Insanity is catching... should I sell the '96 E300D? - PeachParts Mercedes-Benz Forum

landev · #1 09-28-2010, 10:58 AM

Well, like clockwork my wife is getting the itch for a new car. She seems to want a new car about every 3 years and her Mini Cooper was our most recent purchase about 3 years ago. She doens't even know what kind of car she wants... just that she wants something new. I stupidly chimed in "I know what I'd like... a newer Merc diesel!" I then added that we couldn't afford one.

Well, she jumped on it and said that if we sold our Cooper and '96 E300D, then we wouldn't be far off from a later model Bluetec. Yeesh!

So, I pose this question for anyone who wants to take a few pot shots at it... is it worth the hassel of getting rid of the two cars in favor of a Bluetec? I've not really heard much about buyer satisfaction with the newer diesels... are they built as well as the '96? Also, I have no idea what my '96 is worth... just that I've done quite a bit of work on it to get it where it is now... a reliable daily driver.

Personally, I'd be happy just keeping the '96... it's in good shape and I've crawled into many of its nooks and crannies in keeping it up to snuff. The prospect of a newer diesel would be attractive IF I could justify (in my lil' noggin) a reason for upgrading.

Any input would be appreciated!

Thanks in advance!

-l-

Skid Row Joe · #2 09-28-2010, 01:18 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by landev

Well, like clockwork my wife is getting the itch for a new car. She seems to want a new car about every 3 years and her Mini Cooper was our most recent purchase about 3 years ago. She doens't even know what kind of car she wants... just that she wants something new. I stupidly chimed in "I know what I'd like... a newer Merc diesel!" I then added that we couldn't afford one.

Well, she jumped on it and said that if we sold our Cooper and '96 E300D, then we wouldn't be far off from a later model Bluetec. Yeesh!

So, I pose this question for anyone who wants to take a few pot shots at it... is it worth the hassel of getting rid of the two cars in favor of a Bluetec? I've not really heard much about buyer satisfaction with the newer diesels... are they built as well as the '96? Also, I have no idea what my '96 is worth... just that I've done quite a bit of work on it to get it where it is now... a reliable daily driver.

Personally, I'd be happy just keeping the '96... it's in good shape and I've crawled into many of its nooks and crannies in keeping it up to snuff. The prospect of a newer diesel would be attractive IF I could justify (in my lil' noggin) a reason for upgrading.

Any input would be appreciated!

Thanks in advance!

In a word, yes! If you can afford it - do it, is my advice. A newish upgrade in MB diesel cars is fully justified in my mind every 15 or so years.

The E320 Bluetecs are masterfully crafted machines, and '07s and now '08s can be had in the low $30K range, with low miles. That's value to me.

The reason my sig. car is for sale, is because I am shopping for the kind of E320 Bluetec I just described above.

Good shopping!

C Sean Watts · #3 09-28-2010, 05:56 PM

IF you have much of a highway commute you can justify it with improved fuel mileage.

MTUpower · #4 09-28-2010, 06:09 PM

Household income in the USA was flat this year and consumer confidence it very low. No one is buying stuff- which depresses prices on used goods. Your two used cars are gonna sell for cheap. I've seen multiple '96-'97 e300's sell for under $5K here in the NY area. CL is full of MB diesel super deals all over. Your car is known, it works you like it AND it's a MB diesel. Leave it alone already.

sixto · #5 09-28-2010, 06:36 PM

A friend of mine just got an 08 CDI Bluetec but without urea injection. 25K on the clock and whatever they call Starmark these days for ~$26K. Darn thing needed a $1200 module within his first month. I love the car but I'd get an extended warranty.

Sixto
87 300D

Oldwolf · #6 09-28-2010, 07:34 PM

It's hard to financially justify a newer car when your old ones still work OK. (imo)

cirrusman · #7 09-28-2010, 09:17 PM

Don't even dream of fixing it yourself if it breaks...

landev · #8 09-29-2010, 12:40 PM

All,

Thanks for your replys.

Well, the consensus seems to be not to go the new(er) vehicle route. From what I've read (review-wise) on the Bluetecs, they are awsome cars, but Cirrusman brings up a issue that would need to be addressed before I went that route.

As I am a state worker in Idaho, I don't earn enough to be able to afford trips to the dealership. I've worked on all my own cars (cookbook mechanic) since day one and they only get a fondling by professionals when there is a need for an expensive tool that I don't have.

Both of the two trips I've made to Mercedes dealerships were unpleasant. Both trips were for parts, and both times I was treated pretty poorly for having the audacity to not throw money at their service departments. In short, I don't really care to visit a dealership again in this lifetime, so a vehicle tightly tied to the dealerships' repair shop doesn't interest me. More feedback on the "fixable" aspect of these cars by shadetree machanics would be appreciated.

Currently, I get anywhere from 34 to 38 mpg in my '96 (depending on the length of the trip), so the increase in mileage (if ratings are true for the newer vehicles) would be negligable... 'takes that out of the equation.

I did look at resale value on my '96 and that was disappointing, though not totally unexpected. I imagine this is why I no longer buy new cars. This makes the later cars a bit more pricey to get in to and makes me wonder if I should be looking at a broader range of years.

SRJ, drop me a line with some particulars about your '99... I don't know if something like that would appease my "better half", but at this point I'm open to all options. I am the 4th owner of our '96 and, as I spend more time working on it, I feel that most of the problems we've experienced were due to lack of maintenance by previous owners. Perhaps the wife would could be lured by the same car in better shape, I don't know.

Again, thanks for the replies!

-l-

Skid Row Joe · #9 09-29-2010, 01:10 PM

An 08 CDI Bluetec? They dropped the CDI name starting in 07.

If he paid $26K for an E320 Bluetec with 25K miles on the clock - he got an outstanding deal. Did he happen to have a trade-in? $26K seems low for an 08.

Dealers "move numbers around" when charging for cars on trade-in.

For example: I traded a 74 Cadillac Sedan DeVille in on a new 77 Chevrolet Corvette in 76. The dealer (owner of a small town Chevy dealer) gave me 'retail' for my Cadillac, and charged me the wholesale difference in dollars, for the new Corvette. When he saw the reaction on my face of the bona fide low ball difference number he was offering me, he instantly stated; "I'm not discounting the list price of the Corvette to you." Well, he sure was! He just didn't want word to get around that he was selling Corvettes at wholesale! I realized he was giving me an outstanding deal, because every other Chevy dealer wanted $2K+ MORE difference in dollars from me! He had bought (15) new Corvettes, all the same color, and all loaded-up with a grand or so of goodies more than the run-of-the-mill new Corvettes I'd seen the month I'd been shopping new ones. He had (9) new ones left when I happened upon his Chevy store to make a deal with cash in my pocket, and the title to my Cadillac on me.

I wouldn't be afraid of a newish Bluetec, since friends of mine bought the same exact car that I did (99 E300TD) new when I did, and their computer module went out at a warranty covered cost of over $2K. So, this is something that can and will happen to the old ones too.

Quote:

Originally Posted by sixto

A friend of mine just got an 08 CDI Bluetec but without urea injection. 25K on the clock and whatever they call Starmark these days for ~$26K. Darn thing needed a $1200 module within his first month. I love the car but I'd get an extended warranty.

Sixto
87 300D

Jeremy5848 · #10 09-29-2010, 01:21 PM

Sounds like you are like me -- you can afford a Mercedes only because you can do most of your own work. I am fortunate in having a good local mechanic as well as a dealer who treats me like a human being. They take care of the things I can't do myself.

Although the later cars tend to need less maintenance (an industry-wide trend going back many years), when they do need work, you're unlikely to be able to do it yourself. The '96 is itself on the cusp of being unfixable but there's still a lot you can do at home. An '06 - '08 CDI or Bluetec would definitely be over the edge. My '96 has over 272,000 miles and is still in excellent condition. I vote that you keep it and let your wife buy the ricemobile of her choice.

An alternative would be to trade in the wife for one that likes older cars.

Jeremy

cirrusman · #11 09-29-2010, 01:36 PM

If you can afford it, get a 2010 - 2011 model with a warranty and get rid of it when the warranty expires... IF you can afford it (Insurance, payments, non warranty covered parts, etc).

sixto · #12 09-29-2010, 01:53 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Skid Row Joe

An 08 CDI Bluetec? They dropped the CDI name starting in 07.

Thank you, JimmyL, Jr.

This guy can sell ski parkas in Cuba. He gets nasty responses to lowball offers but sometimes he gets the deal. $26K doesn't include tax and license, shipping across the country or the MB extended warranty, but it is CPO. Same car would be $32K here. No trade.

Sixto
87 300D

Skid Row Joe · #13 09-29-2010, 01:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by landev

All,

Thanks for your replys.

Well, the consensus seems to be not to go the new(er) vehicle route. From what I've read (review-wise) on the Bluetecs, they are awsome cars, but Cirrusman brings up a issue that would need to be addressed before I went that route.

As I am a state worker in Idaho, I don't earn enough to be able to afford trips to the dealership. I've worked on all my own cars (cookbook mechanic) since day one and they only get a fondling by professionals when there is a need for an expensive tool that I don't have.

Both of the two trips I've made to Mercedes dealerships were unpleasant. Both trips were for parts, and both times I was treated pretty poorly for having the audacity to not throw money at their service departments. In short, I don't really care to visit a dealership again in this lifetime, so a vehicle tightly tied to the dealerships' repair shop doesn't interest me. More feedback on the "fixable" aspect of these cars by shadetree machanics would be appreciated.

Currently, I get anywhere from 34 to 38 mpg in my '96 (depending on the length of the trip), so the increase in mileage (if ratings are true for the newer vehicles) would be negligable... 'takes that out of the equation.

I did look at resale value on my '96 and that was disappointing, though not totally unexpected. I imagine this is why I no longer buy new cars. This makes the later cars a bit more pricey to get in to and makes me wonder if I should be looking at a broader range of years.

SRJ, drop me a line with some particulars about your '99... I don't know if something like that would appease my "better half", but at this point I'm open to all options. I am the 4th owner of our '96 and, as I spend more time working on it, I feel that most of the problems we've experienced were due to lack of maintenance by previous owners. Perhaps the wife would could be lured by the same car in better shape, I don't know.

Again, thanks for the replies!

-l-

Many of my sentiments mirror your's.

Many Mercedes-Benz dealer employees have an attitude that they are better than you, since they are affiliated with such an outstanding product, that you should lie down and open your wallet to them. Even though they are the ones waiting on you. Go figure...

I became a Mercedes-Benz diesel owner because of their economy and durability. Period. The other stuff that comes along with the ownership of a Mercedes-Benz is just icing on-the-cake. A LOT of icing in the case of the prestige factor that owning a Mercedes-Benz provides.

However, the root cause of me being a Mercedes-Benz diesel passenger car owner is because of the fact that my Mom and Dad started driving new diesel Mercedes-Benz' starting in 1969. They went on to purchase new ones in 1974 and 1977 as well. The seed was planted in the economy aspect that the Mercedes-Benz diesels deliver. I guess I'm a victim of having wise parents. That said, I made the mistake of buying a new Mercedes-Benz (my sig. car) the last time I bought one. Even though I can afford new, I won't make the mistake of throwing tens of thousands of dollars away needlessly, when a pre-owned 3 year old in-factory-warranty MB diesel with low miles can be had for 50% or less of what the car listed for.

If I were you, landev, since it sounds to me like you are on a budget, I would buy an 05 or 06 E320 CDI with less than 100K miles on it for a price in the high-teens. To me, that's where your value will lie for your next MB diesel car.

To find one on a nation scale; I would use cars.com and autotrader.com websites - setting up each with ALERT mode to e-mail you when new ones meeting your criteria pop-up.

Also, you can set-up an ALERT mode on Carmax.com's website for the same exact set of criteria.

These are (3) likely websites to find the used, late model MB diesel that you seek.

Skid Row Joe · #14 09-29-2010, 01:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by sixto

Thank you, JimmyL, Jr.

This guy can sell ski parkas in Cuba. He gets nasty responses to lowball offers but sometimes he gets the deal. $26K doesn't include tax and license, shipping across the country or the MB extended warranty, but it is CPO. Same car would be $32K here. No trade.

Sixto
87 300D

He got an outstanding deal - you hit it right on the head, $32K would be the best number give-or-take that model could be had for today. I know, because that is my max. target dollar for an 08 E320 Bluetec with low miles for myself.

I could learn a lot from him. Thanks for the tips, sixtwo!

landev · #15 09-30-2010, 11:07 AM

I appreciate the input all, but I'm still left with the big question... does the majority of work that a '05+ diesel need to be referred to a dealer? I'm rather envious of you who have local mechanics willing to work on your cars. Where I live most mechanics give me the big sneer when I tell them I need help with a MB.

One of the more reputable local mechanics (I've taken other vehicles to for electrical work) once made the statement: "You can buy a better car, but you can't buy a more expensive one." He kind of ruffled my feathers with that remark. Personally, I am not a brand loyalist. I will buy whatever I feel to be the best car/motorcycle/tractor I can afford, regardless of the badge on the hood. I just happen to think that the diesel MB is one of the best rides out there.

In short, the only place locally (i.e. w/in a 120 mi. radius) that has the tools and know-how to work on my MB is the dealer in Spokane, Wa. While I have had great phone dealings with James in the parts department, any other dealings (service dept. questions) were just awful. The only experience I had that was worse was with the dealership in Tacoma, WA where I stood at the parts counter for a full 10 minutes after ringing the service bell before anyone showed. I was then sneered at when I asked for a dozen frame nuts that hold the belly plastic under the car. Walking out of that dealership, steaming with my $50 handful of nuts I swore I'd never go back to another dealership.

-l-