who said B100 will gel below 40-30F?

[greasybenz]

Well for the SF bay area guys i think youve noticed that it has been cold outside overnight till morning. And i live in the peninsula on a hill so i got 19-22F nights and mornings. For the first time in my life i had to scrape ice off the windsheild of my car in the bay area!

And i was worried about the SD starting as it had B100 in the fuel tank!
I had filled up the night before as i almost ran the car out of diesel (damn fuel meter is off) anyway, i was worried so i let the glow plugs cycle longer and cranked the starter. Without a single complaint it started right up, no knocking or shaking just clattered away happily.

A little more smoke came out then normal but the fuel didnt gel. I popped the hood to check the pre-filter and i could see the fuel clearly moving through, it wasnt gelled or anything it was liquid!

My theory is that its proper insulation of the fuel tank that keeps the fuel from gelling in the fuel tank.

What are your thoughts?

[Biglex]

I run about 85% WVO in mine here in WV, so far the lowest it has been is 16 degrees F, but I had no problem at all starting it.

[Bill Ladd]

I've been running anywhere between 90% to 100% bio. Coldest day here so far has been 18 degrees.

Little more smoke on the cold days, but no gelling.

[Frankie]

I'm still researching WVO but plan to use it soon. I'm already putting biodiesel in when I can get to it. The biodiesel pump station in my Peninsula is only open m-th 8-5p.
Do you use heat for your lines or fuel filters when you use WVO? Anyone use the copper coil fuel filter heaters? Do you have a temp gauge installed too?
Frankie

[Frankie]

Ruben,
Where do you get your biodiesel? I live in your area. Do you make your own?
Frankie

[airbus]

The quality of biodiesel varies greatly. Last winter I put a sample of biodiesel outside to see at what temp it gels compared to a sample of my soybean waste oil. Surprisingly the biodiesel, which was made out of soybean oil (well, who knows...) gelled over night at around 30F while my waste oil stayed liquid to 25F.

[Frankie]

How were you able to tell that 30F was the temp it gelled at vs the VO at 25 staying liquid?
Frankie

[GRIESL]

I agree that the gel point depends alot on the quality of the oil and then the quality of the reaction. My homemade stuff from soy can withstand down to 27F no problem--might cloud a little but not gel. Don't know past that because on colder mornings than that I plug in and the heat from the block heater has to help keep things from gelling. Keep in mind, too, that even these old diesels circulate fuel like crazy. And in that cycle, fuel gets warmed up by the block and shot back to the tank. Every time that fuel goes through that loop it's being heated just by coming in close contact to the block. I've thought about installing one of **************'s glow plug fuel heaters, but I've not seen gelling as that bad a problem so far.

I am interested, though, in hearing more about the tank's insulation. I really didn't know it was insulated.

[greasybenz]

Originally Posted by Frankie

Ruben,
Where do you get your biodiesel? I live in your area. Do you make your own?
Frankie

ive been buying it in 55gal drums. $2.75/gal, if you want some give micheal a call at 510-712-7897. He will hook you up with some, if he doesnt pick up leave him a message and tell him ruben sent you. His fuel has been top notch.

[airbus]

Originally Posted by Frankie

How were you able to tell that 30F was the temp it gelled at vs the VO at 25 staying liquid?
Frankie

I just let both samples outside for a couple of weeks and checked frequently at different temperatures. My point is, that I was surprised that the biodiesel gelled earlier than the waste oil.

[82DeuceFire]

I put a sample of my biodiesel in the frig and then the freezer with a thermometer. Frig was 33F and the sample was still liquid. Freezer was 10F and it turned solid - you could press your thumb in it but it wouldn't pour. If it is getting close to freezing I start mixing the bio with diesel fuel.
Jelling would occur in the fuel lines first because the small amount of fuel would cool down quickly. If it really gets cold here I'll probably just run straight diesel for awhile to be safe. There are some anti-gel additives for biodiesel but I haven't tried them in the freezer yet.

[aklim]

Originally Posted by greasybenz

My theory is that its proper insulation of the fuel tank that keeps the fuel from gelling in the fuel tank.

What are your thoughts?

Well, if you leave it long enough, insulation won't matter. Insulation is not 100% and there will always be leaks. You might be able to get away with it overnight or whatever depending on how cold the surrounding is. If it is inside a garage where the temp doesn't get under 40, you don't even need insulation. I guess we don't know how cold it gets or how long it is sitting. 10 deg and sitting for 3 days, you probably will have gelling if the fuel will gel.

[BioBens]

I make and run my own b100 from canola WVO here in Montana and have had no problems whatsoever. I keep a pint jar of bioD in the unheated garage window as a CFPP (gel) indicator. The CFPP temp difference between the indicator and the tank is easily 15 degrees F lower, sometimes 20, depending on the feedstock quality. I've determined this by looking at the primary fuel filter. At night I plug in the block heater only when it's < 20 degrees. I use a magnetic tank heater overnight only when it's < 10 degrees. Recently I installed an inline fuel heater for daytime cold weather. No probs, baby!

[TheDon]

what Reuben was stating is that the fuel doesnt gel because the tank is located inside the car where the temperature is sometimes slightly higher than the outside.. plus the tank itself is more or less insulated by the rear sear and the rear bulkhead..

i dont see why filling the open spaces with some non flamable home insulation would be a problem if you want it to be better insulated

[Frankie]

Originally Posted by greasybenz

ive been buying it in 55gal drums. $2.75/gal, if you want some give micheal a call at 510-712-7897. He will hook you up with some, if he doesnt pick up leave him a message and tell him ruben sent you. His fuel has been top notch.

Does he sell in smaller quantities? I have transport issues for a 55 gal drum. I can bring my fuel pump and hook up to his drum I guess.
Thanks for the contact info Ruben!
Frankie