Update on my 1985 300SD Hyubrid - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

koya1893 · #1 07-11-2010, 08:13 PM

This is a 1985 300SD I've not done much to the engine besides getting to know it due the fact I am new to the diesel powered car and MB's. The following items I replaced on the car:

The fuel line that runs between injectors (they were leaking)
Re-built the Alt to ensure it is putting out the amps for the Hydrogen system.
replaced power steering filter.
drained and replace trans filter
oil change
adjusted the steering play
drained and flush power steering fluid
replace the three rubber mounts (with Harley oil tank mounts) for the air cleaner.
replace all tubes from the valve cover to air cleaner.
replaced all the belts and fabricated an Alt adjustment bolt.
Cleaned the "banjo bolt".

As you can see I've done nothing but the upkeeps and to ensure this egnine is running well before I induced hydrogen. Added "SeaFoam" to the fuel.

Additionally with everyone's help I identified the vacuum valve where the line coming from the intake manifold is supposed to be attached to, the valve bypassed. The line went straight into the ALDA.

Doing a lot of reading and taking in everyone's input on ALDA adjustment to limit fuel delivery, I turned the adjustment screw 1/2 CW.

The Odometer in the cluster is not working so I used a GPS to track all the mileages on the car for my test,

Hydrogen:

I am inducing 1.5 lpm on the car at 17 amps. With the ALDA adjustment screw adjusted 1/2 turn CW and the hydrogen being induced my first official run the car yield 44.4mpg. I am not fully aware what these cars were rated for mpg when new. All the driving condition were what I would rate as mixed driving.

On my next run I reconfigured the ALDA by routing the line from the intake manifold to the vacuum valve and then to the ALDA. I guess you can say I re-configured it back to the factory setting. This time I am going to drive it further on the same mixed driving condition since that's what I drive most of the time. Then I will do an actual highway run 65-75 mph driving.

Aquaticedge · #2 07-11-2010, 08:18 PM

very interesting, I was not aware hydrogen could be fitted to A Diesel engine, I will be watching this one.

moon161 · #3 07-11-2010, 08:27 PM

A set of blind trials will tell if the H's actually do anything for you. Configure it such that someone other than yourself can turn the H's on or off and record the setting for say a week of commuting to work. Mr./Mrs H will also maintain the H system (top off water, whatever, so the system operates properly), again not letting driver know if H's are in use or not. Fill the car with the same pump at the end of each week, record mileage and fuel use (volume), fuel temperature (extra credit). Extra credit-Correct fuel volume to fuel mass based on temperature and specific gravity of diesel at given temperature.

Do at least a month, 2 weeks on H, 2 weeks off, with the driver being unaware of whether they are driving with H's or not.

At the end of the month, Mr/Mrs. will let you know which weeks were on H, and which were off.

Calculate and report MPG and other observations for operation with/without H's. If temperature compensating, correct to miles per gallon of room temperature diesel.

kerry · #4 07-11-2010, 08:36 PM

How was that 44.4mpg measured and how is the hydrogen being introduced to the engine?

vstech · #5 07-11-2010, 10:18 PM

gps is not the best way to verify mpg's on a vehicle!
clouds, buildings etc, all conspire against you for mpg figures.
best bet is to contact odometergears.com and get yourself a working odometer, then verify your tires are correct size and give it another try with MPG logging.
it'll take several months of driving to get an accurate feel for MPG changes.

koya1893 · #6 07-11-2010, 10:23 PM

The mileage was calculated as follows:

fill the tank until I see the fuel on the tank filler pipe. Drove the car on my daily route and to and from the store, typical run to Wal Mart and to the gym. Filled the tank the same manner. Miles driven 57.8 miles fuel used 1.3 gl.

The hydrogen is being induced 3-4 inches pre turbo on the "U" shape intake tube. I'll take a photo of the fitting tomorrow and post. I have a week before taking a trip to TN I will be doing plenty of testing, the same manner I've done with ICE gasoline I've done install on. At times the mpg the clients gets is even better, I drive on the agressive side.

okyoureabeast · #7 07-11-2010, 10:30 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vstech

gps is not the best way to verify mpg's on a vehicle!
clouds, buildings etc, all conspire against you for mpg figures.
best bet is to contact odometergears.com and get yourself a working odometer, then verify your tires are correct size and give it another try with MPG logging.
it'll take several months of driving to get an accurate feel for MPG changes.

x2. I have a GPS app on my blackberry that gives me the deviation of the coordinates.

It normally goes between +/- 700-800 ft

Instead of miles per gallon. Do a gallon per mile comparison like one gallon for 100 miles driven. That should give you a better idea of how much fuel is being saved.

vstech · #8 07-11-2010, 10:34 PM

ahh.
not a valid test at all.
waaaay too many variables for this test to be any good. you will need to pick a fuel station that you will return to exclusively for this test. you will need to park in the same spot and in the same direction for fueling. you should even return at the same time of day to get the fuel. preferably early a/m. you will need to drive with a working odometer, and drive until the tank is very low, then return to the same station and refill and log indicated miles, and total fuel needed to return the tank to the same fill point. repeat the test for 3 consecutive tanks of fuel.
at 44+ mpg, you should get 740+ miles on the tank... best I've gotten is around 400... so don't expect miracles. love to be proven wrong though.
seriously though, get a set of replacement gears from odometergears.com and fix your odo before you attempt to prove anything.

whunter · #9 07-11-2010, 11:02 PM

Hydrogen boost fuel system
Hydrogen boost fuel system

turbobenz · #10 07-12-2010, 03:39 AM

What a joke. Its hard to believe that someone smart enough to install this in their car will actually believe that it works. have fun killing your alternator every 6 months

koya1893 · #11 07-12-2010, 08:12 AM

If anyone failed to recognized. I'll clarify it, I am new to this forum and to diesel powered cars (I said cars) but not to diesel powered trucks. I found this forum via a recommendation by a diesel engine expert via Hagerstown MD where a reputable organiztion have a plant there that builds diesel powered trucks and among other things. I also read the thread on link Mr. Whunter provided.

I can honestly say that there are plenty of closed minded smart people out there and very uneducated highly educated people also. What lead me to focus on finding a MB diesel car is, I've had great success on installing the system I've designed from my 5 years of reasearch on Hydrogen On Demand (HOD). Majority of them are on Ford truck ranging from the old IDI 7.3 to the turbo version and now the latest is the 6.0 turbo and several Chevy diesel. Oh yes, you might want to seat down for this one. My two Harley Davidson's are what I considered Hybrid. Yes they are running on hydrogen, and six others in the area.

Yes this technology has been labeled a scam and there are people out there who focus on those that will believed their pitch and brign down people like myself with success on the process.

I can see everyone not believing this and SCAM word comes to mind. After all why not, if someone tells you that you can install a HOD system on you car, truck, RV, and Motorcycle gas or diesl:

Increase gas mileage (My Town Car increased 48.8%)
get better performance (faster throttle response V-Twin loves hydrogen)
cut down on the poputant you are inducing to the air (have SMOG test from 5 states, including CA)
clean all the carbon build up in the combustion chamber (took a old 350 from junkyard and installed it on my 1972 boat)
Do all this with WATER and some form of electrolite (KOH or NaOH).

I would feel the same, until my "tinkering mind" got the best of me. Hence years several back (it's about when that thread I read was started) I started to read up on the subject and started experimenting. The system I am currently using on this 300SD is my "Flagship Model" I use. I was curious what it will do to a diesel powered car and I am fully aware that MB engines are the best out there (as far as my knowledge of ICE) and I knew it would be the best subject to test my system.

I am visiting the plant in Hagerstown today, it is 150 miles one way from me. As mentioned if this car really gets 44.5 mpg I should be able to there and back in 1/2 tank of gas. It's the new age open up to something new. How many of your ever thought you will be carrying your phone or your computer in your pocket. Unheard of years ago, now it's a daily reminder fast technology moves.

vstech · #12 07-12-2010, 09:02 AM

like I said in the other thread, and this one. I would love to see it proven. I'd like the MPG improvement. get good documentation, and make solid records. OTR trucks have this setup on them from what i've read, and it can be made to provide improvement, but keep this in mind. the stock alternator on the 85 300SD is only 65A, so you might wanna beef that up if you are using an electrical load in the car continuously.
don't just go by the fuel gauge, and a GPS get your odometer repaired. ten minutes with a screwdriver and 70.00 or so for the gears, and you will have a smooth odo!
what country are you from? I notice your grammar is a tad off.

moon161 · #13 07-12-2010, 04:45 PM

While errors can be introduced many ways, multiple data from multiple blind trials should still detect a difference in average mileages. Even if the measurement precision is low (high std. deviation of mileage calc), student's T test should tell if the H on and H off data are from significantly different populations (does it make a difference or not). The number and precision of data will improve the quality of the study, the blind trials will eliminate any subconsious lead foot/soft foot biasing.

4x4_Welder · #14 07-12-2010, 07:41 PM

I dunno, I have seen this fail quite spectacularly on a class 8 truck- 110,000lbs registered GVW, averaged mileage over a year without the generator was 4.3mpg, over a year with the generator was............. 4.3. No change.
Hydrogen generation is a net loss process, you use more energy to extract hydrogen from water than you can get back. It's been proven for decades, and frankly if it was a viable tech then automakers would add it onto cars to reach CAFE standards without having to take the measures they do now.

koya1893 · #15 07-15-2010, 09:28 AM

My apologies for my improper grammar, English is my second language I am from the Philippines.

Okay I drove the 350 mile trip I will not post the result it will only have you guys question the benefits of HHO because the mileage gain was even better. After my trip from TN I will order the gears for the Odometer and then test it again. By the way with the car configured stock (as far as the ALDA hooked up to the vacuum valve) the car did pair. But with the vacuum line coming from the intake manifold hooked up directly to the ALDA and turned 1/2 CW, this is when the car gets it's insane gain for mpg.

As I mentioned I will get the gears to fix the odometer and re-test.