PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum (http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/)
-   Diesel Discussion (http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/diesel-discussion/)
-   -   Sputtering (http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/diesel-discussion/226672-sputtering.html)

Biglex 07-03-2008 02:20 AM

Sputtering
 
Ok gonna make this short and sweet. I have changed all the filters, havent done much else though. My 92 300D is sputtering on take off until about 2000 (about when the turbo kicks in) then it is smooth as can be. My mechanic said it could be injectors, but I wanted to get the forums take. Any thoughts?

compress ignite 07-03-2008 02:36 AM

How many Miles on the 602.962 ?
 
(Have you checked the timing chain wear?)

( Have you ever tried any injector cleaner,BG...Etc.

You can get new Monark Nozzles installed in your injector bodies from member C.Sean Watts for a VERY reasonable price.[Less than $30.00 each] .I would
send Sean the old injector bodies and let him "Shim" and "Pop Test" the new
installation for you.Then it's just put the "new" injectors in and go.

Biglex 07-03-2008 03:54 AM

well unfortunately I need the car to get back and forth to work. Havent checked the timing chain, but I have ran countless amounts of diesel purge, b100, diesel kleen, sea foam, anything I could think of.

Got 202000 on the old girl. At 70, she is smooth as silk.

TMAllison 07-03-2008 01:43 PM

Do you have boost and a smoothly shifting trans at lower rpm's?

SW 07-03-2008 01:59 PM

pop the hood and see if you have fuel depositing around your injectors. You might have a leaks at an injector(s) or the rubber fuel injector bypass hose(s).

gsxr 07-03-2008 02:30 PM

I'll wager that it's a stretched timing chain, which is also retarding the injection pump timing. The pump timing advances with RPM, which would explain why it smooths out at 2000rpm or so. The early 90's 60x engines had a rash of bad chains... mine was about 8 stretched when I got it at 155kmi. Check the chain first (instructions are here - you need to pull the valve cover and fan+clutch), replace if stretched past the spec in that PDF doc.

The new chain will change IP timing so adjust IP timing afterwards. If the chain is within spec, then check IP timing, set to 14 ATDC. Pretty likely this will cure the problem. It also might not be a bad idea to tweak the ALDA a bit, assuming you have the square (not round) ALDA, if you have never done so.

:scholar:

Biglex 07-04-2008 03:05 AM

Checked the fuel lines, no sign of leaks. I do have boost, but it doesnt really kick in til nearly 2K rpm. Transmission has always shifted rough. I have heard it could be a vacuum problem with that though. I had not thought about the timing chain, but that does make good sense. I am guessing it would be a good idea to get it changed anyway after 200k miles. I will check this and report back once i get it done. Thanks for all the info.

greenlogic 07-04-2008 01:44 PM

I've got the same issue with a 93 300d. Seems to only happen in the morning first start of the day and goes away within a mile or so. I've got just under 4 degrees of Timing chain stretch and need to get the new one in and reset timing. Hopefully that helps. When studdering it blows white smoke then clears when warm.

gsxr 07-04-2008 04:36 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Biglex (Post 1901002)
Checked the fuel lines, no sign of leaks. I do have boost, but it doesnt really kick in til nearly 2K rpm. Transmission has always shifted rough. I have heard it could be a vacuum problem with that though. I had not thought about the timing chain, but that does make good sense. I am guessing it would be a good idea to get it changed anyway after 200k miles. I will check this and report back once i get it done. Thanks for all the info.

If it's low on power until the turbo 'kicks in' at 2000rpm, it sounds like you're low on fuel delivery off idle. You can help this by adjusting the ALDA, either via the setscrew up top, or adding a shim underneath, to richen the mixture slightly. If it starts smoking while leaving a stop, you know you've gone a bit too far. This will also affect tranny shifting, but check the vacuum lines first (and make sure there's no vacuum leaks elsewhere, which will also cause hard shifting).

:o

sixto 07-04-2008 04:52 PM

Is it adviseable to replace the cam sprocket along with the chain (and tensioner and ...) on 602s subject to premature chain elongation? Folks seem to not replace cam sprockets on 603s when rolling in a new chain.

Sixto
87 300D

gsxr 07-05-2008 11:18 AM

<rant> ok, that stupid advertising pop-up has GOT to go! :mad: Like any of us are interested in a designer purse... better yet, the stupid ad doesn't re-direct properly! What's the deal? This just started today, AFAIK...</rant>

Sixto,

The sprocket doesn't need to be replaced, unless the teeth are worn, which is not usually the case. But it wouldn't hurt to replace it, especially with >200kmi. I don't think I've ever seen a failed 60x tensioner (yet), but it wouldn't hurt to replace that either. For the record, I did not replace either of those items on my cars... only the chain. I did use a new OE master link, with a press-fit center plate. The aftermarket links typically have a slip-fit center plate.

:euro:

TMAllison 07-05-2008 01:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by gsxr (Post 1901606)
<rant> ok, that stupid advertising pop-up has GOT to go! :mad: Like any of us are interested in a designer purse... better yet, the stupid ad doesn't re-direct properly! What's the deal? This just started today, AFAIK...</rant>

Scroll to bottom of this window and on the left, set the pull down window to LOW graphics. No more pop ups.....

Diesel911 07-05-2008 10:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by greenlogic (Post 1901177)
I've got the same issue with a 93 300d. Seems to only happen in the morning first start of the day and goes away within a mile or so. I've got just under 4 degrees of Timing chain stretch and need to get the new one in and reset timing. Hopefully that helps. When studdering it blows white smoke then clears when warm.

After changing the seals on my Volvo diesel Fuel Injection Pump I timed in incorrectly with retarded/late timing and got alot of billowy white smoke. The more I advanced it the less white smoke I had. From your description and the symptoms I had my guess is that you IP timing is slightly late. As the engine heats up the fuel burns better and the smoke goes away.

gsxr 07-06-2008 12:40 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TMAllison (Post 1901668)
Scroll to bottom of this window and on the left, set the pull down window to LOW graphics. No more pop ups.....

I just tried that. I'll see how it goes. Thanks for the tip!

Back to the white smoke... my '93 arrived in winter and coughed, sputtered, blew white smoke, and generally ran poorly at lower RPMs (but sometimes could cough at speed). Click here and here for some short videos of what it looked and sounded like.

Since the car was shipped from Alabama, I thought it might be non-winterized fuel, or old/bad fuel (it didn't smell good). That's when I found the chain was stretched and the IP timing was retarded (17 or 18 ATDC, I think). Adjusting the IP timing to spec helped a lot, but didn't cure it entirely. Replacing the chain, re-adjusting IP timing (it will change with the new chain), and fresh fuel cured it entirely. Hasn't sputtered since.

:balloon2:

TMAllison 07-06-2008 12:51 PM

The low graphics setting may not work. Seems some browsers are being hi-jacked recently....

Is it possible that Y31/1 & 2(?) are responsible for the surging?


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 12:55 AM.

Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2018 Pelican Parts, LLC - Posts may be archived for display on the Peach Parts or Pelican Parts Website