Parts Catalog Accessories Catalog How To Articles Tech Forums
Call Pelican Parts at 888-280-7799
Shopping Cart Cart | Project List | Order Status | Help



Go Back   PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum > Mercedes-Benz Tech Information and Support > Diesel Discussion

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 03-18-2008, 12:22 PM
Bajaman's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Bern, Switzerland
Posts: 713
Not so good results from 4spd swap

It seems that everything that could go wrong went wrong. I had a lot of headachss. One of the biggest was that the driveline was too long. I had mine made to the same length as Gavin in his CD which was a 1/4" shorter than the length posted by Rleo. Anyway, I got it in but I had to move the engine forward to get the centering bushing on its spindle then move the engine back. This was about 1/2" So the driveshaft "fits" but not very well.

The main problem is... You got it vibration. I was a little afraid of what I might find when I did this swap. The main thing that had me worried, it that fact that I DID NOT index the auto flywheel when I rebuilt the engine two years ago due to my retarded nature Though the engine seemed to run fine without any noticeable vibration with the auto, I'm beginning to wonder if that had anything to do with the incurable hot idle shake? But, I digress. The point is I did not have a reference for the new flywheel, So I just put it on the way I had indexed the auto flywheel with the drilled out portions in the same locations.

So I drove the beast home from my buddies garage last night. Everything works great, but I've got a bad vibration at about 1600 rpm most noticeable in 4th though It will do in in the driveway if I can hold the rpm at about 1600.

This all leads me to my question: Anyone know how to use an accelerometer and an optical pickup to dynamically balance a flywheel. I can get an accelerometer for ~$30 on fleabay, and I can get Labview on my laptop easy enough, but what to use for an optical pickup for indexing the flywheel I don't know. Also I'm not real sure how to actually balance it. Would I measure the phase angle between the peak acceleration and the index from the flywheel and drill out the flywheel at the same angle physically?

Lets pool our brains and solve this problem for everyone attempting this swap

bajaman

__________________
For Sale: 1982 MB 300TD
1995 Chevrolet Suburban 6.5TD

Sold: 1980 IH Scout Traveler- Nissan SD33T Diesel
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 03-18-2008, 12:53 PM
KarTek's Avatar
<- Ryuko of Kill La Kill
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Bahama/Eno Twp, NC
Posts: 3,258
Is the vibration present around 1600 RPM regardless of the speed? If so, I'd guess the longer shaft is putting a bind on the mounts and causing the transmission of more engine vibes to the chassis.
__________________
-Evan


Benz Fleet:
1968 UNIMOG 404.114
1998 E300
2008 E63


Non-Benz Fleet:
1992 Aerostar
1993 MR2
2000 F250
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 03-18-2008, 01:03 PM
TheDon's Avatar
Ghost of Diesels Past
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 13,285
did you have the drive shaft balanced as a whole?
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 03-18-2008, 01:10 PM
bgkast's Avatar
Rollin' on 16s
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Vancouver WA
Posts: 6,528
AFAIK everybody who has done the swap has some vibration around that rpm range. The 300Ds that came with manuals in had some sort of extra disk between the flex disk and the transmission that may have been used to eliminate this vibration.
__________________
1979 240D- 316K miles - VGT Turbo, Intercooler, Stick Shift, Many Other Mods - Daily Driver

1982 300SD - 232K miles - Wife's Daily Driver

1986 560SL - Wife's red speed machine
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 03-18-2008, 02:38 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 18,350
Quote:
Originally Posted by bgkast View Post
AFAIK everybody who has done the swap has some vibration around that rpm range. The 300Ds that came with manuals in had some sort of extra disk between the flex disk and the transmission that may have been used to eliminate this vibration.
There are pictures somewhere on the forum of those extra large balancing discs attached to a driveshaft.
__________________
1977 300d 70k--sold 08
1985 300TD 185k+
1984 307d 126k--sold 8/03
1985 409d 65k--sold 06
1984 300SD 315k--daughter's car
1979 300SD 122k--sold 2/11
1999 Fuso FG Expedition Camper
1993 GMC Sierra 6.5 TD 4x4
1982 Bluebird Wanderlodge CAT 3208--Sold 2/13
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 03-18-2008, 03:03 PM
Stevo's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: NW WA
Posts: 6,299
Quote:
Originally Posted by bgkast View Post
AFAIK everybody who has done the swap has some vibration around that rpm range. The 300Ds that came with manuals in had some sort of extra disk between the flex disk and the transmission that may have been used to eliminate this vibration.
I believe they did came on Euro, manual, 300Ds. A friend had one one which was discarded when he went to a 5 spd box. I have never seen one on a 240D, Euro.
__________________


1985 Euro 240D 5 spd 140K
1979 240D 5 spd, 40K on engine rebuild
1994 Dodge/Cummins, 5 spd, 121K
1964 Allice Chalmers D15 tractor
2014 Kubota L3800 tractor
1964 VW bug

"Lifes too short to drive a boring car"
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 03-18-2008, 04:52 PM
ForcedInduction
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Quote:
Originally Posted by kerry View Post
There are pictures somewhere on the forum of those extra large balancing discs attached to a driveshaft.
I just got one of those this weekend. And for future reference, the 300D 4-speed manual driveshaft length from tip to tip is 22-1/4 inches for the short shaft and 46" tip to tip for the long shaft (including the u-joint).
Attached Thumbnails
Not so good results from 4spd swap-driveshft-parts.jpg   Not so good results from 4spd swap-front-drveshaft-part-number.jpg   Not so good results from 4spd swap-long-shaft.jpg  
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 03-18-2008, 09:25 PM
Palangi's Avatar
L' Résistance
 
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: Republique de Banana
Posts: 3,496
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stevo View Post
I believe they did came on Euro, manual, 300Ds. A friend had one one which was discarded when he went to a 5 spd box. I have never seen one on a 240D, Euro.
My 240D had one of those balancers. The rubber was coming apart, so I took it off. No driveline vibration with or without it.
__________________
Palangi

2004 C240 Wagon 203.261 Baby Benz
2008 ML320 CDI Highway Cruiser
2006 Toyota Prius, Saving the Planet @ 48 mpg
2000 F-150, Destroying the Planet @ 20 mpg



TRUMP .......... WHITEHOUSE
HILLARY .........JAILHOUSE
BERNIE .......... NUTHOUSE
0BAMA .......... OUTHOUSE
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 03-18-2008, 09:59 PM
Stevo's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Apr 2002
Location: NW WA
Posts: 6,299
Quote:
Originally Posted by Palangi View Post
My 240D had one of those balancers. The rubber was coming apart, so I took it off. No driveline vibration with or without it.
Interesting, I wonder why they put them on Euros The US got oil coolers but no "DF damper" Thats OK, I can do w/o either.
__________________


1985 Euro 240D 5 spd 140K
1979 240D 5 spd, 40K on engine rebuild
1994 Dodge/Cummins, 5 spd, 121K
1964 Allice Chalmers D15 tractor
2014 Kubota L3800 tractor
1964 VW bug

"Lifes too short to drive a boring car"
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 03-18-2008, 11:11 PM
Registered User
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Posts: 7,381
You need this
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 03-18-2008, 11:47 PM
t walgamuth's Avatar
dieselarchitect
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Lafayette Indiana
Posts: 38,609
But I am doing fine without one on my 82 300cd with 240d four speed conversion. There is a slight five cylinder wobble at certain speeds but nothing to get excited about.

I have one of those dampers on my 240/300 na I believe. It is probably a bit smoother, having a proper 300d flywheel.

Tom W
__________________
[SIGPIC] Diesel loving autocrossing grandpa Architect. 08 Dodge 3/4 ton with Cummins & six speed; I have had about 35 benzes. I have a 39 Studebaker Coupe Express pickup in which I have had installed a 617 turbo and a five speed manual.[SIGPIC]

..I also have a 427 Cobra replica with an aluminum chassis.
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 03-19-2008, 02:06 AM
ForcedInduction
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Quote:
Originally Posted by MTUpower View Post
You need this
It has a part number, I wonder how much it would cost and how easy it would be to get one?
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 03-19-2008, 02:07 AM
pawoSD's Avatar
Dieselsüchtiger
 
Join Date: Oct 2004
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Posts: 15,438
My car has one of those and its a stock auto.....was it an added feature on the W126's? I don't think our 300d has one....
__________________
-diesel is not just a fuel, its a way of life-
'15 GLK250 Bluetec 118k - mine - (OC-123,800)
'17 Metris(VITO!) - 37k - wifes (OC-41k)
'09 Sprinter 3500 Winnebago View - 62k (OC - 67k)
'13 ML350 Bluetec - 95k - dad's (OC-98k)
'01 SL500 - 103k(km) - dad's (OC-110,000km)
'16 E400 4matic Sedan - 148k - Brothers (OC-155k)
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 03-19-2008, 09:11 AM
Bajaman's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Bern, Switzerland
Posts: 713
Lots of good info here. I know that my driveshaft is not responsible for the bulk of the vibration as I get it in the driveway just sitting there if I rev the engine to 1600 rpm. I believe this somehow gets amplified in 4th, perhaps it resonates through the drivetrain. Anyhow, I took the flywheel off and took it and the flexplate to the machine shop to have it match balanced. I guess I will try it 12 different times if I have to in order to find the proper index.
__________________
For Sale: 1982 MB 300TD
1995 Chevrolet Suburban 6.5TD

Sold: 1980 IH Scout Traveler- Nissan SD33T Diesel
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 03-19-2008, 09:12 AM
Bajaman's Avatar
Registered User
 
Join Date: Mar 2005
Location: Bern, Switzerland
Posts: 713
How does that dampener attach?

__________________
For Sale: 1982 MB 300TD
1995 Chevrolet Suburban 6.5TD

Sold: 1980 IH Scout Traveler- Nissan SD33T Diesel
Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are On




All times are GMT -4. The time now is 07:27 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2024 Pelican Parts, LLC - Posts may be archived for display on the Peach Parts or Pelican Parts Website -    DMCA Registered Agent Contact Page