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  #31  
Old 01-13-2009, 01:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pindoc1 View Post
Yes, that is the way I start it. In fact, I'm so anal about it I won't valet park it or take it to a car wash where someone else has to start it. And no lights come on once it's running except for the BAS/ACR once or twice a week.

Sacramento is pretty flat and its rare to park on a slant. I didn't have any fuel smells nor rough starts UNTIL I had the brakes done & the battery changed although I've always gotten crappy MPG.

Would my ambient temperature gauge give any diagnostic clues? This has worked only occasionally since I bought the car. It was 65 here yesterday and it read -5 and goes up & down like the market. Long shot but thought I'd ask. You guys have really educated me on things to look for in this car and I thank you.
I don't think the ambient temp sensor is for anything other than the dash display. The fuel injection computer gets a separate air temp sensor reading I believe. FWIW the fix for that would be pretty cheap. The sensor is only about $15 as I recall and it takes 5 minutes to replace it (it's located in the front grill and pops right out without tools). It might even just be the connection which is dirty causing it to be intermittent.

I can't imagine they could have done anything during the brake service to cause the fuel leak issues so I would suspect it is coincidence though I guess they could have knocked some of the fuel lines loose when they were under the hood assuming they had to add or flush the brake fluid - otherwise they would have little reason to be under the hood at all.

Does PINDOC=Acupuncturist?

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  #32  
Old 01-13-2009, 02:01 PM
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Yup, that's me. 20 years & counting.
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  #33  
Old 01-13-2009, 02:06 PM
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  #34  
Old 01-13-2009, 02:06 PM
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It's a shame that you really can't let just anybody under the hood of your car even if it's just to change the oil.
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  #35  
Old 01-13-2009, 02:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Dee8go View Post
It's a shame that you really can't let just anybody under the hood of your car even if it's just to change the oil.
You can let the hooker on 5th and main under the hood if you want but you just may not like the results. Not that you cannot though. Personally, I suggest bending her over the hood but not letting her touch anything under the hood. Car hood, that is.
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  #36  
Old 01-13-2009, 03:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BodhiBenz1987 View Post
I laughed out a little bit when I read that ... yeah, why ruin my own vehicle when the dealership can do it for me by putting twice as much oil in my Jeep as its capacity calls for? And plus, why miss out on the fun of having your drain bolt stripped when they torque it on with about 30 times the torque required?

Yeah, when I first started changing my own oil (and other fluids/filters), it was a pride thing. Now it's a don't-let-someone-else-&%$#-up-my-car thing.
I hear you Bodhi. On every vehicle that I have done an oil change to after a dealership has done it, I buy a spare drain plug first, and I usually have to get bolt removers to get the plug out.
On a Chevy that we had, the lube tech was not greasing anything on the suspension. When the tie rod ends wore out, dad took it to a place that did tires and suspenstions, and the mechanic that did that work said it looked like nothing on that truck had been greased. When we confronted the dealership about it, the service manager said something to the effect of it being really hard to grease the one tie rod end. It was almost inaccessible.
I called bull **** to that, and drove the truck up on blocks. When I went through the suspension, it didn't look like the kingpins had ever been greased. The tie rods and the connectors had to have penetrating oil soak into them for a few days before I could get grease into them, and bunch of stuff on the back I can say for 100% sure were never greased, because they still had the factory paint covering the tips of the grease nipples. The U-joints all had to be replaced as there was slop in them, and I doubt they were ever greased.
I had a look at the trans oil filter, and it was on the truck while it was bent. I told the dealership that they would never see that truck again. Dad and I look after it now. Black as the first oil came out, I'm starting to think that they hadn't changed it for the last 3 times it was in there.
I look after it now for the most part.
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  #37  
Old 01-13-2009, 03:28 PM
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No to twirling...hurts too much.

Hmmm. I don't remember there being a 5th & Main in Madison.
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  #38  
Old 01-13-2009, 05:17 PM
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  #39  
Old 01-13-2009, 11:45 PM
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Too funny....."no can change my transmission fluid" guy trying to play mechanica en general. LMAO!
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  #40  
Old 01-14-2009, 07:34 AM
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Originally Posted by Skid Row Joe View Post
Too funny....."no can change my transmission fluid" guy trying to play mechanica en general. LMAO!
Not sure who or what you are talking about. Depends on what transmission. On a 722.6 you cannot change your own fluid easily. You can drop the pan and change the fluid but you cannot check the levels without SDS. In my 606, I installed the CD changer myself. Again, I had to get SDS to convince the BCM, IIRC, that I had the CD changer.
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  #41  
Old 01-15-2009, 08:09 AM
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Originally Posted by aklim View Post
Not sure who or what you are talking about. Depends on what transmission. On a 722.6 you cannot change your own fluid easily. You can drop the pan and change the fluid but you cannot check the levels without SDS. In my 606, I installed the CD changer myself. Again, I had to get SDS to convince the BCM, IIRC, that I had the CD changer.
I've changed the fluid in 4-5 722.6 trannies without SDS. Using the dipstick tool is perfectly acceptable. I have heard all sorts of rumors about how sensitive these are to fluid level deviation, but in reality it is not true (at least based upon my real world experience). I usually fill them to the bottom of the dipstick, which takes about 7 liters (with a TC drain), then drive them for a half hour or so to warm them up and fill until the top of the 80C line is reached and all is fine. That's usually another 0.5-0.75 liters.

I had even forgotten once to top off the level and drove for 1000+ miles with the fluid at the bottom of the dipstick and noticed no difference in the way the tranny operated. Think of it this way...the transmission has to be able to operate in real world conditions, going up and down hills, pulling lateral Gs, etc. It can't be designed only to work with a precise fluid level on perfectly level ground...it has to be able to operate in all orientations. I do fill mine to the top line on the dipstick and yeah, you can't be sure it is exactly at 80C but it would have to be pretty close since the fluid is passing through the cooler which is at 80C from the engine coolant once everything is fully warmed up.
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  #42  
Old 01-15-2009, 12:11 PM
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So, are we making any progress helping pindoc1 with the problems noted in the original post?

15 MPG: Fuel leaks can contribute to this, as can your daily drive. Short, stop and go city driving and you will be lucky to top 20 mpg. When cold these cars suffer a substantial degradation of fuel mileage, both during the warm up period and during normal operation. I drive more than 50% highway and have a ScanGauge II installed, and note about a 2 to 3 mpg penalty when the temperatures drop below 40 degrees F. Longer warm ups and unless it is loaded pretty good (greater than 70 mph, for example) the mileage just drops. Highway can be 31 plus on a warm day, and 28 to 29 on a cold one. City driving in the cold, 18 to 22.

Rough Starts, rough running until warm: Smoking and rough starts to me sounds like a glow plug or two is gone. The fuel system seems to be leak free (Diesel is an unmistakable odor, and if it is gone, there is likely no leak left), so that leaves glow plugs. This is a reasonable DIY job based on the very well done write up by Lightman, but not if you are either inexperienced or not inclined to do mechanical work on the engine. In that case take it to a recommended shop, like the earlier recommendation you got for someone more or less local to you. That guy (Enrique or Ernesto - one of you guys out there will have to speak up) has more endorsements on this board than any other shop that has been noted. Worth the trip to take it to a KNOWN competent and honest mechanic. Have the intake manifold cleaned as well - the exhaust gas recirculation system combines with the relatively slight oil blow-by in these machines to clog the intake manifold. If yours has never been cleaned, well, that could be a real problem. Mine was plugged more than 50% the first time I did the glow plugs and it took me a while to figure out how to get that stuff out, and get the intake manifold back to shiny metal on the inside. Once cleaned out the car ran very noticeably smoother.

General advice - go to the dealer and get a copy of the car's maintenance history, take it to Enrique/Ernesto and have him assess the state of maintenance. No car can run reliably for a long time without maintenance. The transmission fluid should be changed every 60k miles, or less. Brakes should be flushed whenever they are serviced - brake fluid is seriously cheap and flushing takes corrosion enabling or prone fluid out of the system. MB recommends every 2 years, in the Spring. Coolant - same story - the corrosion inhibitors wear out with time and it needs to be changed. The engine has aluminum and cast iron and god knows what else all coupled by an electrolyte - without something to inhibit galvanic corrosion your parts slowly dissolve and redeposit in unintended areas. Change it every two to three years.

The list goes on, and if it was a neglected vehicle you will have some added expense associated with catching up, but once caught up these cars are pretty reliable. Glow plugs are a routine problem, and my prescription for regular maintenance is a routing "Italian tune up" where you find a long hill and, with a fully warmed up engine, drive wide open throttle until no more soot shoots out the rear. Do this regularly and the engine will be happier.

By the way, I have never had that battery thing with the steering wheel in mine. I believe there is a radio code you have to reenter, but either I wound the steering wheel lock to lock inadvertently or 1998 models just don't have that feature on the steering wheel. Mine does not have ESP but it does have ASD. ASD is a rear wheel system that I could do without. It has never really helped me and in snow I shut it off as the math of no wheels turning seems to satisfy the system better than uneven rotating speeds, which does not let you get out of snow.

Jim
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Last edited by JimSmith; 01-15-2009 at 12:36 PM.
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  #43  
Old 01-15-2009, 12:44 PM
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Originally Posted by nhdoc View Post
I've changed the fluid in 4-5 722.6 trannies without SDS. Using the dipstick tool is perfectly acceptable. I have heard all sorts of rumors about how sensitive these are to fluid level deviation, but in reality it is not true (at least based upon my real world experience). I usually fill them to the bottom of the dipstick, which takes about 7 liters (with a TC drain), then drive them for a half hour or so to warm them up and fill until the top of the 80C line is reached and all is fine. That's usually another 0.5-0.75 liters.

I had even forgotten once to top off the level and drove for 1000+ miles with the fluid at the bottom of the dipstick and noticed no difference in the way the tranny operated. Think of it this way...the transmission has to be able to operate in real world conditions, going up and down hills, pulling lateral Gs, etc. It can't be designed only to work with a precise fluid level on perfectly level ground...it has to be able to operate in all orientations. I do fill mine to the top line on the dipstick and yeah, you can't be sure it is exactly at 80C but it would have to be pretty close since the fluid is passing through the cooler which is at 80C from the engine coolant once everything is fully warmed up.
I guess I am one of those who is pretty anal about it and want to KNOW for sure it is 80C and not just think it is there. On my other vehicles, I just put it level, dump the fluid and make sure it is pretty close but a little low then I get it up to speed and temp and make sure.
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  #44  
Old 01-17-2009, 07:47 AM
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Any progress here?

Most of this has already been addressed but just to review:

Quote:
Originally Posted by pindoc1 View Post
I love this car! Bought it 14 months ago from a dealer. Got horrid gas mileage (15MPG) and they said nothing wrong with it so I sucked it up.
Should be getting 25-30 something depending on conditions.

Quote:
Originally Posted by pindoc1 View Post
Ran great until I took it to an independent German shop for a brake job and when they went to start it the battery was dead so they replaced it. Since I got it back there was a fresh diesel smell that lingered long after being turned off and I could even smell it in the garage in the AM. It also started really rough, and idled rough until it warmed up. I took it back to the shop and they replaced all the fuel lines, hoses, actuator, etc., and $1800. later I no longer have the smells but it runs rough, smokes and NOW the BAS/ACR light comes on. The shop says their computer won't even read it now.
$1800 seems like a lot. Do you have a breakdown of the costs for all the parts, labor, etc? What's an "actuator"? It's a tough "row to hoe" as they say, when you take a car to a shop for work and every time you do, more stuff goes wrong. I'd hate to get into a battle with them over the definition of "pre-existing conditions". If you decide to cut your losses and try another shop, you may want to check this thread out:

Sacramento Area

Also, for the rough running/smoke condition, review posts 8, 9, 16, 25, 31 and 42.

Quote:
Originally Posted by pindoc1 View Post
Does anybody have any ideas? I am very frustrated becasue I love this car!
As other have said, the smoke and rough starting can be bad glow plugs or possibly dirty injectors. How handy are you? Take another look at the fuel lines, even though they've been replaced and look for air. Have you figured out where they are? You can take a flashlight and shine the beam through the lines and look for bubbles when the car is running. Be VERY carefull of the fan and spinning components!
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  #45  
Old 01-20-2009, 04:44 PM
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Ok, guys & gals. Have had it back to shop (same one where I originally spent all the money) and they just called and said "that they finally got a computer to read my car and GP#4 is bad (thank you for the above post) supposedly causing all the smoke, idling problems, etc., and the stop light switch is what is causing the BAS/ASR light to keep coming on. Now I have to spend another another$700. to repair it. Since I had all the fuel lines, etc., changed out I am getting 17.98MPG so that is improving but still not stellar.

My inclination is to take it to another shop. I just don't feel comfortable giving them MORE money when, eventhough I got 15MPG, it was running fine when I took it in. However, I'm smart enough to realize that used vehicles do break down and these things may need fixing. I am also well aware of the definition of insanity....

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