The photo below is from a 77 240d. Could someone with more experience than me help decipher how many degrees I am seeing there? thanks.

Looks to be about 5 degrees. Thats not to bad. You could install a key to almost correct the timing.

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1985 300TD Turbo Euro-wagon
1979 280CE 225,200 miles
1985 300D Turbo 264,000 miles
1976 240D 190,000 miles
1979 300TD 220,000

GONE but not forgotten
1976 300D 195,300 miles
1983 300D Turbo 175,000 miles

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e3...e485-1-2-1.jpg

Thanks for the feedback.

I've looked through the site but have not found great instructions on how to change the woodruff key. There is a short tutorial on the wiki but I am having trouble deciphering anything from the pictures.

Any chance someone knows of a good tutorial on how to change out the key?

be mindful that it may already have the key change!! If it has then you need to just accept it and in years to come you may need a new chain & standard key.

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Grumpy Old Diesel Owners Club group

I no longer question authority, I annoy authority. More effect, less effort....

1967 230-6 auto parts car. rust bucket.
1980 300D now parts car 800k miles
1984 300D 500k miles
1987 250td 160k miles English import
2001 jeep turbo diesel 130k miles
1998 jeep tdi ~ followed me home. Needs a turbo.
1968 Ford F750 truck. 6-354 diesel conversion.
Other toys ~J.D.,Cat & GM ~ mainly earth moving

What is more important is we need to see a picture of how well the Camshaft Marks are lined up; if that is the method you used.

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84 300D, 82 Volvo 244Gl Diesel

I agree with all the above posts.

Keep in mind that this method is only a ballpark figure and that you should try it a few times to get a better sense of the measurement.

Pay attention to what diesel911 already said.

Or use the 2mm valve lift method (assuming from your previous posts, this is not something you will be interested in)

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I aligned the camshaft timing marks very well I think. I rotated it 5 times and measured 5 times and it was near the 5deg mark each time.

I'll have to get a dial indicator and try the other method.

what you did is 'close enough' to determine if you need a new chain.

keeping in mind the offset key theory.

maybe if you ever time the injection pump... bump it a few degrees early. Not a requirement though.

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So I'm pretty sure that a new chain is the best answer, however I do not have the money for this at the moment (I'm currently working on the front suspension, ball joints etc...).

As a temporary fix/improvement I would like to install a woodruff key to bring the timing closer to spec.

Assuming a woodruff key has never been previously installed (I know the PO and i'm 99% it hasn't), are the woodruff keys sold here at peachparts a 1:1 match for the reading I have taken early in this thread?

i.e. if I am showing 5 degrees off is the correct key the 5 degree woodruff key?

IIRC the key was for only 4 degree

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85 300CD Gramps 390K
89 190D Baby 322K
93 300D Grumpy 176K
99 SLK230

I think the top item for sale here is a 5 degree woodruff key: part # W0133-1633924

The pointer is pointing to the letters "PMS". That be German for Top dead center?

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85 300D turbo pristine w 157k when purchased 161K now
83 300 D turbo 297K runs great. SOLD!
83 240D 4 spd manual- parted out then junked

I know the OP is not listening....

but just for the record..... for others in the future thinking of using this thread as a guide...

The MB FSM specifically rejects the use of the cam towers for measurements..
only the 2mm movement of the number one intake valve is given for this measuring process. And there is a number of degrees which must be factored in also.. it is not a ' read direct from the pulley ' correlation to the number of degrees it is off.....

There are threads in the archives which tell how to do this properly.

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1980 240d ,

chain elongation, cam marks reference:
http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/diesel-discussion/10414-help-i-need-check-stretch.html

http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/diesel-discussion/305365-9-degrees-chain-stretch.html

evap fin cleaning:

http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/diesel-discussion/156207-photo-step-step-post-showing-w123-evaporator-removal-1983-240d-1982-300td.html?highlight=evaporator

A/C thread

http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/diesel-discussion/297462-c-recommendations-mb-vehicles.html

Greg, you really have to start telling the "why" part of the story instead of just quoting the manual.

The mark at the cam is not a "precision" mark. It was only intended for assembly so one doesn't get the chain off by a tooth. It is not any more accurate than that, so you can't count on it for measuring chain elongation.

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Rick Miley
2014 Tesla Model S
2018 Tesla Model 3
2017 Nissan LEAF
Former MB: 99 E300, 86 190E 2.3, 87 300E, 80 240D, 82 204D Euro
Chain Elongation References

Rick, you will find me saying that on other current threads.... I am just getting lazy I guess..

Under the ' why did you not complete the thought ' ... why did you not add the link to that thread I always have to email you to ask for... which has that ' add or subtract X degrees factor' in this procedure ?

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1980 240d ,

chain elongation, cam marks reference:
http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/showthread.php?threadid=10414

http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/diesel-discussion/305365-9-degrees-chain-stretch.html

evap fin cleaning:

http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/diesel-discussion/156207-photo-step-step-post-showing-w123-evaporator-removal-1983-240d-1982-300td.html?highlight=evaporator

A/C thread

http://www.peachparts.com/shopforum/diesel-discussion/297462-c-recommendations-mb-vehicles.html