With your method I believe you will need some one else to work the hand primer (I hope it has one) to keep the fuel system pressurized. You need the pressure or the Drip Tube Method is extremely tough.
Also If it had been me I would have pulled off the valve cover and rechecked the Camshaft/Camshaft tower aligment marks and compared them to the Crankdamper TDC marks before doing the IP timing.

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84 300D, 82 Volvo 244Gl Diesel

Checking those marks won't buy you anything if the IP is out by 360 degrees relative to the crankshaft.

The only question that remains is whether the IP delivers fuel on the compression stroke or on the exhaust stroke. It won't easily start if its the latter.

All right, Lee. Make sure you're on the compression stroke for #1 - cam lobes up = valves closed = compression stroke. Start at maybe 50 deg. before TDC and pump the hand primer. Move the crank five degrees or so and pump again. Keep doing this until fuel comes out the drip tube.

If no fuel comes out, repeat the process but on the "exhaust" stroke - cam lobes pointing down. If fuel comes out, well, you'll have to spin the cam around 180 deg.

Do you understand what folks are saying, here? The cam and crank are "in phase", if you will, but there is a chance that the injection pump isn't. Please forgive me for re-stating what may very well be obvious, Lee, but....

Get a new p/s belt so you can turn the engine over from the top. 13x1145.

Jay.

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On the road, currently:
'83 300D (German spec.) 168k mi. - - Wolfgang (tucked snugly away for the winter!)
'87 300D 375k mi. - finally went over to "The Dark Side"
'87 300TD 225k mi.
Cannondale 66cm CAAD5 w/Campy/Jamis Aurora
Hujsak Custom Fixie/Landshark Track Shark Custom/Ahearne Custom 29'er

Original Poster here.

well, after 2.5 months, i've FINALLY gotten back to this project. (long story: i took a second job and have been working 70hr weeks. girlfriend broke up with me so i had to move out in the midst of it all. the list goes on).

ANYWAY, i just replaced the power steering belt as B.James suggested, so i'm relieved now to be able to turn the motor by the P.S. pump.

I went out there and got the lobes pointing generally 'up.' I removed the spring and stuff from the #1 injector line and attached my drip tube. I started pumping the primer, and as i turn the motor over, i get the following results:

LOBES UP: 50º BTDC: no fuel.
LOBES UP: 40º BTDC: fuel...stream continuously, all the way until 25º (or so) BTDC with lobes DOWN.
LOBES DOWN: 25º BTDC: no fuel...until 10-20ºAfterTDC (lobes still down). LOBES DOWN: 20º AfterTDC: flow starts again, stops when the degree readings aren't visable, and stays off until flow restarts again at 40º BTDC, LOBES UP.

now with that description is clear as mud, maybe you'd confirm that that's the way my IP timing is supposed to be working? or if i got it timed 180º out when doing my head job? or may have skipped a tooth or botched something else that's keeping her from firing up?

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-lee
'83 300CDT (286k)

former proud owner of:
'85 mercedes euro 300TD
'80 mercedes 300TD
'77 mercedes 280e
'80 mercedes euro 250
'82 mercedes euro 250

If the head is a fresh install, then that orientation you have going on there is all wrong.

like you said, you want it to be the other way 180*

What happened to your timing marks? - the ones you were supposed to make on the cam sprocket and chain?

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It may not be easy to slacken the chain so that it can be removed from the cam sprocket. What I've had to do before is remove the sprocket. Make sure you stuff rags into the cavity or you may lose the fat washer behind the sprocket.

I lost it once and had to turn the engine upside down to get it back out. Lucky it was on an engine stand at the time!

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Michael LaFleur

'05 E320 CDI - 86,000 miles
'86 300SDL - 360,000 miles
'85 300SD - 150,000 miles (sold)
'89 190D - 120,000 miles (sold)
'85 300SD - 317,000 miles (sold)
'98 ML320 - 270,000 miles (sold)
'75 300D - 170,000 miles (sold)
'83 Harley Davidson FLTC (Broken again) :-(
'61 Plymouth Valiant - 60k mikes
2004 Papillon (Oliver)
2005 Tzitzu (Griffon)
2009 Welsh Corgi (Buba)

I am sorry. None of that is possible. The post will be deleted.

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are you sure the cam sprocket is on correctly in relation to the crank?

How did you preserve the timing relation with the head off?

Refer back to post #4

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None of that looks very good at all.

But, it would be of a benefit to set the engine to 24°BTDC and see what you get from the drip tube. If you do get flow, then loosen the IP and move it closer to the engine to see if you can find the point where the flow stops.

The entire scenario with the drip tube is difficult because of the many variables to the procedure.

However, since you have the '85, there is a port on the side of the IP that can be used to reference it. When you remove the cap to the port, there will be an inverted V that rotates with the pump. See if you can find, or feel, the inverted V and set the inverted V right in the center of the window. Then, read the crankshaft damper and post the degree angle. It should be close to 15°ATDC. However, and this is important, check the camshaft and advise if it's on, or slightly after the compression stroke. If it's on the exhaust or intake stroke...........you're hosed.

Brians Carltons advice in his last post is the way to go. I forgot the 1985 injection pumps had that timing aid mechanisim. That timing system was not on the earlier injection pumps.

If you want to find out more about it check the archives. This should also prove a lot easier for you to do as well. I think it may be called a timing port on the pump.

Try not to work yourself to death. Most of us have gone through simular periods in our lives.

well, crud.
at the center of my problem is the fact that this project spanned such a long period of time. i removed the head and months passed before i reassembled it. i reassembled it and months passed before i installed it. i installed it and then months passed until this current attemt to resolve it. in the midst of all that, so much has been forgotten...especially since i'm an idiot and this is my first head job.

i did make a mark to keep the relation of the old chain to the sprocket, and that mark was observed upon re-install. however, when rolling on the new chain i wound up with a tooth of 'slack', and wound up bunching/jumping the chain over the camshaft sprocket two teeth (if i remember correctly) in order to find what i thought was the right relation. i haven't ever touched the IP.

before going down that road, maybe somebody could tell me how my flow cycle is SUPPOSED to work? with what i described, am i necessarily timed 180º out (which, i just don't know how i would've managed it...as i did replace the chain when on the cam sprocket/shaft line-up marks).

addressing JT20's question:
or is there a possibility that i'm a tooth or two (or three) out of step at the cam sprocket?
i'm attaching two photos that i just took showing what the lobe position and balancer readings are like when i have the cam sprocket/shaft line-up marks set....3º ATDC?

i appreciate your help, and am intrigued by the thought of this 1985 'IP timing aid mechanism', (great post by Barry123400 HERE ((though i'm still really not sure what to look for.) I'm not familiar enough with what other model year's IP looks like, so am unsure what/where access to the 'V' window is...(not to mention, this car's a euro, so, unsure if that makes a difference)).

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-lee
'83 300CDT (286k)

former proud owner of:
'85 mercedes euro 300TD
'80 mercedes 300TD
'77 mercedes 280e
'80 mercedes euro 250
'82 mercedes euro 250

can you tell us what those lobes are doing in the first picture?

seems a little strange. It looks like intake is the next step for that cylinder. Not right. It should have just occurred and exhaust should be next. But the marker says otherwise. Do you recall a key being on the camshaft before you put the sprocket back on?


And .. is the deeper recess of the sprocket facing towards the camshaft or the radiatior?

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as long as the relation of crank to cam is copasetic, you will just need to time your IP. If you can roll in a chain and have the nerve to remove the head, you should be fine.

You need to make sure you can get the crank at ~0* while the the camshaft has Both lobes up on #1, AND the cam marker matched to the tower.

I don't know how you did that either. But from what you say, it sounds like you're on the right track.

WHat you are doin when you use drip timing on the IP is mimicry of the normal operation of the fuel cycle for #1 cylinder. Fuel stops flowing out the tube as the plunger in the IP begins to move up and block off the port and begin to pressurize fuel. You want this to happen b/w 23*-26* on your balancer marks with the #1 cylinder on the compression stroke.

that relation sounds right. Once the chain has worn a little, the camshaft will be a few degrees late when the crank says TDC. Moving ahead few degrees is the moment you have described.

although your picture says otherwise.

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with the marks lined up, the 1st lobe on the exhaust valve is pointing at 9 o'clock...towards the passenger side of the car. the 2nd lobe on the intake valve for #1 is pointing at 4 o'clock...just about to contact.
yep. there was one...and i included it when reassembling.
the deeper recess is facing the camshaft.
sounds like my crank/cam relationship isn't correct though, right?

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-lee
'83 300CDT (286k)

former proud owner of:
'85 mercedes euro 300TD
'80 mercedes 300TD
'77 mercedes 280e
'80 mercedes euro 250
'82 mercedes euro 250

your relation could be right though. If you rotate the crank another turn, your cam may be in the right position. But the marker is on wrong (how this is possible, I do not know) and the deeper recess needs to face the radiator. Imagine sending the sprocket out into the timing cavity.

EDIT!! the deeper recess does not face the radiator.
strike one

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