Parts Catalog Accessories Catalog How To Articles Tech Forums
Call Pelican Parts at 888-280-7799
Shopping Cart Cart | Project List | Order Status | Help



Go Back   PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum > Mercedes-Benz Tech Information and Support > Diesel Discussion

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #31  
Old 05-21-2008, 09:59 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Fresno, CA
Posts: 193
Quote:
Originally Posted by turbobenz View Post
Biofuels are a complete joke. I dont know the numbers, but I think as of now biofuels make up .5% of our fuel in the US. And even that .5 is driving food costs up. And brazil does not make all its own fuel from biosources. They make half and have destroyed rainforests in the process.
This is not an argument to this quote, just a question to help educate myself.
What if we made bio-diesel from plants we don't eat or even algae, like I have seen on programs on TV? How would this drive up the costs of food supply? unless farmers grow for bio instead of food, like they are already doing with corn for ethanol. Not looking for a lenthly discussion on what we should or should not be doing but I just sounds simple when people casually talk about it.

__________________
1999 E300 TD 190,000
1996 Passat TDI 225,000-sold
1996 E300 120,000-sold
1998 Jetta TDI 186,000 -sold
1983 Chev Suburban C20 6.2-sold
Reply With Quote
  #32  
Old 05-21-2008, 10:38 PM
turbobenz's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Cameron Park CA
Posts: 1,874
Quote:
Originally Posted by dauber View Post
This is not an argument to this quote, just a question to help educate myself.
What if we made bio-diesel from plants we don't eat or even algae, like I have seen on programs on TV? How would this drive up the costs of food supply? unless farmers grow for bio instead of food, like they are already doing with corn for ethanol. Not looking for a lenthly discussion on what we should or should not be doing but I just sounds simple when people casually talk about it.


This requires land and agriculture requires land also. They both also require fresh water. People casually talk about it because they don't understand the magnitude of the problem and how much biomass it takes to even get 1 gallon of ethanol/biodiesel.
__________________
1981 300SD 512k OM603


Reply With Quote
  #33  
Old 05-22-2008, 11:31 AM
KylePavao's Avatar
Diesel Fanatic
 
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Tiverton Rhode Island/University of Rhode Island
Posts: 400
Hmm

Well the fresh water issue is an interesting one that you bring up.

However...desalinization technologies are advancing constantly, and the use of atomic energy (like creating fresh water on a submarine) allow roughly 25 years before the rods need to be changed (creating another problem of nuclear waste, I know)

Just today, the Brazilian state run oil company found another offshore field which would possibly have 8 billion barrels of oil in reserve.

And speaking of tar sands, sure they may seem like they aren't feasible at this point, but so was putting someone in space. Or creating a machine that could fly. Or sailing without falling off the side of the earth. Doom and gloom is good in that it gives us a worst case scenario, but so many people seem to forget the ingenuity of human beings. So many things were never going to be feasible; routine air travel, routine missions to outer space, the automobile overcoming the horse. All of these things took place in less than 100 years...hell..

1893: Karl Benz creates the "first" automobile. Fast forward ten years..
The Wright Flyer: 1903, first plane.
Ford Model T: 1908, brings motorized transportation to the masses.
First scheduled airline flight: 1914
First Jet Commercial Airplane: 1952, Dehavilland Comet
First Human in Space: Yuri Garin, 1961
First Human on the Moon: 1969

All these things seemed impossible...but all came to fruition in a span 76 years
If there is one thing I have faith in, its the ingenuity of the human being.
__________________
http://www.betten.mercedescenter.com...n_banner_1.jpg
1976 300D
190,000 Miles
Colorado Beige

1975 300D
Parts Car
78,000 Miles
Rustbucket
Also Colorado Beige

1984 190D 2.2 (Dad's)
156,000 miles
Champagne Metallic Clearcoat
Reply With Quote
  #34  
Old 05-22-2008, 11:38 AM
Craig
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
No one is saying that finding additional energy is impossible, just expensive. There is no shortage of energy, there is a shortage of cheap energy. All these alternatives are technically feasible (and have been for decades), but they are not going to compete with $130/barrel oil. When conventional energy prices get up to a reasonable level, these alternatives will start to become cost effective. As long as we have cheap oil, it's not going to happen on a large scale.
Reply With Quote
  #35  
Old 05-22-2008, 11:44 AM
awsrock's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Tinley Park, IL
Posts: 642
I don't want to sound like a hippie, but...hemp would be an EXCELLENT source of plant oil.

You literally don't need to do anything to it, it grows damn near anywhere, and you can harvest it twice a year.

Still trying to figure out why it magically disappeared from agriculture back in the 30s or so.
Reply With Quote
  #36  
Old 05-22-2008, 05:32 PM
ForcedInduction
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Quote:
Originally Posted by Craig View Post
No one is saying that finding additional energy is impossible, just expensive. There is no shortage of energy, there is a shortage of cheap energy. All these alternatives are technically feasible (and have been for decades), but they are not going to compete with $130/barrel oil. When conventional energy prices get up to a reasonable level, these alternatives will start to become cost effective. As long as we have cheap oil, it's not going to happen on a large scale.
We need to work on Tesla's idea of harnessing lightning.
Reply With Quote
  #37  
Old 05-22-2008, 07:39 PM
Craig
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Quote:
Originally Posted by ForcedInduction View Post
We need to work on Tesla's idea of harnessing lightning.
I need one of those "back to the future" lighting rods on my car.
Reply With Quote
  #38  
Old 05-22-2008, 09:34 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2007
Location: Fresno, CA
Posts: 193
Quote:
Originally Posted by Craig View Post
I need one of those "back to the future" lighting rods on my car.

I second that, I would go back and buy some Microsoft stock when it first went public, that way I would not care about fuel prices.
__________________
1999 E300 TD 190,000
1996 Passat TDI 225,000-sold
1996 E300 120,000-sold
1998 Jetta TDI 186,000 -sold
1983 Chev Suburban C20 6.2-sold

Last edited by dauber; 05-22-2008 at 11:12 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #39  
Old 05-22-2008, 11:28 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: Nova Scotia, Canada.
Posts: 6,510
Quote:
Originally Posted by asnowsquall View Post
Its the standard of living that I'm more concerned about.
We tend to speculate on the effects of higher diesel fuel prices. I also am somewhat concerned as it all downloads with higher general energy costs.

For example if the bubble does not burst some people will be hard pushed to heat their homes in the next winter. It also has to impact just about everything else at some point.

Is their still enough room to increase the income of north americans further at the individual level to compensate? Plus the ongoing national debts with a declining economy. I feel a lot of fundemental economic laws have been violated and just might come home to roost.
Already there has been some mention of the payment for offshore energy required in eurodollars. That might be serious if it happens. If energy costs escalate too fast it could be hard to cope with for many.

Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On




All times are GMT -4. The time now is 06:11 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2024 Pelican Parts, LLC - Posts may be archived for display on the Peach Parts or Pelican Parts Website -    DMCA Registered Agent Contact Page