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  #31  
Old 11-04-2001, 07:30 PM
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to quote from an earlier thread......


."[MB has ALWAYS made nothing but solid cars that were known for reliability and longevity. Do they make mistakes and do some of their cars have some achilles heals? Of course"


all I have to say is have you looked at the historic stats and costs of repairing/maintaining a 140?....maybe there you will see how Lexus got a foothold in the US luxury car market in the early 90's.......a decent looking car,great dealer service,good build quality and features and a price that was $25K or more less....and the bonus!!......no closing assist pumps and evaporators every two years!!! and window regulators and instrument cluster shorting out and steering shimmy...etc...etc...etc...I think you may get my point........all of these items may have helped Lexus soemwhat in the early to mid 90's....as even the Mercedes "snobs" have better things to do than spend all their time at the dealer....

my .002


Warren
1992 300SD 126K
Columbus Ohio

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  #32  
Old 11-04-2001, 11:10 PM
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ever change a starter on an early eighties Corolla
you have to take the exhaust manifold loose and pull it out of the way some engineering,plus to change the alternator you needed the hands of a safecracker to worm it in place from the underneath if you were lucky enough to get the right alternator in the fist place as they made several different sizes for the same year......
William Rogers....
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  #33  
Old 11-04-2001, 11:22 PM
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I cast my vote for "driver courtesy", and not "emblem one-upmanship".

Too late though...this has already turned into another "Lexus-versus-Mercedes-Benz" thread...

When will we ever learn?
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  #34  
Old 11-05-2001, 01:16 AM
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never....
William Rogers
74 240 D
81 SD
81 costom 2wd Blazer 454 built into shorty pick up not much weight for HP any you 500 sel drivers want to try an eigth mile?
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  #35  
Old 11-05-2001, 02:50 AM
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Perhaps as the owner of a 1979 240D with almost 163,000 miles and a 1992 Lexus 400 with almost 63,000 miles, I can add something to this thread.

First, the 240D still runs, drives and rides about as well as it ever did. Up until about three or four years ago, there were no sqeaks or rattles but they have begun to show up. The plastic (MB Tex) seats are still as good as new. The paint is original and in excellent condition. The only complaint I ever had about the car was the never ending maintenence requirements, all of which were done, and the utter unreliability of the vehicle. I have owned a lot of cars, starting in 1950, and the Mercedes has left me stranded on the side of the road (starting when it was about 2 years old) more than all the other automobiles I have owned combined.

Someone commenting here acknowledged that Toyota vehicles are reliable, but they just didn't appeal to him. Well, when you have been stranded by an automobile at inopportune times and in out of the way places as many times as I have, you (at least I) am inclined to put a great deal of emphasis on reliability.

The Lexus does not drive nor ride as well as a Mercedes, but the level at which those qualities do exist are at least tolerable. After nine years (with the leather seats perfectly intact and interior still judged by others to be "just like new") the only repair that has been made on the Lexus was replacement of the air conditioning compressor this past summer. No, it wasn't a cheap repair, but the cost is still less than what was spent on the MB in maintenance, towing charges and repairs during its first 63,000 miles and, so far at least, it has not left me stranded even once.

In summary, I would say that each car has it endearing qualities, but since I detest the inconvenience of finding myself afoot somewhere out in the boonies, my preference right now lies with the Lexus.

One other point, since my Lexus is driven mostly in accordance with "Class B" conditions as described in the Owner's Manual, I am told that replacement of the timing belt is recommended at 90,000 miles.

Oh yes......I do stop and allow other drivers to enter the road ahead of me, no matter which car I am driving. A matter of common courtesy, even when the Lexus timing belt is not broken and the MB is running.
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  #36  
Old 11-05-2001, 06:57 AM
LarryBible
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Ted,

I'm sorry to hear about your luck with your 240D. I was amazed to hear it.

My 240D and all the other 123's I have had, have been the most reliable automobiles I've ever owned. In fact reliability and longevity, at least the experience I've had is the only thing that keeps me going with these cars. I don't consider a 123 Benz to be the best looking, best driving, or most stylish car on the road by any stretch of the imagination. What has appealed to me about them has been their solidity and stone cold reliability.

Either I'm very lucky, or you're very unlucky. And, I do believe that luck does play into such things.

I hope both cars keep going down the road well for you.

Have a great day,
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  #37  
Old 11-05-2001, 09:23 AM
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I feel a need to jump in an echo Larry's comment here. I don't currently have a 123 in the stable, but owned one for 7 years. It was 10 years old when purchased, 17 when sold.

It stranded my wife once in that time. It was the old master cylinder failure where the rear brakes lock up.

That's it. Never once failed to start in that entire time. Never failed to reach its destination other than that one time. (I'm not counting the time I ran it out of fuel on Central Expressway...)

Was it problem free - not by a long shot. Was it always solid, reliable transportation - you bet. My impression is that Larry and I have had much more typical experiences.
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  #38  
Old 11-05-2001, 09:45 AM
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I think there is a point that needs to need to be made about comparing apples and oranges...there has been a lot said about 123 cars here.....I think they are great cars in their own right but I think the comparisons need to be made with cars of the same era..........how does the ES300 compare to the 94 plus C class or 124 E class......and how does the LS 400 compare to the later 126 and early 140 cars........

well I can already vouch for the comparison to the 140 in terms of shoptime..I think that would make the LS400 hands down winner for that one......

but how do they compare to the other cars?

Warren
1992 300SD 127K
Columbus Ohio
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  #39  
Old 11-05-2001, 04:28 PM
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Would not hesitate for a minute to put a new set of tires on my 74 240 D and drive it to South America and back only fear would be border crossings.It smokes a touch but maybe I could pick up a few bucks along the way doing mosquitoe control......
William Rogers.....
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  #40  
Old 11-05-2001, 06:24 PM
LarryBible
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William,

I wish I could say the same for my 240D. It is currently out of action. Of course with so many miles, I guess it has a right to demand a little attention. When I get my motor done and put it back on the road, I'm sure I'll be ready for that challenge then.

Right now though, with the fresh motor in my daughter's 300D, I wouldn't even have to stop by the tire store. It has almost new tires and everything is ready to go. I would hope that everyone would let my transmission cooling line arrive this week. Once that's on and the transmission topped up, I'm ready for the trip. I'll stop by and pick you up on the way. Where are we going in South America? ?

Have a great day,
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  #41  
Old 11-05-2001, 07:31 PM
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Larry, Just got the globe out and at the very bottom of Uruguay is a city named " Mercedes"
sounds like the spot to me......
William Rogers......
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  #42  
Old 11-05-2001, 08:24 PM
LarryBible
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William,

The way everything's going with the company I work for, I may have plenty of time for the trip soon. I'll let you know when I'm stopping by.

I've always wanted to drive to Alaska. An Australian that worked for us, took a six month leave of absence, bought an old LandCruiser and had it shipped somewhere at the Southern tip of South America. He and his girlfriend flew down there, picked it up and took the six months to drive back. I would love to take a trip like that someday, except he came back to a struggling company that had no job for him. Not to mention the economy went in the dumper while he was gone, so he hasn't been able to find another job. You pays your money and take your chances.

I wonder if someone would want to take a Lexus on the trip with us to see which car breaks first.

Have a great day,
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  #43  
Old 11-05-2001, 08:42 PM
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Larry , I helped drive to Alaska (1987) from Michigan in a crazy friends 63 GMC Ton and a half grain truck a real adventure good for at least a long short story.We got stopped by the cops 5 times.........
William Rogers.....
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  #44  
Old 11-07-2001, 07:25 AM
LarryBible
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William,

I sure would want to have a very full tool box if I took off for Alaska in any grain truck I've ever been in. It seems like every grain truck or hay truck I've ever seen was a ton and a half chassis that had already beeon worn completely out by a furniture company or some such.

I still see that a trip like that, especially for someone foot loose and fancy free would be a great experience.

I guess the closest I ever came to a trek like that was my GrandDad taking me to Colorado, camping when I was five years old. We were in a totally worn out '39 Ford pickup. I say worn out, but actually it just looked worn out. He kept all his equipment in great mechanical condition. I can't remember any breakdowns of any kind, not so much as a flat tire.

If I ever have a Grandson/granddaughter, I'll have to do something like that for him/her to remember.

Have a great day,

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