chain have slipped due to an old tensioner? Also, the odometer only works intermittently but registers 167000.

Thanks

Nick

what kind of oil are you running? did you change it when you bought the car? is the car running diesel? has it ever been run on wvo?

If it ran well and started well in cold weather recently it should be good now too unless something has changed. The compression is a bit below what is needed for reliable starting.

Perhaps changing the oil and putting in the right kindof oil will bring it around. The rings could be stuck. Driving it might knock carbon off the valves and get them sealing better, too.

Are you sure the glow plugs are working correctly? That is the first thing to suspect when one of these diesels does not want to start when it did before.

Tom W

Chevron
 

I changed it once before and it has chevron 10w-40. I pulled out the glow plugs and tested each one and they all get red hot. I also tried a bit of starting fluid but that produced nothing. not even a little kick. I didn't have my multimeter with me and so I didn't test the leads to make sure voltage was getting to the glowplugs, but the GP light in the dash lights up and then turns off after 5-8 secs. I should probably test each lead? Should i use heavier oil?

Heavier oil will make it harder to start in cold weather. Might try some thinner oil.
If you cycle the glow plugs a few times them get out and touch each one. If they are working and getting voltage they will be warm, if they aren't getting voltage they won't be warm. For it to suddenly stop starting in cold weather is unusual unless something changed. The strip fuse could have gone bad, they get hairline cracks. Test resistance across the fuse to make sure it's good. The glow plug relay could also be bad.

Yes. You should use a good diesel rated 15W-40 or 5W-40. Most 10W-40 oils are not diesel rated, meaning they don't have the right additives to control the soot in the oil. If it started running roughly before it quit all together, there are a number of things to check before even thinking of condemning the engine. It could have a clogged tank strainer or fuel filters. There could be air getting in the lines from aged rubber hoses. Double check to make sure you did the valve adjustment properly. I know I've forgotten to tighten a valve nut before and that made it run roughly until I fixed it. Power wash the underside of the car and find out from where the oil is leaking. Odds are its and easily replaced gasket. Don't give up on the car yet!

Re:
 

I felt the glow plugs and they felt warm. The major amount of oil is coming through the air filter, which is classic blow by, right? Thats what both mechanics said too. I put chevron Delo so its diesel rated. My next step will be to check the compression on the other 3 cylinders and if they are also bad I guess I will pull off the head. over the 2 months that she drove the car it gradually ran a little rougher until one day it wouldn't start. So it was a relatively quick deterioration and perhaps not a sudden one. But it still was running ok before just not as good and particularly not a problem to start. Thats what made me think that perhaps the chain had slipped. Also, when checking the compression I neglected to push the "stop" button and ended up with much fuel clouding the air, so I know that fuel is getting there. The tank was recently removed and cleaned as well so I'm pretty sure the problem is not fuel.

So I dunno...

thats not necessarily true... how would blow by cause oil to come out of the breather tube?

I took mine in for some transmission issues and it was also diagnosed as "old". I don't think they even need to look at the part, just the styling of the car to tell you what's wrong with it.

try this.
crack all the injector lines at the injectors make sure fuel is squirting from all the injector nuts. if you are getting no fuel from some of the nuts, make sure they are loose, and try again. your IP could have gotten weak. your filters could have gotten plugged up to the point that they get some fuel, but not enough to fire. verify that the squirts from the injector nuts are in time with the air pressure spraying out the gp holes... make sure you still have full oil level... a bad leak could have resulted in very low oil level that could have broken things... you may want to put a diesel purge style bottle on your IP and verify fuel flow into the bottle... www.dieselgiant.com diesel purge instructions... 200 psi on a cold engine is plenty to start. ya gotta have warm glow plugs and you gotta have good injection spray pattern. you could have bad injectors. can you take them to a reputable diesel shop for spray pattern and pop pressure? report back when you have checked these out.

So are you saying the 10w40 is delo and is diesel rated or are you saying you have now changed the oil to delo?

I have never heard of a 10w40 that is diesel rated.

Do you know if the car has been run on alternative fuels?

Grease?

Tom W

The only thing that came to mind. In the old days it was thought by some. To do a valve job on a head with really bad valves. The increased new ring loading on an old engine after a valve job finished them pretty fast. As I say it's an old story.
If you did not run the engine low on oil or overheat it. The rapid deterioration if so might be the above. I certainly cannot account for it otherwise but the other compression results might give you a different clue. Keep us posted.

I have never believed that one.

Tom W

My primer pump crapped out shortly after I purchased a td and although it startedup fine, it ran a bit crappier for a short spell and then the fuel system got fully air bound.
After changing filters including fuel tank filter, i noticed that the primer pump had no resistance when priming. I replaced it with a new bosch spring loaded pump. Bled the air with the primer pump and it started right up and has not had any issues again. Check that primer pump.
Cheap fix.

Re:
 

Im pretty sure that it was not run on grease. The oil that i changed it to before it crapped out was Delo, Im pretty sure it was 10w-40 but perhaps I am wrong. The priming pump thing is interesting as when I tried to pump it, there wasn't really much resistance and fuel just came out the top of the pump. Is that how it is supposed to act? When I get back to the car I will check on the last compression figures and then fuel delivery. Thanks for your suggestions!

The compression doesn't look good to me. These engines normally have around 400 psi cold. Others may know better than myself, about starting with 200 psi. But, I'd say lots of oil in the intake (blowby) and low compression are not good signs.
I would however at least verify that the new timing chain didn't jump a couple teeth somehow.