another no start issue. - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

blackestate · #1 11-28-2009, 12:01 AM

I have moved the engine from my 85 SD (CA model) that has sat for a year, to an 83 SD.
I bled the fuel lines all of the way to the injectors, GP have power and seem to be working. I just remembered I need to ohm through the connector at the GP relay and make sure I have not broke a wire.
The engine is smoking when trying to start, and almost catches. But it just will not start.
What else should I look at. This was running good before the car was ruined, Now trying to bring it back to life.

thanks

DrewGerhan · #2 11-28-2009, 12:05 AM

Pump timing?
Air in the system somehow?

Brian Carlton · #3 11-28-2009, 12:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blackestate

GP have power and seem to be working.

Explain your test to verify the above. What is the real meaning of "seem to be" in the above statement?

tbomachines · #4 11-28-2009, 12:47 AM

So would it be safe to say 2 or 3 cylinders are firing? I would double check all the glow plugs for good measure.

blackestate · #5 11-28-2009, 09:33 AM

The GP check was... All of them have power, and I ohmed them all, but they were all connected, and maybe I missed a bad one, last time I disconnected the plug at the GP controller and ohmed from there.

How can I tell if 2-3 are firing? and just not making the engine run? It smokes so I have fuel. And it tries a couple of times to fire, then it just spins. I also know nothing about the fuel that is in the car. Maybe I should fill the filter with known good fuel, and draw from a can. But with the smoke, would that indicate that the fuel is trying to burn and is ok?

The engine was moved complete, I removed the starter from the block, but never disconnected it electrically. Everything else was left on the engine, except the fan. So I figured it was not a timing issue, but could I have moved the pump by hitting something? I figured they were hard to move, I have never adjusted one.

kerry · #6 11-28-2009, 09:45 AM

If you confirm functioning glow plugs by putting 12 volts to each one, I'm guessing that this case could be similar to quite a number on here where a long sitting engine has refused to start. Typically, they have been started by pull starting. Once pull started, the engine returned to normal. I'd give that a try.

Brian Carlton · #7 11-28-2009, 10:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blackestate

The GP check was... All of them have power, and I ohmed them all, but they were all connected, and maybe I missed a bad one, last time I disconnected the plug at the GP controller and ohmed from there.

If there is 12V at each glow plug, the relay is good.

This still gives no confirmation that the glow plugs are working. You must disconnect the plug at the controller and perform a resistance check at that point on all five.

Finally, even the resistance check doesn't guarantee a hot plug. A dull red glow will provide proper resistance values but it won't start the engine at colder temperatures.

Try to glow it for 35 seconds and see if it starts. If it does, go and change the glow plugs.

blackestate · #8 11-28-2009, 05:59 PM

Thanks guys, I will try this tonight after work and see how it goes.
I have never pull started a automatic. But have read it can be done. But that is a last choice.

Ian White · #9 11-28-2009, 06:13 PM

I had the same exact problem...look through this thread; you might find something useful...
617..........WVO engine..........won't start

blackestate · #10 12-01-2009, 12:58 AM

I glowed for 35 seconds no luck, Went through the glow system again, and glowed till the relay turned off, then another 35 still o go. Just a lot of smoke.
Read the other post, so I pulled the injectors and have Marvel mystery oil in the cylinders to soak for a few days. see if that might help.
If it is low compression I should be able to get it to start after blowing the MMO out and installing the injectors? The wet should increase the compression? I have no seals to install the injectors, or do a compression test. The local dealer is out in both his stores.
So I have a few days to wait so I thought this may not hurt at least.

ARINUTS · #11 12-01-2009, 01:05 AM

what's the temperature there? Got a good block heater? Warm it up.

Brian Carlton · #12 12-01-2009, 08:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blackestate

I glowed for 35 seconds no luck, Went through the glow system again, and glowed till the relay turned off, then another 35 still o go. Just a lot of smoke.
Read the other post, so I pulled the injectors and have Marvel mystery oil in the cylinders to soak for a few days. see if that might help.
If it is low compression I should be able to get it to start after blowing the MMO out and installing the injectors? The wet should increase the compression? I have no seals to install the injectors, or do a compression test. The local dealer is out in both his stores.
So I have a few days to wait so I thought this may not hurt at least.

What's the history of this engine? When were the valves last adjusted?

It is low on compression.............the question is...........why?

kerry · #13 12-01-2009, 10:08 AM

I'll repeat my advice. There are quite a few cases on here where people were trying to start engines that sat for a while and were completely unsuccessful in getting them running via the starter. A pull start got them going. It is well worth the try.

blackestate · #14 12-01-2009, 10:11 AM

The engine was in a 85 that I owned, and it ran well. The valves were adjsted about 6-7K miles before the shop fell on the car (august of that year). This was about a year ago. It has sat in the car outside for that year, but ran and moved the car a couple of times in probably January.
My complaning last night reminded me that after that time, I had pulled the injectors to use in another car that was having injector issues. I placed the "bad" injectors in this car, and did not change the seal, because I saw no reason to at that point.
This engine ran veg oil for a while, but not in the last 6 months of it's life. and ran with about the average blow by of all the others I have had before being put out of commission. I think that is why it is so frustrating.

I have no idea how many miles are really on the engine. The car had over 250K, but the local shop who maintained the car said they had replaced the engine. And the PPI in 2005 showed the engine to be strong, from a compression point. I remember that because it was the first MB I owned, so I paid for a good PPI.

Brian Carlton · #15 12-01-2009, 10:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by blackestate

The engine was in a 85 that I owned, and it ran well. The valves were adjsted about 6-7K miles before the shop fell on the car (august of that year). This was about a year ago. It has sat in the car outside for that year, but ran and moved the car a couple of times in probably January.
My complaning last night reminded me that after that time, I had pulled the injectors to use in another car that was having injector issues. I placed the "bad" injectors in this car, and did not change the seal, because I saw no reason to at that point.
This engine ran veg oil for a while, but not in the last 6 months of it's life. and ran with about the average blow by of all the others I have had before being put out of commission. I think that is why it is so frustrating.

I have no idea how many miles are really on the engine. The car had over 250K, but the local shop who maintained the car said they had replaced the engine. And the PPI in 2005 showed the engine to be strong, from a compression point. I remember that because it was the first MB I owned, so I paid for a good PPI.

A bit too many unknowns to determine the reason for the low compression. If it doesn't start after a few days with the MM oil to loosen the rings, you might as well pull start it as Kerry mentioned. The engine will spin significantly faster and generate much more heat so it will absolutely run when you accomplish this.