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  #76  
Old 03-12-2012, 03:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Army View Post
More info needed - how many miles?
I never keep track of my mileage; I doubt if I put on 5,000 in one year.

I was not trying to prove anything in the thread; just trying to keep my Car on the Road.

I can only say the Car is driven mostly around town for trips no longer than 10 miles one way.
I have only twice had it on the Freeway were I spent an hour each time between 60-70 miles an hour.

(I already went back and corrercted this.)
After the U-joint was installed and the Driveshaft was already on the Car I found a source that gave info on the spacing if the Bearing Caps.

Mine are a little wider apart then they are supposed to be; but, I did not change them.
Also, the Shaft was not balanced after the work on it.
So considering those 2 items I think if they were going to cause a problem that at the very least I would have had some vibration issues even with low milage.

Also, when I was assembling the U-Joint I did not like the original Greas that came inside of the Bearings and cleaned it out and replaced it with Wheel Bearing Grease.

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  #77  
Old 03-22-2012, 02:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Diesel911 View Post
I never keep track of my mileage; I doubt if I put on 5,000 in one year.

I was not trying to prove anything in the thread; just trying to keep my Car on the Road.

I can only say the Car is driven mostly around town for trips no longer than 10 miles one way.
I have only twice had it on the Freeway were I spent an hour each time between 60-70 miles an hour.

(I already went back and corrercted this.)
After the U-joint was installed and the Driveshaft was already on the Car I found a source that gave info on the spacing if the Bearing Caps.

Mine are a little wider apart then they are supposed to be; but, I did not change them.
Also, the Shaft was not balanced after the work on it.
So considering those 2 items I think if they were going to cause a problem that at the very least I would have had some vibration issues even with low milage.

Also, when I was assembling the U-Joint I did not like the original Greas that came inside of the Bearings and cleaned it out and replaced it with Wheel Bearing Grease.
Good write up.

I have a few questions.

1) Do you think machining in a Circlip groove would cause a balance problem? It seems such a small amount and that a good machinist could get this very close.

2) What MB did you do this on. I am chasing down a vibration problem on my 88 300TE and wonder if the same joints would work?
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  #78  
Old 03-22-2012, 01:03 PM
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Originally Posted by les_garten View Post
Good write up.

I have a few questions.

1) Do you think machining in a Circlip groove would cause a balance problem? It seems such a small amount and that a good machinist could get this very close.

2) What MB did you do this on. I am chasing down a vibration problem on my 88 300TE and wonder if the same joints would work?
The MB is a 1984 300D, W123.

My thought is that I already ground off some metal; removing more Metal for a Clip increases the chance the balance will be effected.

In my case the original U-joint lasted for 28 Years. If I get 1/2 of that; 14 years I will be happy.
Also sending it to a machine shop would take it out of the DIY catagory.

I also think if you want Clips you might as well send it to one of those places (if they are still doing that) that machines the Yokes and replaces the U-joint with the re-greasable U-joint.

What is needed is a DIY way to Balance the Drive Shaft.

In one of the Threads I read that if you get the Car up to the speed where it Vibrates and Shift it into neutral and it still Vibrates it is something in the Drive Train.
If the Vibration goes away when you shift into neutral the Vibration is coming from the Engine.
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  #79  
Old 03-22-2012, 01:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Diesel911 View Post
The MB is a 1984 300D, W123.

My thought is that I already ground off some metal; removing more Metal for a Clip increases the chance the balance will be effected.

In my case the original U-joint lasted for 28 Years. If I get 1/2 of that; 14 years I will be happy.
Also sending it to a machine shop would take it out of the DIY catagory.

I also think if you want Clips you might as well send it to one of those places (if they are still doing that) that machines the Yokes and replaces the U-joint with the re-greasable U-joint.

What is needed is a DIY way to Balance the Drive Shaft.

In one of the Threads I read that if you get the Car up to the speed where it Vibrates and Shift it into neutral and it still Vibrates it is something in the Drive Train.
If the Vibration goes away when you shift into neutral the Vibration is coming from the Engine.
If I pull my cylinder head and have a machine shop clean up the valves and put in new guides that's not DIY? If I rebuild an Engine and have a machine shop bore and hone the cylinders, that's not DIY? If I pull a motor and have the crank case hot-tanked at the machine shop, that's not DIY? Have to disagree with you there. DIY, to me at least, is where I don't engage a mechanic by dropping off my car at his shop and preparing myself to be raped.

Dropping it off with the U-joints and saying cut some grooves and I need some circlips seems the way to go here. There won't be any worrying about whether your joints are centered or whether it is peened well enough.

I also can't see there being enough metal difference in the grooves to change the balance either I don't believe.

All that being observed, awesome write up. Really enjoyed this thread. Do you have any idea a year later about where to source U-joints easier than the trials you went thru?
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  #80  
Old 03-22-2012, 01:38 PM
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I think the metal removed from the groove, would be equal on all 4 sides, and the metal from the clip would offset the weight removed anyway...
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  #81  
Old 03-22-2012, 08:03 PM
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I you want grooves go for it.

I my case I did not find the spec on the Cup spacing (for the U-joint I used) until after it was installed. So mine are slighly wider than they should be.
However, I did center the spacing of the Caps. I used the Depth end of my Vernier Calipers but if I had wanted to I could have drug out my Depth Micrometers. So the Cap centering is not a hard issue to deal with.
Also I measured the Depth of the originals before I removed them.
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  #82  
Old 10-04-2012, 09:11 PM
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Originally Posted by Diesel911 View Post
The next issue was how far to drive the Bearing Caps into the U-Joint and at the same time centering them.
Below is what I did. But, I have found some new information which will be in Blue.
Both of the Yokes on mine are 3.111” wide and with the Bearing Caps slightly compressed on the U-joint I got 2.982.
3.111-2.982= 0.129 is the difference in the U-joint installed length and the width of the yoke. 0.129/2= 0.0645 I divided that in half to get the approximate depth the Bearing Caps needed to be pushed in. Since I thought I would be using a ruler to measure I picked the closest fractional measurement (1/16 = 0.0625).
New information 3/4/11:
I was able to access info that my Computer would not open on another computer and the specs for the GMB U-joint 220-7284 are a bearing cap Diameter = 0.945" and the Distance Between that Bearing Cap ends = 2.929" (I assume this is the installed length).
I installed my caps at about 2.986" Distance Between that Bearing Cap ends not the GMB spec of 2.929" Distance Between that Bearing Cap ends.
This means my Caps need to be squeezed in more.


What I figured out from my calculations is that each Bearing Cap needed to be moved in approximately 1/16”.
To accomplish this I found a 1/16” thick washer that was close to 24mm outside diameter and I tapped that washer (so it would stay put) over the Bearing Cap and squeezed the Yoke in the Vice; pushing the Bearing Cap in 1/16” further.
I repeated the same with the other Bearing Caps.

What is left is to stake in the Bearing Caps without moving them.
I will try to use a really sharp Punch and will post the pics on that tomarrow.
What ever U-joint you get you need to find out how what the Bearing Cap Spacing is for the particular U-joint you are using.
In My case I eveutually found the spacing on the internet; don't remember where.
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  #83  
Old 10-05-2012, 09:05 AM
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To be clear the spacing you list above (corrected) and the spacing you used were for the 9004100031 bearing?
It is also listed with a mercedes part number I cant recall. I think they are all the same sized joint.
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  #84  
Old 10-05-2012, 11:06 AM
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Originally Posted by rjz5400 View Post
To be clear the spacing you list above (corrected) and the spacing you used were for the 9004100031 bearing?
It is also listed with a mercedes part number I cant recall. I think they are all the same sized joint.
The corrected spacing is for the GMB 220-7284
I was able to access info that my Computer would not open on another computer and the specs for the GMB U-joint 220-7284 are a bearing cap Diameter = 0.945" and the Distance Between that Bearing Cap ends = 2.929" (I assume this is the installed length).


This is from the Benzworld Thread: "Authausaz has the U-Joint. Their part number is 900 410 00 31 (it is a made in Japan GMB U-joint part number 220-7289). This is the one I bought and used at about $18."


http://www.benzworld.org/forums/w123-e-ce-d-cd-td/1581728-another-u-joint-driveshaft-thread.html#post4677977
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Last edited by Diesel911; 10-05-2012 at 11:24 AM.
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  #85  
Old 10-12-2012, 05:10 PM
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I ordered mine from Dis count Per Formance Auto dot COM


it left yesterday a full week after i paid for it. it should be here in one business day.

I cant believe these bums at DISCOUNT PERFORMANCE AUTO...... Worst customer support, Super slow shipping time. UnBELievABLE anyway...... get what you pay for I guess.
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  #86  
Old 11-21-2012, 01:40 AM
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I know this is an old thread but I was wondering if there is an ISR U-joint from Spicer or others that will work. Inside Circlip Ring would solve the problem of centering and they do have a zerk fitting for grease. I know they are made for other European cars.
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  #87  
Old 11-21-2012, 10:16 AM
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Originally Posted by Whiskey Tango Foxtrot View Post
I know this is an old thread but I was wondering if there is an ISR U-joint from Spicer or others that will work. Inside Circlip Ring would solve the problem of centering and they do have a zerk fitting for grease. I know they are made for other European cars.
You will have to research that yourself.

I can't recall if the inner Face of the U-joint has a percision Flat area for the Snap Ring go against.
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  #88  
Old 11-24-2014, 09:08 AM
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Thanks to Diesel911 for this pioneering work. I just replaced the U-joint with the GMB from the house in Arizona and after a week of driving everything is well.

It can be done and is not that difficult

The only different thing I did was take the driveshaft to the local machine shop, and for $10 they pressed the old U-joint out. That had the advantage of de-staking the metal which made it easier to clean it up with a dremel. I asked if they would re-place and stake the new U-joint, but they would not, due to liability issues.

I also ground and lapped some washers to match the gap of the caps and used a vice pressing on the washers to press them in.

As Diesel911 said, the caps tend to move out slightly while staking with the prick punch, but taking your time and constantly measuring gives you good results.
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  #89  
Old 11-24-2014, 11:23 AM
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Originally Posted by Carpenterman View Post
Thanks to Diesel911 for this pioneering work. I just replaced the U-joint with the GMB from the house in Arizona and after a week of driving everything is well.

It can be done and is not that difficult

The only different thing I did was take the driveshaft to the local machine shop, and for $10 they pressed the old U-joint out. That had the advantage of de-staking the metal which made it easier to clean it up with a dremel. I asked if they would re-place and stake the new U-joint, but they would not, due to liability issues.

I also ground and lapped some washers to match the gap of the caps and used a vice pressing on the washers to press them in.

As Diesel911 said, the caps tend to move out slightly while staking with the prick punch, but taking your time and constantly measuring gives you good results.
In think it was a nother Forum Member did it before Me. I just tried to fill in some details and some Photos.

As you said pressing it out is a good Idea because it means you remove less metal and keeps the balance closer.

Let us know if you have any vibration issues.
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  #90  
Old 11-24-2014, 11:36 AM
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Originally Posted by rjz5400 View Post
To be clear the spacing you list above (corrected) and the spacing you used were for the 9004100031 bearing?
It is also listed with a mercedes part number I cant recall. I think they are all the same sized joint.
I don't remember the details of what I did. That is way I caution to look up the Cap Spacing. Most of the U-joint companies have Charts with specs. Once you have the U-joint you have a Number from that Company to look up.
The Spacing was for the U-joint that I used wich is somwhere in the Thread.

There is no Mercedes Part Number for the U-joint on the W123s. What I did was took the Info from a previous thread where the guy gave an Lobro(spelling?) part number and I used that to search.
From that you eventually find out that Lobro U-joint references to older Mercedes of different Chassis numbers as far back as the mid 1960s. You can get the Mercedes Part Number but of course it will be for that Chassis.
Lobro U728/4 = GKN 18725
Also some Auto Part Dealers have a place to put whatever Part number you have into and you search that and if they have it you come up with either the same part or the one they carry that is supposed to be the same.

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Last edited by Diesel911; 11-24-2014 at 11:50 AM.
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