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Old 12-25-2009, 05:37 AM
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Transmission woes plague my 87TD

a little while after I got this car I started having trans issues. the shift points seem off, Too Quick, too hard and when Cruising at speed my RPM's seem a little high..

When I start from a dead stop the RPM's spike to 2-2.5k/RPM then Shifts, RPM's get to about 3K Spikes to 4K as the car shifts then slams into the next. then then cruising 45-60MPh my RPM stays at Close to 2K. Lower speeds around 30 the car cruises along at about 1500RPM.

Another thing I have noticed is that there is a Distinct Rattle when the car is cooler, it's heavily pronounced on left turns or if you let the car roll in neutral. Driving and accelerating it's fine, you dont hear it. To best describe the sound it's like a plastic tube being spun over a metal Rod and it gets faster or slower depending on the speed of the car at the time. My trans Fluid is nice and clear, It dosent smell burnt, it's not a darker color that would indicate band/clutch wear. the only thing I know of on it is my Transmission line that runs under the front of the car just below the radiator is seeping trans fluid from either the fittings or the hose is just gotten so rotten that it's just not cutting it anymore. I plan on replacing the Brake Servo line to permanently Fix a source of a vac leak that has the hose going to the Transmission to see if that maybe helps some. I have checked the little button underneath the accelerator pedal and it's able to function normally but I vacuumed the whole area just to be sure there was no debris lodged in and around the pedal. Any Ideas on things I can Try? The odometer Stopped functioning on the car at 298,528 miles, I am sure it's well over 300,000 now, the question is how much is it over. but that's a subject for another thread. Thanks in advanced for your input, Have a safe and very merry Christmas!
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Old 12-25-2009, 11:22 AM
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My input has to do with such a properly titled thread!! The keepers of correct terminology are pleased.....
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Gone:
'95 E300 188K "Batmobile" Texas Unfriendly Black
'85 300TD 235K "The Wagon" Texas Friendly White
'80 240D 154K "China" Scar engine installed
'81 300TD 240K "Smash"
'80 240D 230K "The Squash"
'81 240D 293K"Scar" Rear ended harder than Elton John
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Old 12-25-2009, 11:43 AM
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You say the fluid looks good as far as color, but how's the level? I know my 300SD would shift flare a little if the fluid was low at all.
Another more common issue is the bowden cable, or possibly a vacuum problem. Your RPMs sound about right, these engines rev high.
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Old 12-25-2009, 02:23 PM
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Well, The level Fluctuates, It is a self Changing Fluid type. I try to keep it in the marks.
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Old 12-25-2009, 02:24 PM
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My input has to do with such a properly titled thread!! The keepers of correct terminology are pleased.....
I've been trying to do better. I wanted to pull a holiday theme but I couldnt think of a rhyme... After I clicked Submit I got it.. Ah well.
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Old 12-25-2009, 02:30 PM
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if that original transmission has over 300k miles on it that's pretty amazing if you ask me...must has been a somewhat well taken care of car then!

highway cruising RPM is right where it's supposed to be. close to 80mph you should be seeing around 3k or so. it does sound like the bowden cable could be sticking and not going back into position when you release the accelerator. could be a lot of things really. :\
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Old 12-25-2009, 02:36 PM
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Merry Christmas to all! Peace on earth would be rather nice also

The slamming into gear would indicate a lack of vacuum, I'd start there. I had it happen when I "touched" an ancient vacuum connection that came apart without noticing it.
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Old 12-25-2009, 02:39 PM
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if that original transmission has over 300k miles on it that's pretty amazing if you ask me...must has been a somewhat well taken care of car then!

highway cruising RPM is right where it's supposed to be. close to 80mph you should be seeing around 3k or so. it does sound like the bowden cable could be sticking and not going back into position when you release the accelerator. could be a lot of things really. :\
A lot of people have looked in this car and have said that it looks remarkably well Giving it's age, I would like to think that this car was well loved through it's life. it certainly is well loved here. I don't know if the Trans is original or not. I cant tell if it was rebuilt, I didn't get the chance to look at it properly. but I have heard about the bowden cable before reading on threads here. Where would it be on my car and can I check it without using a lift... or should I just look into getting it rebuilt?
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Old 12-25-2009, 05:25 PM
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why rebuild?

diagnose before you do anything drastic. the bowden cable comes from the passenger side of the transmission. it's smack in the middle of the transmission right above the trans oil pan. you can follow the cable up to where it connects to the accelerator linkages and see if it's binding anywhere along it's route. if it's checking out OK, check out your vacuum attachments. if it's slamming, it's most likely going to be vacuum modulator issues. over time they can crack and you'll be having all sorts of nutty little problems.

i'm sure others will chime in on this. i just know how to swap these transmissions in weird combinations. lol
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Old 12-25-2009, 05:30 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aquaticedge View Post
a little while after I got this car I started having trans issues. the shift points seem off, Too Quick, too hard and when Cruising at speed my RPM's seem a little high..

When I start from a dead stop the RPM's spike to 2-2.5k/RPM then Shifts, RPM's get to about 3K Spikes to 4K as the car shifts then slams into the next. then then cruising 45-60MPh my RPM stays at Close to 2K. Lower speeds around 30 the car cruises along at about 1500RPM.
As I originally explained to you when you joined, a thread should be properly titled and limited to the issue in the title. You've managed the former but still are climbing the learning curve with respect to the latter.

I can assist you with the issues in terms of the shifts, however you'll need a vacuum gauge. Do you own a Mityvac?

From your description, I gather that the transmission is "flaring". This phenomena is present when the transmission goes into a false neutral between shifts and the rpm's climb dramatically. The driver gets a bit surprised and lifts his left foot..............and it then goes into the higher gear.

If I am correct, please confirm. Also, please confirm if flaring is present on 1-2, 2-3, or 3-4.........or a combination of two or all three of them.
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Old 12-25-2009, 06:06 PM
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the Spike happens at a low speed generally under 40MPH. so 2-3 most likely. I can not fit under the car, so i will have to wait until I go back for ball Joints, Tie rods etc when they have it up on the lift again. it would be nice if it were that simple. At present I do not own a mighty-vac or any Vacuum Related gauges/tools. I was hoping for Christmas but that did not happen. the person I know with a vac pump informed me that it is broken and it's an unknown amount of time before it is repaired.. but I would like to know more about testing the vac issue, I know I have a Vac leak and a considerable one someplace giving the responses to my other topic about my stop lever. I assume that it's still from the brake servo line but I plan at some point to replace all the rubber vac joiners with new ones as some look rather... Aged...
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Old 12-25-2009, 06:18 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JimmyL View Post
My input has to do with such a properly titled thread!! The keepers of correct terminology are pleased.....
You've been strangely absent my arch nemesis!
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Going back to the original post: "Can you get the vac to blow instead?" No. Vacuums are low pressure so they by nature "suck" and nature abhors them.
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Old 12-25-2009, 07:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Aquaticedge View Post
the Spike happens at a low speed generally under 40MPH. so 2-3 most likely. I can not fit under the car, so i will have to wait until I go back for ball Joints, Tie rods etc when they have it up on the lift again. it would be nice if it were that simple. At present I do not own a mighty-vac or any Vacuum Related gauges/tools. I was hoping for Christmas but that did not happen. the person I know with a vac pump informed me that it is broken and it's an unknown amount of time before it is repaired.. but I would like to know more about testing the vac issue, I know I have a Vac leak and a considerable one someplace giving the responses to my other topic about my stop lever. I assume that it's still from the brake servo line but I plan at some point to replace all the rubber vac joiners with new ones as some look rather... Aged...
Without a vacuum gauge, you're really taking shots in the dark.

However, if you must persist, take a look at the vacuum lines that come directly out of the vacuum pump. From the pump, the small line goes into a five way connector. Two of those lines go to the right side of the engine and two go to the left side. Disconnect the two right side lines............and add a short piece of vacuum hose to the five way connector at each of the open ports. Then, plug both of the short hoses.

Drive the vehicle and report any change in symptoms.

p.s.: Right and left always refer to the position as sitting in the driver's seat.
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Old 12-26-2009, 12:09 AM
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I will Try when I have the time in the next few days.
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Old 12-26-2009, 12:17 AM
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Originally Posted by okyoureabeast View Post
You've been strangely absent my arch nemesis!
I never think of you with "nemesis" status. You seem ok to me although you are rogue T misguided.

To Aquaticedge, listen, Mityvac's can usually be had for between $25 and $35 bucks, so there is really no good excuse for not getting one. You simply WILL need one from time to time.
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Jimmy L.
'05 Acura TL 6MT
2001 ML430 My Spare

Gone:
'95 E300 188K "Batmobile" Texas Unfriendly Black
'85 300TD 235K "The Wagon" Texas Friendly White
'80 240D 154K "China" Scar engine installed
'81 300TD 240K "Smash"
'80 240D 230K "The Squash"
'81 240D 293K"Scar" Rear ended harder than Elton John
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