Earlier 240 engine wrong for 82 240? - Page 2 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

Stevo · #16 11-13-2008, 09:56 AM

The oil cooler is not necessary on the 616 engines, totally an option. If you want one I will trade you as I have a couple oil filter housings with the proper fittings. You should probably invest in new hoses however. IMO the oil cooler is just another source of potential problems plus its nice to not have those hoses to work around. I dont know why the Germans put them on the 616 for export to the US.

As to the IP, dont know why you'd need to change that and the throttle shouldn't be a problem either, you might have to swap over some linkage but thats about it.

Graminal95 · #17 11-13-2008, 12:42 PM

The Germans put the oil cooler in the 240D for the US market because it got AC (very few 240s or even 300s got AC in Europe) and was sold all over the US, in places like Texas, Arizona.....where it gets really hot and where people will be cruising with the AC on. I don't think it would be needed in the northern climates where it not very hot but its nice to have and not much work to put in, or in this case swap over.

As for the IP, because the 82 he is putting the engine in is an automatic it needs the vacuum reference from the IP (or was that only for the EGR) to tell it how hard to shift. Seeing as the M pump does not have the vacuum valve (or whatever its proper name is) on it and as far as I can tell where it no easy way to bolt it onto the M pump, I think it would be easier to just swap the IP over. Thats just my observation someone with more knowledge then I might shed some more light on the issue at hand.

rs899 · #18 11-13-2008, 12:53 PM

Oh yeah, the VCV is a problem on your auto, but some of the euro cars had autos too, so you could probably find one of those and a liknage. Changing an IP seems a bit hard.

dieselnutnj · #19 11-13-2008, 01:19 PM

So long as your ip is ok.. leave well enough alone. Benz was very good about linkage. That should mount up ok.

I have seen variations in the valve covers some have bosses for linkage mounting plate, some dont. The basic block is the same, so I'm sure with a new gasket, you can switch your housings over to keep your old oil cooler.. but if you do, replace both cooler lines while you have it apart. The heads are different due to glowplugs. Just make sure that your ps pump mounts are correct as well as a/c mount. You should be able to swap flywheels and flex plates right over as your tourque converter will act as a flywheel for the Automatic.

#20 11-13-2008, 01:35 PM

The vacuum valve from any automatic 84-89 190D, 86-87 300SDL, 87 300D, 91-93 300D or 91-95 300/350SD/SDL will bolt on to your pump.

Stevo · #21 11-13-2008, 03:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Graminal95

The Germans put the oil cooler in the 240D for the US market because it got AC (very few 240s or even 300s got AC in Europe) and was sold all over the US, in places like Texas, Arizona.....where it gets really hot and where people will be cruising with the AC on. I don't think it would be needed in the northern climates where it not very hot but its nice to have and not much work to put in, or in this case swap over.

Sure, that stands to reason, I didn't realize they dont use AC over there that much. My 85 240D has AC however and has never given my any over heating problems when I visit Ca's central valley in the sweltering summer

Around here I never use it tho.

#22 11-13-2008, 03:08 PM

Don't forget that southern most latitude of Europe is almost even with Colorado's southern border. You'd have to go into Africa to get about even with the southern states.

Stevo · #23 11-13-2008, 06:25 PM

My latitude in the upper left corner is about 50 miles south of "Stuttgarts" and a good deal of Europe is north of that. No wonder they dont need AC.

paulpat · #24 11-13-2008, 09:58 PM

I am currently putting another engine in my 84 300 wagon. After I'm done with that I intend to put this engine in my wife's 240. I don't know what a "flex plate" is or how it relates to the flywheel. Also don't know what an "M pump" is. I do understand about the pilot bearing that went with the manual tranny and that it has to come out. I can swap the oil filter housing and put in pencil glow plugs ok. Do I understand you to say that the Mpump is the injector pump and that it has a different oil supply than the line that is currently in her 240? And that I don't in fact, need to swap the pump? But what about the vacuum lines that the current IP has and the replacement does not have? How do I deal with that?

paulpat · #25 11-13-2008, 10:06 PM

Are you saying that this engine does not need a flywheel because it will be using the torque convertor? I guess if it is safe I will leave the oil filter housing as is. It sounds like I dont really need the oil cooler. If that's true why add more work and cost (oil lines).

paulpat · #26 11-13-2008, 10:08 PM

Also I have a spare 300 engine that I can take some parts off of. You mentioned that some of the vacuum stuff from the 300 would work.

Graminal95 · #27 11-14-2008, 01:53 PM

The flex plate is what an automatic uses instead of the flywheel. It is a thin plate the has a ring gear on it so that the starter can turn the motor over, and has holes in it so that the torque converter can bolt onto it, giving it the mass that is similar to the flywheel.

Since from what I have read about putting a manual transmission in place of an automatic it has been said that the flywheel and flex plate have to balanced so they are the same. This way you don't get any extra vibration from an unbalanced crankshaft/flexplate combination. You are going to need new bolts for the flexplate as they are a different length then the ones foe the flywheel and really should only be used once since they are the stretchy type.

Now the M-pump is the type of injection pump that you have. It seems that the oil feed lines are different from the US (MW-pump) and the euro (M-Pump), so that is an issue that must be looked at. Now I think the easiest thing to do would be to get the VCV (Vacuum control valve)

"The vacuum valve from any automatic 84-89 190D, 86-87 300SDL, 87 300D, 91-93 300D or 91-95 300/350SD/SDL will bolt on to your pump."

http://catalog.peachparts.com/ShopByVehicle.epc?q=&yearid=1987%40%401987&makeid=MB%40%40MB%40%40X&modelid=190%2DD%2D002%40%40190D++2%2E5&keyword=valve&catid=All@@valve&subcatid=D3020@@Vacuum+Control+Valve&mode=PA

and put that onto your pump to tell the transmission how to act. This would be a lot easier then trying to make a MW-Pump work with your motor.

paulpat · #28 11-15-2008, 08:42 AM

I'm actually starting to understand all this. When you state that the flex plate needs to be balanced, how does that happen. The replacement engine does not have a flywheel, though I know it came off of a standard tranny. Do I just take the flex plate to a machine shop and ask them to "balance" it? Kinda like a tire gets balanced? Wouldn't it already be balanced from the factory?
Also, is it ok if I find a used vacuum valve. I see a new one costs about $100. And I assume that it must come from one of the specific models you named:84-89 190D, 86-87 300SDL, 87 300D, 91-93 300D or 91-95 300/350SD/SDL
Does anyone have one?
I'm hoping today to install the donor engine in my 300td wagon. It's all prepped and ready to go. I took pictures and marked all the lines so hopefully everything will go smoothly, haha.
The 240 is next. After I switch to pencil glow plugs can I just use the wire harness that is in the 82 240 and have them wired in parallel?

Graminal95 · #29 11-15-2008, 02:15 PM

If there is no flywheel on the replacement engine then there is nothing you can do balancing wise. Mercedes balances the front pulley, crank and flywheel/flexplate as one....so if your missing the flywheel there is nothing to do.

Ya I wouldn't buy a VCV unless you were under huge time constraints, just find one and verify that it works with a vacuum gauge.

Good luck with the wagon install.

You have to buy special glow plugs as the pencil type from a newer engine has much smaller threads then the older style. Bosch does make an upgrade style and thats what you need to buy. Then just used the 82 glow plug harness and relay.