This approach is also perfectly acceptable for a quick check without the lights.

There was no expectation of a "running car" when the A-B lights were used. It was to be utilized as a diagnostic tool to determine where the IP timing is relative to the crankshaft.

As such, it would have fulfilled this task perfectly.

BTW, there's nothing wrong with a compression test........when you get done, you've got a bit more data........and you haven't harmed anything.

And is exactly the approach I suggested to the OP in my PM to him earlier today.

I strongly discourage communication via PM. If you take him down the wrong path........there's nobody to solve it and there is no possibility of recreating the events. The full onerous of a paperweight will be upon YOU.

I very rarely provide advice via PM.........only in the case of a single post response that will fix the issue. Anything that requires any thought or testing is directed to the forum.

Thank you for your permission. Perhaps I will take you up on that if I ever feel I must.

It was clear from the OP's saga that the timing of the cam had been in question. And changed by just about 180 degrees. Perhaps you failed to read that posting.

Two minutes plus about a week for shipping. Plus it will NOT tell you by itself if you are 180 degrees off. (I'll leave the proof as an exercise for the student.)

I have an idea... Let's try to help the guy fix his problem? ;)

Point well taken. So, here it is. Get out your red pencil.

And finally:
Brian, I hope this meets with your approval.

It's fine.

However, there is no question that the engine will start........it already did.

And, since it did.......without too much effort.......I'd dispense with the compression test. Unless one cylinder is dead, it can't explain the rough idle.

He probably doesn't have the equipment for a compression test anyway.

Thank you. :rolleyes:

The condition of the engine is totally unknown... it was purchased used and never operated by the original poster prior to replacing the chain. There are no data to suggest that the compression is good on all of the cylinders. In addition, there is the real possibility of bent valves based on the information posted that the engine would not continue to turn by hand because the cam timing was off enough to cause a valve to contact a piston.

There is a data point (post 18) that indicates that he in fact does have the equipment required to perform this operation.

;)

You asked........




Then, by all means, more data is always helpful.

Ace Taxi: Did you start or attempt to start the engine after putting it in the car? If so, how did it operate? Why did you replace timing chain?

Gentlemen,

The engine came from a '93 with approx. 150K miles, per the seller. Has been out of the car for a couple of years. IP intact, all other bolt-ons were removed. PO stated that the engine was running fine before he stripped the car for salvage.

After we had the motor in, it ran, but very very poorly, rough idle, much smoke, no pick up, temp spike on idle. Valves may have been hitting at that point. Given well documented TC stretch issues w/OM602 as discussed elsewhere, I decided to change out the timing chain. [It was during this changeout that I ran into trouble and first started this thread.]

After replacing TC, car ran worse than before, would not idle - although clanking sound (which I initially took to be a loose TC and has since been suggested was the valves hitting) was no longer present. Turned the camshaft 180* per JonL and that brings us to present condition.

Assuming that the IP timing is more than a few degrees off, I am going to have to remove the IP to fix it, correct? In that case, does it make any sense to simply pull the IP from the old motor, line everything up, and install? That motor was running great until we bent a rod at 415K mi.

Alternatively, is there any way to compare the two pumps so as to diagnose and align the pump that is currently on the engine? I know there is a DIY on removing the IP; I have studied it carefully. Is there one on adjusting the IP?

As each day passes the pressure to get this car rolling increases. Cab 6 ('97 E300) is still in the body shop for repairs following a hit by an F150) during a snowstorm, and C2 ('95 Suburban) just got towed in with a blown head gasket. Don't you wish you were me?

Can we please stop making assumptions? As suggested by Owell in post #29, it's time to go to the IP, remove the plug to the port on the left side, rotate the engine until you can feel/see the notch in the window, read the crankshaft damper, and check the camshaft for stroke.

As suggested above, this can be done today, without the A-B lights.


Also, since you have the equipment for a compression test, how about getting some figures........??

I agree with Brian. You'll only solve this car's problem with a logical, methodical approach. There are two big unknowns -- the engine condition, and the IP timing. Both can be determined relatively quickly and easily. If it were me, I'd want to know if I was wasting my time with the engine and I'd do the compression test first. Of course, I might end up magically converting a paperweight into a lawn ornament or a chicken coop. Maybe we can give Brian a shot at that! ;)

Seriously, you can check either thing first... You will absolutely need to set the IP timing before the car runs well, and knowing where you are now is the first step to that.

Well.......let's hope for the best......maybe it's just IP and cam timing........