The new BMW diesel ads - Page 2 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

LUVMBDiesels · #16 01-13-2009, 05:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheDon

I love the prius/hybrid owners that blast past me on the highway at like 80...

green alright.

I'd drive a Honda insight, now those are true mpg machines

Just had to deal with a green colored Prius on the highway today. We were both doing around 80. I wonder which car was really 'greener' the Toyota or my 22 year old Diesel

DieselAddict · #17 01-13-2009, 07:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LUVMBDiesels

I am really liking the BMW/VW Diesel ads. MB comes across as too high faluting for a lot of people so they ignore the claims MB makes about Diesels. However, if you take a old Beetle, give it a voice like somebody's sweet grandfather and paint it 'green with envy' it gets the point across. I hope that these type of ads will change the perception of Diesels for everybody -- not just VW and BMW.

I haven't seen any VW diesel ads. The truth is they're not really needed. VW pretty much sells every TDI that it can import, at least until recently, I don't know about now. BMW diesels are quite expensive, especially for a mere 3-series and I don't know how much ads can help if they cost that much. Both MB and BMW are making the mistake of importing only the high-end diesels as if their #1 concern is overcoming the misconception that diesels are slow. Mileage & price seem secondary to them.

pizzachef · #18 01-14-2009, 01:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by LUVMBDiesels

This has been discussed before. If I recall the car that came in better than a Prius has a Hummer H3! Do a search on Prius Vs Hummer.
http://www.google.com/search?q=prius+Vs+Hummer&ie=utf-8&oe=utf-8&aq=t&rls=org.mozilla:en-US

fficial&client=firefox-a

Here is part of an article:
"
To compare, the Toyota Prius involves $3.25 per mile in energy costs over its lifetime, according to CNW, while several full-size SUVs scored lower. A Dodge Viper involves only $2.18 in energy per mile over its lifetime. The Range Rover Sport costs $2.42, and the Cadillac Escalade costs $2.75.

“If a consumer is concerned about fuel economy because of family budgets or depleting oil supplies, it is perfectly logical to consider buying high-fuel-economy vehicles, said Art Spinella, president of CNW, in a release. “But if the concern is the broader issues such as environmental impact of energy usage, some high-mileage vehicles actually cost society more than conventional or even larger models over their lifetime."
http://www.thecarconnection.com/article/1010861_prius-versus-hummer-exploding-the-myth

This article spends most of its time speaking against that CNW report...that quote above is taken from the CNW report. The article is quite long and cites several passages from the CNW report. But it also says that "This study has been completely contradicted by studies from MIT, Argonne National Labs and Carnegie Mellon’s Lifecycle Assessment Group..."

They also have not apparently released the methodology used in compiling their figures to be peer reviewed in a professional journal.

Quote:

Originally Posted by LUVMBDiesels

ANother:
" Building a Toyota Prius causes more environmental damage than a Hummer that is on the road for three times longer than a Prius. As already noted, the Prius is partly driven by a battery which contains nickel. The nickel is mined and smelted at a plant in Sudbury, Ontario. This plant has caused so much environmental damage to the surrounding environment that NASA has used the â€˜dead zoneâ€™ around the plant to test moon rovers. The area around the plant is devoid of any life for miles.
The plant is the source of all the nickel found in a Priusâ€™ battery and Toyota purchases 1,000 tons annually. Dubbed the Superstack, the plague-factory has spread sulfur dioxide across northern Ontario, becoming every environmentalistâ€™s nightmare."
http://clubs.ccsu.edu/Recorder/editorial/editorial_item.asp?NewsID=188

I've also heard about this nickel mine and plant that has destroyed the area around it...then in the article that you linked to from the car connection, it says this about that nickel plant:

"Toyota says that nickel has been mined from in Sudbury since the 1800s, and that “the large majority of the environmental damage from nickel mining in and around Sudbury was caused by mining practices that were abandoned decades ago.” Out of the Inco mine’s 174,800-ton output in 2004, Toyota purchased 1000 tons, just over a half-percent of its output. The plant’s emissions of sulfur dioxide are down 90 percent from 1970 levels, and it’s targeting a 97-percent reduction in those emissions by 2015, according to Toyota.
Of course, metal-hydride hybrid batteries aren’t the only use for nickel. One widespread use of nickel is for the chrome (chromium-nickel) plating that’s widely used in trim and wheels for luxury vehicles. And according to the Nickel Institute, which represents trade groups, manufacturers, and nickel producers, about two-thirds of all nickel mined goes toward stainless steel, which is of course widely used in vehicles — exhaust systems, for instance. Another significant portion goes toward engine alloys — pistons, rings, liners and the like; in general, the larger the engine, the more nickel it’s likely to have."

So it doesn't appear to be the hybrid batteries that have destroyed the landscape there. At least according to Toyota's statement inthat article

but still, if they bought 1/2% of the company's annual nickel production, there's more people to blame than just hybrids.

And I'll add a caveat to this..I haven't read up much on this hybrid battery controversy, just heard rumors mostly. I'm just pointing out some things mentioned in the article that is the first hit on the google search that you posted

If I was going to add my two cents to the conversation, I'd say that an efficient diesel engine coupled to an electric motor would make a much more efficient hybrid...or better yet, a diesel generator that powers 4 independent electric motors, one at each wheel. Something that you could plug in at night and only have the engine kick in after the batteries run down...that would seem ideal...you'd have peak torque off the line and AWD to boot :O

DieselAddict · #19 01-14-2009, 04:47 PM

Good post, pizzachef. I always knew there was an environmental cost behind hybrid batteries (as with everything else made by man) but it was hard for me to believe that a Hummer is more environmentally friendly than a Prius. I don't like either of these vehicles but it always sounded to me like propaganda.

rocky raccoon · #20 01-14-2009, 05:57 PM

Rented one for 4 weeks in Italy. Drove from Florence to Taormina and back to Monaco. Great Car! Fast, quiet and handles the mountain roads. My poor head can't calculate fuel mileage in U.S. terms because of the correction to miles plus buying in liters but it seemed pretty good.

If they sell it here, I would recommended it to anyone.

DieselAddict · #21 01-14-2009, 06:24 PM

It's already out and it's supposedly a US-only model, though Europe has a very similar one. I bet the one you rented in Italy was a lower-end model. This one has 425 ft-lbs of torque.

LUVMBDiesels · #22 01-14-2009, 08:46 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DieselAddict

It's already out and it's supposedly a US-only model, though Europe has a very similar one. I bet the one you rented in Italy was a lower-end model. This one has 425 ft-lbs of torque.

We need the lower end model here too. What good are Diesels that cost $65000?

DieselAddict · #23 01-15-2009, 01:29 PM

Well the 335d actually costs about $44K, but that's still a lot for a 3-series IMO.