Repacking front wheel bearings/adjustment - Page 4 - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

warmblood58 · #46 03-24-2010, 11:36 PM

Great, if my parts come tomorrow, I will start. Ran around today sourcing hardware for the dial indicator so I could (rather than use magnet setup) bolt to hub for greater stability -works great! I hope take a few pics and share with the forum

warmblood58 · #47 04-01-2010, 05:43 PM

So I took my hubs (install new races) to my Indy (factory trained) Mercedes mechanic and told him about my last post regarding wheel bearing packing readjustment and the volume of replies, many which stressed using a dial indicator. He looked and just laughed and mentioned how some people just love to overly complicate a simple procedure. He explained his procedure and has never cooked bearings etc. Basically, after packing inner bearing refitting new grease seal and filling inner hub with grease, you slide new, ready for this "un greased" outer bearing on spindle, tighten spindle nut and grease within hub is forced out through outer bearing while you screw down spindle nut until full contact is made (no travel left) and back off spindle nut 1/8 turn in increments until movement/noise is detected. He likes to bolt wheel on rotor and grasp wheel at 6 and 9 and rock for noise/feel of play. If noise/movement felt, turn spindle nut to tighten in short 1/8 increments until no play/noise is felt and spin wheel and thats it! He volunteered to pay a house call and double check my work. I am going to double check my work with a metric dial indicator to see what kind of readings I get and share with Forum> This will no doubt generate much heated debate. I find him to be highly competent and meticulous and he is a certified Mercedes Tech who is semi retired. He said that his method was the way he was taught in school many years ago . . .

NoSparkNeeded · #48 04-01-2010, 06:28 PM

I have to admit, that this is the way I've always done it, although I hand pack both, not relying on "squish", but do all the same steps. Did my wife's SD about 5 years ago, and it's still going. That said, now that I have a really nice dial indicator setup I got at a garage sale for 20 bucks, I'll be using that to check my own car when I need to do it. It boils down to "feel". Some have it, some don't. Even those that "have it", can have an off day. Using a dial indicator simply assures the same results EVERY time. A professional cannot take a chance with a customer's car on a daily basis. I've never blown a wheel bearing doing it "my way" with "feel"; but I if I did it for a living daily, I'd use a way to do it PERFECT every time.

pawoSD · #49 04-01-2010, 08:06 PM

I hand pack the bearings, put some inside the hub, and then mount, putting some in the grease cap as well. I tighten the spindle nut until it is difficult to turn the hub, then back it off maybe 1/4 to 1/3 of a turn, then lock it. Have done it that way on 4 MB's so far with 0 issues. (1x W123, 3x W126, 1x W124). I have repacked them twice on my '82....and have driven 92,000 miles with no problem.

tangofox007 · #50 04-01-2010, 09:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by warmblood58

He looked and just laughed and mentioned how some people just love to overly complicate a simple procedure.

Following the laughter, your mechanic proceeded to describe a rather complicated and subjective process. One which is arguably more complicated than using a dial indicator and much less reliable in terms of providing consistent results.

Quote:

Originally Posted by warmblood58

He volunteered to pay a house call and double check my work.

Why not put him to the test? Let him show you how his method is more accurate than yours. My money says you will have the last laugh.

leathermang · #51 04-01-2010, 09:48 PM

I am always surprised at people willing to say how they do not follow the simple and straightforward instructions provided by the PEOPLE WHO MADE THE AUTOMOBILE THEY OWN... How hard is it to set the specs BY THE BOOK ?
How much peace of mind does this give a person ? A LOT.

bmwpowere36m3 · #52 04-01-2010, 09:59 PM

With experience and technique, the wheel bearings can easily be adjusted by hand. My father (MB mechanic for ~30 yrs) never uses a dial indicator, when asked about it he said, "That's the crap you read about on the internet, you're going to listen to your internet buddies..."

Kidding aside, he said when he first started out he was using the dial indicator and over time developed a feel for it. When Mercedes writes a technical manual it can't say, "well it should feel like this and that." It needs to provide objective techniques, that anyone can duplicate.

leathermang · #53 04-02-2010, 01:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bmwpowere36m3

It needs to provide objective techniques, that anyone can duplicate.

And the problem with that is........ ?

Or the reason to promote "' I can feel it ' so I don't follow the instructions which provide objective results that anyone can duplicate correctly using the prescribed tools ?"

I promise you guys that there is some measure of self delusion going on... or just plain lazyness...
There just is no reason to not use the dial indicator ...or feeler gauges ... to get it ' objectively correct'... if you have to set it in an emergency great... then when you get back to the shop you pull it and set it correctly.

warmblood58 · #54 04-02-2010, 01:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by tangofox007

Following the laughter, your mechanic proceeded to describe a rather complicated and subjective process. One which is arguably more complicated than using a dial indicator and much less reliable in terms of providing consistent results.

Why not put him to the test? Let him show you how his method is more accurate than yours. My money says you will have the last laugh.

My laughter . . . he is factory trained and very good as I have had many interactions with his expertise -and your real world experience? I think I will leave the forum so the peanut gallery can battle this one out. As I mentioned, I will double check my results with a dial indicator

Diesel911 · #55 04-02-2010, 01:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bmwpowere36m3

With experience and technique, the wheel bearings can easily be adjusted by hand. My father (MB mechanic for ~30 yrs) never uses a dial indicator, when asked about it he said, "That's the crap you read about on the internet, you're going to listen to your internet buddies..."

Kidding aside, he said when he first started out he was using the dial indicator and over time developed a feel for it. When Mercedes writes a technical manual it can't say, "well it should feel like this and that." It needs to provide objective techniques, that anyone can duplicate.

And, "that anyone can duplicate" is important on this Forum where people have different skill levels.

In reading the first post he Mechanic sounds like he is adjusting them too loose. This is why he has never roasted a Wheel Bearing.

I was a Diesel Mechanic for 18 years yet without the Dial Indicator I managed to get my Wheel Bearings too tight and I overheated the Grease (the Bearings Were OK). This had never happend to me on any of the previous Vehicles I had worked on sice around 1968 (Until the Mercedes) adjusting the Wheel bearings by the Feel Method.
And, I was franky shocked that it happend.

This resulted in me doing the job 2 times instead of one time; the last time with a Dial Indicator. The result was no problems for the past 2 years.

And, this is not actually an argument it is just what happend to me.

bmwpowere36m3 · #56 04-02-2010, 09:40 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by leathermang

And the problem with that is........ ?
....

Quote:

Originally Posted by Diesel911

And, "that anyone can duplicate" is important on this Forum where people have different skill levels.

....

Yes, I totally agree with you guys. My philosophy is if you have to ask, then you don't really know and thus need concrete and objective answers. However at times I read some techniques and procedures and it turns a relatively simple job into something more complicated than it is. Then again, it all boils down to experience levels.

leathermang · #57 04-02-2010, 12:11 PM

In case you have not noticed.... the Germans do tend to be very specific when it comes to machines and metals.... which may also play a part in why we are able to keep these old machines going nicely so often and looking good at the same time ....

leathermang · #58 04-02-2010, 01:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by warmblood58

My laughter . . . he is factory trained and very good as I have had many interactions with his expertise -and your real world experience? I think I will leave the forum so the peanut gallery can battle this one out. As I mentioned, I will double check my results with a dial indicator

There seems to be a disconnect here in terms of attributing the source of information and thus its value with no basis for the division.

He is FACTORY TRAINED ?

But does not believe in the Printed material provided by the FACTORY.... ?

Some feeling that the people in charge of the Factory Service Manual are a subversive group within Mercedes Benz whose main goal is not to provide the proper procedure....but to unnecessarily complicate forum members lives ?

This forum has one of the strongest " peanut galleries " of any forum I have ever seen on the web... sometimes a wild hare/hair pops up.. but our pool of actual chemists, engineers and mechanics usually get to the crux of the truth in short order.... even though as with any forum some chaff might need to be weeded through once in a while.

Your choice to check your results by measurement is prudent.

warmblood58 · #59 04-02-2010, 04:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by leathermang

There seems to be a disconnect here in terms of attributing the source of information and thus its value with no basis for the division.

He is FACTORY TRAINED ?

But does not believe in the Printed material provided by the FACTORY.... ?

Some feeling that the people in charge of the Factory Service Manual are a subversive group within Mercedes Benz whose main goal is not to provide the proper procedure....but to unnecessarily complicate forum members lives ?

This forum has one of the strongest " peanut galleries " of any forum I have ever seen on the web... sometimes a wild hare/hair pops up.. but our pool of actual chemists, engineers and mechanics usually get to the crux of the truth in short order.... even though as with any forum some chaff might need to be weeded through once in a while.

Your choice to check your results by measurement is prudent.

As mentioned I will double check with a dial indicator. From a common sense standpoint, I refuse to believe that such a simple procedure needs to be this complicated and I trust my indy because he is trained versus those with opinions - should be interesting!

leathermang · #60 04-02-2010, 04:30 PM

Here is the deal... someone else described it lately...perhaps in this thread number one or something...
This nut can be set anywhere due to its design... the old American style can only be set and locked at certain places determined by the number of castles on the nut and the hole in the spindle.
Many people have posted saying " I have done this for so long, etc. and no bad effects have happened' ... but to me the interesting thing is that they assume a certain bad effect, define it very narrowly , and give their ' all is ok ' report..
Here is another possibility... that in this case... setting the wheel too loose may take 10,000 miles off the life of the front tires... this is not something a normal person would notice or attribute to this setting.... especially since the wear pattern of our MB's is not exactly like what we expect from an unequal length A arm suspension like many older cars..
Anyway, I think it is nice they used part of their multimillion dollar R and D budget over the years to figure out a good system and then print the instructions so we have a chance of getting it right out in our driveway if necessary...