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  #16  
Old 12-04-2008, 06:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WD8CDH View Post
The only reason the 240 has a solid fan is cost. A visco fan will improve HP and fuel economy without hurting the engine. But.....a properly sized electric fan is better than either. That's what I did on my MB's and most other vehicles that I own.
Interesting, I dont have any magnets on my fuel lines or "Tornados" in my air intake but it sounds to me like getting an electric fan for a 240D could help out. Do you happen to know of one that would work?

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1985 Euro 240D 5 spd 140K
1979 240D 5 spd, 40K on engine rebuild
1994 Dodge/Cummins, 5 spd, 121K
1964 Allice Chalmers D15 tractor
2014 Kubota L3800 tractor
1964 VW bug

"Lifes too short to drive a boring car"
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  #17  
Old 12-04-2008, 06:04 PM
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Hey guys,

On the simpler side of things it would make the 240D a LOT quieter... I took my fan off the pulley on a real cold day just to take it out and see what kind of difference it made, should of had my decibel meter with me because it was a huge difference...
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  #18  
Old 12-04-2008, 06:15 PM
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I did it.

A 300D clutch/fan setup (purchased from a forum member) will bolt directly on the 240D water pump. All you need is shorter bolts and knuckle bandages. Flat washers under the lockwashers help too.
Definite noise reduction. Power increase inconclusive. No engine temperature problems.
If a viscous clutch driven fan weren't better they wouldn't have used them on the vast majority of cars since the 60's.
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  #19  
Old 12-04-2008, 07:26 PM
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I have a fairly low mileage, 77 300D parts car with one, maybe I'll see about swapping it into my 79 240D. How would I know if its any good, spins free now
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1985 Euro 240D 5 spd 140K
1979 240D 5 spd, 40K on engine rebuild
1994 Dodge/Cummins, 5 spd, 121K
1964 Allice Chalmers D15 tractor
2014 Kubota L3800 tractor
1964 VW bug

"Lifes too short to drive a boring car"
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  #20  
Old 12-05-2008, 12:50 AM
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Some of you remember PEH telling about driving his MB half way across the country after an electrical meltdown. He left the engine running at night and only drove in the daytime.
Taking off the solid mounted fan and relying completely on an electric one would be a step backwards for me. JimSmith told about driving his manual MB during college for a long time by always parking it on a hill so he could roll start it when it had starter problems...
I really like the basic feeling of being able to count on the Mechanical parts of the car to get me home.... I have a love/hate relationship with electricity... mostly hate.
LOL
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  #21  
Old 12-05-2008, 01:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leathermang View Post
Some of you remember PEH telling about driving his MB half way across the country after an electrical meltdown. He left the engine running at night and only drove in the daytime.
Taking off the solid mounted fan and relying completely on an electric one would be a step backwards for me. JimSmith told about driving his manual MB during college for a long time by always parking it on a hill so he could roll start it when it had starter problems...
I really like the basic feeling of being able to count on the Mechanical parts of the car to get me home.... I have a love/hate relationship with electricity... mostly hate.
LOL
"Electricity - The high priestess of false security!"
Quote from a 1940s Sherlock Holmes film where Basil Rathbone describes the fallibility of a museum's brand-new anti-theft system.

Happy Motoring, Mark
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  #22  
Old 12-05-2008, 05:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pawoSD View Post
The solid fan has less blades though, so it probably doesn't cut off as much HP at higher RPMS as the more-blades fan would if it were coupled. At one point I was tempted to just throw a 240d fan on my car, but I managed to find a low miles plastic one. Also I couldn't get the fan off the 240D in the junk yard.
This is true. The solid fan is lighter and more reliable so fits a 240 which is less likely to be driven on the highway. At highway speed the fan is turning roughly the same speed as the inrushing air so I don't think it costs much hp. The 300 is geared higher so that could make a difference. The 300 fan has a lot more blades so loss from it turning any when not needed makes for more loss than the solid fan. I think the extra noise is a factor too perhaps the most significant in the engineers minds.

I doulbt you will see any difference in mileage if you put on the clutch fan.

(Although I have a clutch fan on my 300 na equipped 240)
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[SIGPIC] Diesel loving autocrossing grandpa Architect. 08 Dodge 3/4 ton with Cummins & six speed; I have had about 35 benzes. I have a 39 Studebaker Coupe Express pickup in which I have had installed a 617 turbo and a five speed manual.[SIGPIC]

..I also have a 427 Cobra replica with an aluminum chassis.
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  #23  
Old 12-05-2008, 06:03 AM
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I doubt that an electric fan will save fuel economy over a viscous clutched fan of the appropriate size in hot weather at least.

The electric fan will draw current activating the alternator.

The rbiggest eason, IMHO, most cars have electric fans is that so many now are front drive with transverse engines where a mechanical fan will not work at all.
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[SIGPIC] Diesel loving autocrossing grandpa Architect. 08 Dodge 3/4 ton with Cummins & six speed; I have had about 35 benzes. I have a 39 Studebaker Coupe Express pickup in which I have had installed a 617 turbo and a five speed manual.[SIGPIC]

..I also have a 427 Cobra replica with an aluminum chassis.
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  #24  
Old 12-05-2008, 06:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leathermang View Post
Some of you remember PEH telling about driving his MB half way across the country after an electrical meltdown. He left the engine running at night and only drove in the daytime.
Taking off the solid mounted fan and relying completely on an electric one would be a step backwards for me. JimSmith told about driving his manual MB during college for a long time by always parking it on a hill so he could roll start it when it had starter problems...
I really like the basic feeling of being able to count on the Mechanical parts of the car to get me home.... I have a love/hate relationship with electricity... mostly hate.
LOL
See, this is where I am too. Reliability is hard to beat.
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[SIGPIC] Diesel loving autocrossing grandpa Architect. 08 Dodge 3/4 ton with Cummins & six speed; I have had about 35 benzes. I have a 39 Studebaker Coupe Express pickup in which I have had installed a 617 turbo and a five speed manual.[SIGPIC]

..I also have a 427 Cobra replica with an aluminum chassis.
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  #25  
Old 12-05-2008, 07:28 AM
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I put a clutch fan on my 81 240D.
Didn't notice any difference.

Now the N/A 300D radiator.....

Jim
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  #26  
Old 12-05-2008, 08:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by t walgamuth View Post
I doubt that an electric fan will save fuel economy over a viscous clutched fan of the appropriate size in hot weather at least.

The electric fan will draw current activating the alternator.

The rbiggest eason, IMHO, most cars have electric fans is that so many now are front drive with transverse engines where a mechanical fan will not work at all.
Many cars have a dual electrc fan setup which operates one or both on demand, usually depending on AC useage. Others use variable-speed radiator-fans. I suppose they can save some MPG as the fans don't run constantly.
It's also easier for manufacturers to integrate an electric fan's operaton into the engine control system, as many cars now regulate fan and AC operation through the ECU. Of course this also adds an expensive electronic component and potential failure point into the cooling system.

Happy Motoring, Mark
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  #27  
Old 12-05-2008, 09:31 AM
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Clutch fan

IF you're actually in State College, you don't NEED a fan -- for another four months. At the suggestion of my friend and certified MB specialist, I remove mine at Thanksgiving, and put it back in around Memorial Day. I'm in Milwaukee, and we won't see 70F again until April or May.

I have a short commute, and no traffic jams to speak of; but my 240D couldn't even keep the thermostat open at speed on the Ohio Tpk in january ... on my way back from PA, where I bought it.

HTH.

--frankb

Quote:
Originally Posted by joeblack View Post
I have been out of contact for a while, travel, hospital and other bad things.
Thanks for all the responses and suggestions.
I Think I will take the fan out and mount an electric of a 300D airco in front.
Nice flat motors.

Thanks again.
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  #28  
Old 12-05-2008, 10:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimFreeh View Post
I put a clutch fan on my 81 240D.
Didn't notice any difference.



Jim
Huh, well I'm glad I didn't run out and start swapping fans, maybe I'll rethink this, thanks
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1985 Euro 240D 5 spd 140K
1979 240D 5 spd, 40K on engine rebuild
1994 Dodge/Cummins, 5 spd, 121K
1964 Allice Chalmers D15 tractor
2014 Kubota L3800 tractor
1964 VW bug

"Lifes too short to drive a boring car"
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  #29  
Old 12-05-2008, 10:37 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by franklynb View Post
IF you're actually in State College, you don't NEED a fan -- for another four months. At the suggestion of my friend and certified MB specialist, I remove mine at Thanksgiving, and put it back in around Memorial Day. I'm in Milwaukee, and we won't see 70F again until April or May.

I have a short commute, and no traffic jams to speak of; but my 240D couldn't even keep the thermostat open at speed on the Ohio Tpk in january ... on my way back from PA, where I bought it.

HTH.

--frankb
Do you notice any difference without the fan?
I might consider changing my '84 300TD's clutch-fan for a 240D fan, but the TD also has a working AC, so as long as it's not broke, I'm not 'fixing' it.

Happy Motoring, Mark
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  #30  
Old 12-05-2008, 11:01 AM
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For the record, my 409d van with a 617na had an aftermarket electric fan on it when I purchased it. It could not keep up with the heat load on long hills in the summer. I replaced it with a direct drive fan on a waterpump from a 115 617 and the difference in cooling was substantial.

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