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replacing a 603 with 5 cylinder
Has anybody ever replaced a 603 with the 5 cylinder? It's in a 91 350sd.
Thanks. |
#2
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I believe someone here has done this swap, and it wasn't as straightforward as they originally thought it would be.
If your 350 has "bent" the dust, why not look for a 603.96x that has a cracked cylinder head? You can use your head and the good 3 liter lower end to make a very reliable motor. Or look into the cylinder sleeves and pistons available for the .97x. Though they are spendy... -J
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1991 350SDL. 230,000 miles (new motor @ 150,000). Blown head gasket Tesla Model 3. 205,000 miles. Been to 48 states! Past: A fleet of VW TDIs.... including a V10,a Dieselgate Passat, and 2 ECOdiesels. 2014 Cadillac ELR 2013 Fiat 500E. |
#3
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Replacing a 603 with a 617
Yes it can be done. I suppose it depends on how much you want to do and how technically competant you are. (High degree of skill for this job.)
Recently, W. Roy Hunter (see below) and I have been working on just such a change. However, in our process we started with a body shell (no engine / trans / some of the interior) and were moving stuff from an 85 617 SD to a 603 SD. There are a number of issues you should be aware of: Complete drive train removal and replacement takes a long time. So far about 3 weeks of part time work with 2 people. We took everything from the engine to the entire rear end of the 617 SD and transplanted it to the 603 SD. In doing that the 603 SD 3 piece drive shaft was not able to be used. We removed the 300 SD driveshaft bracket and transplanted / secured it into the 603 SD. Then ground down the 2 other brackets. (rust proofing as we went along) The rear dif is off-set and thus cannot be used with the 617 SD drive shaft / trans combination. The rear axle assembly including springs and support arms is a bolt in. But this is difficult to do. The motor mounts are the same in both vehicles. I think the trans mounts are the same as well. (not sure, check with W. Hunter) The engine shock on the driver's side uses a different bracket placement on the 603 SD vs the 617 300SD. (the 617 engine shock will need a new bracket welded onto the 603 SD engine cross member in the 617 SD location) Electrical (starting ciruits) and vacuum systems are different and will have to be sorted out (a work in progress) You have to remember that the engine /trans was already out so we could not verify / save all the original connections. It's going to take some detective work. The fore and aft false bulk head / heat shield on the passenger side can be disposed of. In its place you will need to install the heater pipe. The pipe uses the same holes as the false bulk head did. Working on a Texas (southern) car is a lot easier than working on a rusty northern car (car we were transplanting to was from Texas). Vacuum out all the mulch under the battery tray and brake booster or you may have a fire in your future. The car is running, but not all electrical / vacuum are hooked up. The starting circuit is still a mystery. Roy had to jumper it to get it started. Call / PM WHunter to get the real low-down and where he is at. W. (Roy) Hunter (forum member & moderator and forum TECHNICAL SUPPORT Roy Roy@PeachParts.com See the Fastlane left panel for a phone number.
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Pete Williams, President emeritus - MBCA-International Stars (Eastern Mich.) Now Wi. & Az. 1985 300D Manual 4 speed Green Hen's tooth 1979 MGB triple black Az car nice 1969 back 1/2 of MGB (Az home built trailer) 1991 Volvo 245 Wagon Nice AZ Restored Gold Brick 1983 Jeep CJ7 37,600 Miles Summer use only |
#4
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603 to 617
Of course if you have the transmission, I'm not exactly sure if the 617 will bolt up to the 603 transmission. As stated in the prior note, the motor mount positions are OK, 1 engine shock is not and the electrical / vacuum stuff is a question mark.
Roy may know about this. W. (Roy) Hunter (forum member & moderator and forum TECHNICAL SUPPORT Roy Roy@PeachParts.com See the Fastlane left panel for a phone number.)
__________________
Pete Williams, President emeritus - MBCA-International Stars (Eastern Mich.) Now Wi. & Az. 1985 300D Manual 4 speed Green Hen's tooth 1979 MGB triple black Az car nice 1969 back 1/2 of MGB (Az home built trailer) 1991 Volvo 245 Wagon Nice AZ Restored Gold Brick 1983 Jeep CJ7 37,600 Miles Summer use only |
#5
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602 5cyl might be easier !
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Red Green "This is only temporary,Unless it works!" 97 E300D 157000 miles 87 300TD ?141k? miles |
#6
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I agree. The OM602/603 engines are nearly identical, to the extent that the factory published one manual for both of them.
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"Buster" in the '95 Our all-Diesel family 1996 E300D (W210) . .338,000 miles Wife's car 2005 E320 CDI . . 113,000 miles My car Santa Rosa population 176,762 (2022) Total. . . . . . . . . . . . 627,762 "Oh lord won't you buy me a Mercedes Benz." -- Janis Joplin, October 1, 1970 |
#7
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why??
WHy not get a 603 from an SDL or 87 300D. Less work and much nicer rider
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1986 300SDL, 211K,Dealership serviced its whole life 1991 190E 2.6(120k) 1983 300D(300k) 1977 300D(211k) |
#8
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"Vacuum out all the mulch under the battery tray and brake booster or you may have a fire in your future."
While this is important I think you will find the 603 equipped body doesn't have the blower resistor pack there. You're going to have to do some tricky wiring if you want to keep the updated climate control system because it is looking for an RPM signal from the AC compressor. -J
__________________
1991 350SDL. 230,000 miles (new motor @ 150,000). Blown head gasket Tesla Model 3. 205,000 miles. Been to 48 states! Past: A fleet of VW TDIs.... including a V10,a Dieselgate Passat, and 2 ECOdiesels. 2014 Cadillac ELR 2013 Fiat 500E. |
#9
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I agree with the above, go 3.0L 603 instead. The 5-cyl 602 turbo engine is probably harder to find (be sure you don't get an '87 unless the head has been updated) and will not load the springs properly, but otherwise should be only minor issues.
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Gone to the dark side - Jeff |
#10
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Answer.
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ASE Master Mechanic asemastermechanic@juno.com Prototype R&D/testing: Thermal & Aerodynamic System Engineering (TASE) Senior vehicle instrumentation technician. Noise Vibration and Harshness (NVH). Dynamometer. Heat exchanger durability. HV-A/C Climate Control. Vehicle build. Fleet Durability Technical Quality Auditor. Automotive Technical Writer 1985 300SD 1983 300D 1984 190D 2003 Volvo V70 2002 Honda Civic https://www.boldegoist.com/ |
#11
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Thanks for all the info. The reason I had posted the question was that I picked up an 91 350sd with the 603 and the guy lost oil pressure and shut it down pretty quick. But, to turn the engine with a pull handle is real hard. He had his Indy tell him he thought it was the main/rod bearings.
I've got the 5 cylinder in a 83 300sd that the body isn't great on but the engine is great. I was bouncing around what my best approach might be. Thanks for the info. |
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