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  #16  
Old 06-15-2008, 06:46 AM
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I can only speak to my own personal experience with my '98 but I can tell you two facts I have observed on my car:

1) If you don't rotate the tires you WILL wear the right rear out faster than all of the others. I wore out a snow tire in about 10K miles by leaving it on that corner. It is critical to rotate them every 5K and use a criss-cross pattern. For that reason I recommend avoiding directional tread tires unless you want to pay to have the remounted and rebalanced every 5K miles.

2) Any time I had front end vibration it was attributed to a tire or wheel problem, period. These are very common. Even brand new tires can be balanced and still be out of round causing vibrations and need to be scrutinized very closely. Wheels can be bent also causing vibration. Bent wheels occur by hitting potholes and don't think you don't have a bent wheel - I had 2! They can be repaired, though it is costly at about $100 a wheel it is the only way to eliminate the problem they cause.

Just getting brand new tires and having them balanced is no assurance they will fix the problem since if you have a bent wheel changing the tire will do nothing. I would stronly recommend you have the wheels and tires on the front closely examined rather than spending money on parts like LCAs which may have nothing wrong with them.

I will now say something controversial here, you will not get a vibration in the front end if your tires and wheels are perfect and you have worn front end parts or minor alignment issues, period. The vibrations all come from the tires and wheels. Worn suspension parts may make out of round or out of balance balance tires and wheels related vibrations worse and if the front end parts were new it might help mask/damp the vibrations. In other words, if the tires and wheels are perfect your vibrations will almost assuradly go away. It took me 3 years to realize this but now, without changing a single suspension part but simply by having 2 wheels straightened and new, round tires installed I have a car which has no front end vibrations.

I know people will say things like "I had a vibration at 60+ MPH that went away after I replaced the LCA bushings" but they are confusing the improvement by thinking the bushings can cause vibrations which they can't. The vibrations only come from the parts which are spinning. New bushings simply treat the symptom and absorb some minor shake, like the way taking an aspirin will make a headache go away but it won't cure a brain tumor. The bad tires/wheels will wear out the suspension parts faster too, so just replacing them without curing the cause of the problem will simply mean that you'll be doing it again sooner than you would if you fixed it right. Of course your dealer will be happy to sell you $2000 worth of suspension work to mask it but you can probably cure it for $500.
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  #17  
Old 06-15-2008, 09:51 AM
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Yep a lumpy tire.

Go to a tire shop that can spin the tires check for run-out and shave the tread even if enough tread is in the shallow.

They can also check for rim run-out.

Also the wiggle in the wheel is just the uneven tire tread trying to steer the car.

I've had this and before no big deal.

Dave
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  #18  
Old 06-16-2008, 06:05 PM
Craig
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nhdoc View Post
I will now say something controversial here, you will not get a vibration in the front end if your tires and wheels are perfect and you have worn front end parts or minor alignment issues, period. The vibrations all come from the tires and wheels. Worn suspension parts may make out of round or out of balance balance tires and wheels related vibrations worse and if the front end parts were new it might help mask/damp the vibrations. In other words, if the tires and wheels are perfect your vibrations will almost assuradly go away. It took me 3 years to realize this but now, without changing a single suspension part but simply by having 2 wheels straightened and new, round tires installed I have a car which has no front end vibrations.
Maybe true, but since there is no such thing as "perfect" tires and wheels worn parts and suspension issues will certainly amplify slight imbalances and result in shaking that is not the complete answer. I have had shaking "cured" by replacing parts and having the alignment corrected as well as by replacing worn tires (seperate events). In reality the wheels/tires, suspension parts, and alignment all have to be reasonably correct.
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  #19  
Old 06-16-2008, 10:37 PM
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Originally Posted by nhdoc View Post
....I will now say something controversial here....
Thanks for that. I will make sure that I have the tire shop check the wheels when I go for new tires sometime in the future.

I looked at the LCAs the other day. Tried to move them gently, but firmly with a persuasion bar (okay, a pry bar). Nothing would budge so I believe that the bushings are all good under there. For those suggesting the flex disks, I've checked those too.

Out of round wheels would make sense, and when the tires themselves cost over $100 per tire, fixing the wheel would save money in the long run.
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  #20  
Old 06-16-2008, 10:43 PM
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Originally Posted by Craig View Post
Maybe true, but since there is no such thing as "perfect" tires and wheels worn parts and suspension issues will certainly amplify slight imbalances and result in shaking that is not the complete answer. I have had shaking "cured" by replacing parts and having the alignment corrected as well as by replacing worn tires (seperate events). In reality the wheels/tires, suspension parts, and alignment all have to be reasonably correct.
Also true, and I believe these to be within a reasonable limit. The car doesn't pull to either side... much. Which is good for the W210 and its over-active suspension. I did have some warpage on one of the front brake discs and had it turned/trued recently. I will eat teh cost of a dismount/remount to verify the wheel integrity though. After all, the wheels are aluminum.
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  #21  
Old 06-16-2008, 10:55 PM
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Originally Posted by anghrist View Post
I looked at the LCAs the other day. Tried to move them gently, but firmly with a persuasion bar (okay, a pry bar). Nothing would budge so I believe that the bushings are all good under there.
Keep in mind the weight and spring pressure on those bushings while "just" sitting around. Can you normally move almost 2 tons with a lil 24" pry bar?

The most common description of bad LCA bushngs is a steering wheel shimmy at 55-60mph.
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  #22  
Old 06-17-2008, 09:06 PM
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Traded the spare for the worn tire. No steering shake or shimmy, but still some noise. I will live with it until I can replace the tires. Probably on one of the rear tires now, but it's better than it was.
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  #23  
Old 06-21-2008, 10:58 PM
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But the $700 question is.... Should I be on my third set of tires in two years?!?
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  #24  
Old 06-22-2008, 02:33 PM
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But the $700 question is.... Should I be on my third set of tires in two years?!?

The answer is maybe...how many miles between changes?

One of the problems was you didn't rotate them. I know I only got about 20K miles out of a set of Pirellis on my W210 but now I have Michelin Energy MXV +4 which seem to be wearing better since I have close to 10K on them and they still look nearly new.
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  #25  
Old 06-22-2008, 02:45 PM
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Hmm.... 17k miles and they were rotated at 5k/10k/17k. So I guess the next set I will rotate at 3K/6K/9K/etc.
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  #26  
Old 06-22-2008, 09:58 PM
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I'd probably chalk it up to bad tires, some of the high performance types have very soft rubber and wear out really fast. Believe it or not 15-20K is not unheard of. I had the same Michelins on our wagon and they lasted 40K+ so I felt good about them on the E300 this time instead of the pirellis. I also run them slightly over inflated now (35 PSI in back and 32 up front when measured cold) Underinflation can wear them very fast.
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  #27  
Old 06-22-2008, 10:28 PM
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I'd take it back to wherever you got thoose tires from, they should have a wearout warentty...
You shouldnt wear out a set of tires in 20k miles with normal driving... Even cheap tires should last AT LEAST 40k miles...


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  #28  
Old 06-23-2008, 07:22 AM
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You can certainly check the tire manufacturer's warranty online but I would not be surprised if there is no wear warranty on them. Many performance tires don't carry a warranty for wear and if you speak to the folks at the tire store they will tell you that getting 15-20K out of performance tires is not unusual. Some of it depends on your driving habits but also, like I said, much of the performance comes from soft, grippy rubber. It's the tradeoff made to have tires like that. Also, even if your tires do have a wear warranty there are drawbacks. One is they will do everything in their power to deny a claim and two is even if you do get a claim approved it will be pro-rated replacement. Meaning you will get only a portion of the cost of new tires and will also be forced to by the same crappy tires you just wore out prematurely. That's what I was faced with under my pirellis. The warranty would have given me $30 off each new tire...big deal, I would not buy them again regardless so I forfeitted the warranty for better tires.

Go to tire rack and read some of the reviews for tires that they recommend for the car. For the heck of it, read other's reviews of your tires too so you can see if others complained about premature wearout. I buy all my tires from them, usually when they have a good sale and have my local corner gas station mount and balance them for $10 a pop.
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  #29  
Old 06-23-2008, 07:53 AM
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Originally Posted by nhdoc View Post
You can certainly check the tire manufacturer's warranty online but I would not be surprised if there is no wear warranty on them. Many performance tires don't carry a warranty for wear and if you speak to the folks at the tire store they will tell you that getting 15-20K out of performance tires is not unusual. Some of it depends on your driving habits but also, like I said, much of the performance comes from soft, grippy rubber. It's the tradeoff made to have tires like that. Also, even if your tires do have a wear warranty there are drawbacks. One is they will do everything in their power to deny a claim and two is even if you do get a claim approved it will be pro-rated replacement. Meaning you will get only a portion of the cost of new tires and will also be forced to by the same crappy tires you just wore out prematurely. That's what I was faced with under my pirellis. The warranty would have given me $30 off each new tire...big deal, I would not buy them again regardless so I forfeitted the warranty for better tires.

Go to tire rack and read some of the reviews for tires that they recommend for the car. For the heck of it, read other's reviews of your tires too so you can see if others complained about premature wearout. I buy all my tires from them, usually when they have a good sale and have my local corner gas station mount and balance them for $10 a pop.

The problems you mentioned with tire wear warranties didn't apply to me when I got my tires at costco. They dont have the greatest selection but their warranty is effortless and no hassle.
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  #30  
Old 06-23-2008, 08:19 AM
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Originally Posted by Ara T. View Post
The problems you mentioned with tire wear warranties didn't apply to me when I got my tires at costco. They dont have the greatest selection but their warranty is effortless and no hassle.
Most store warranties (including tire stores) are road hazard warranties, not against premature wear. If Costco has a store policy that replaces tires that wear out prematurely then they are about the only one I have ever heard of.

Road hazard warranties are a completely different issue, as that will involve a tire damaged and made unrepairable by something like hitting an object. It does not cover manufacturer's defects and manufacturer's generally don't cover road hazards.
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